Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire TRUTH The Vietnam War

R Strange McNamara might could have done better if not for johnson and westmoreland. the dude was boxed in. the politician on one side, the pro-war soldier on the other.

but what else could he do?

i allus blamed johnson for his wrongdoings.

i've got jaguar under contract, searching for his grave right now.

if they made a tv show out of the search it might go on for several seasons.

i know the police action billed as the dirty little war in se asia went on for several seasons.

A pro war soldier, interesting subject. Gus, where was it in RVN that you engaged in combat?


mike r

In many ways I agree with you but I have to wonder that if we’d have left Vietnam to its own devices wouldn’t it likely be “evolving” with the modern world? Did the 59,000+ lives lost precipitate their evolution or is it a compelling evolution based upon geopolitical inevitability?

That war forever changed this country’s attitudes and began our slide down the slippery slope. It was the harbinger of a new era and it illuminated the power and money that the military industrial complex wields as it made a few vultures incredibly wealthy while causing great pain and sadness for millions.

In my opinion the Vietnam War didn’t advance freedom or defeat communism. It was “fought” by politicians using American boys as their pawns. The less educated and those at the bottom of the socioeconomic strata were disproportionately murdered by politicos from DC in their reckless and callous trade of blood for money (and power). I have always had a deep respect for those that fought that war and then came home to find their country in a <seemingly> irreversible decline. That war legitimized immorality, violence and political divisions while fostering hatred and anti-patriotic rhetoric. Individually we have warriors that are still fighting battles that are 50 years distant while collectively we’re seeing even more vitriol and anti-patriotic rhetoric, rhetoric whose foundations were legitimized during the Vietnam war.

I think the only "truth" is we lost the war. The 59,000 wasted guys, not to mention those who died later or were wounded, were just that--"wasted."

We did not make Viet Nam capitalistic. If we had just adhered to the accords tht mandated an election in 1956, it probably would have become capitalistic 20 years earlier, without the war.

The failure was in policy and strategy, not the fighting men themselves. Our problem was the domino theory, something simply not true.

Why fight a communist government in Viet Nam when we were subsidizing a communist government in Yugoslavia?

Some of the policy failures that guaranteed we would lose, after the US got sick of the endless war:

1. A draft that kept boys vulnerable and uncertain for 8 years, from 18 to 26, with vulnerability increasing each year.

2. Supporting a South Vietnamese government which was corrupt and not supported by its people.

3. Letting the enemy have privileged sanctuaries, guaranteeing the initiative to the North Vietnamese.

4. Worthless search and destroy missions, worthless because we immediately gave up any gains made.

5. McNamara's emphasis on statistics, resulting in phony body counts and aircraft sorties that didn't mean anything.

6. Total misunderstanding of what the North wanted. Bombing pauses for reonsidering? Offering a Red River dam?

7. Lying to the American people, from Tonkin Gulf in 1964 to the Cambodian incursions in 1970.

The only reason we left is that Nixon decided to declare we'd won and would go home. Nixon also defused the corrupt draft system by his lottery system. He gave the South Vietnamese government a couple of years to get their act together, called "Vietnamization." They didn't get their act together. And the North had a trump card--all our prisoners. Finally Nixon started mass bombing and made them release the prisoners. Bye bye. The South Vietnamese collapsed like a deck of cards, in part because Congress refused to keep pouring money for weapons down the South Vietnamese rathole.

So what did we get? Only the knowledge that sending massive amounts of troops and air assets to "win the hearts and minds" is a waste of time, money, and lives. At least in the mid-East we are deploying assets on a far lower level. If we want to fight a real war, we should be prepared to "kill every living thing above ground," to quote General LeMay. If we're not willing to do that, don't go to war. Viet Nam was not worth doing that.

Finally I would like to honor Jane Fonda for her worthy efforts. I intend to present her with a bottle of expensive Skotch whiskey. I will present it to her, after her death, by sprinkling it on her grave. After passing it through my kidneys.

Was part of that event and saddened when we lost. My thoughts are that to truly win a war, the enemy should be mercilessly hammered until they beg us to quit. Then like Japan, occupy the country for about 2 generations to assure a reasonable government is established.

Good read and tnx..

It's been almost 50 yrs and another lifetime for many of us here since the last day we said our goodbyes to our brothers in arms we left behind ...I think all of us remember that timeline as if it were yesterday to some extent with mixed feelings of happiness and sadness for those not so fortunate however we will honor their valor till the last breath we breathe.

I have no regrets for serving even in those tumultuous times and for the most part have put it behind me although hardly a day goes by that a sight or smell doesn't trigger a memory especially since I reside so close to my last duty assignment.. Lots of SEA vets here as well so even as we grow old this precious brotherhood is not only intact but very much alive and well...

My thanks to all you here for your devotion to duty and country during the hardest of times...

Good read and tnx..

It's been almost 50 yrs and another lifetime for many of us here since the last day we said our goodbyes to our brothers in arms we left behind ...I think all of us remember that timeline as if it were yesterday to some extent with mixed feelings of happiness and sadness for those not so fortunate however we will honor their valor till the last breath we breathe.

I have no regrets for serving even in those tumultuous times and for the most part have put it behind me although hardly a day goes by that a sight or smell doesn't trigger a memory especially since I reside so close to my last duty assignment.. Lots of SEA vets here as well so even as we grow old this precious brotherhood is not only intact but very much alive and well...

My thanks to all you here for your devotion to duty and country during the hardest of times...

The sniveling cowards who refused to serve their country in the 60's and 70's took control of business, politics, education, and entertainment while the rest of us raised our hands, took an oath, and marched off to war. Then they poisoned the well of public opinion when those of us who survived returned, often crippled in body and/or mind. The children and grandchildren of those same worthless wastes of sperm have followed in their ancestors' footsteps to make this nation a sad parody of its former greatness. In the opinion of a lot of us, there are two Americas- - - -one populated by veterans and other patriots who serve our fellow citizens and work for the common good, and a huge number of the same sort of cowardly, self-absorbed scum who have no morals, or love of country. May they rot in Hell- - - - -along with the rest of their own kind!
Jerry