Home Forums Hunting & Shooting AR and Tactical Rifles The M-16

Bells, whistles, knobs, short barrels and widgets. They should'a stopped with the CAR15 and M16A1.

I have built and M16A1 (or as close as we can get) and an "almost" CAR15. That leaves 8 more in various forms. I don't have a free floated barrel yet but that is coming. They are as much fun to build as they are to shoot.

kwg

Eh, today’s M4A1s and the civilian counterparts are such better rifles than the A1s I dealt with, that it’s not even funny. The platform has gotten nothing but better and more versatile. Yes, many want to hang too much crap off a rifle, but if they really need it, they can hang exactly what they need on there without any fuss, too. More accurate/durable barrels, free floats, adjustable stocks without AK-sized butts, .....what’s not to like?

If I could only own one it would be the CAR 15

Used both in combat, little point in fixing stuff that's not broke.

2.5 years w/o a malfunction. Shot something in the range of 35-40k rounds during the first tour, and cleaned the A1 day before I turned it in. About 8" of rifling fwd of the chamber was gone. Dunno how to fix that other than changing the barrel. Fella gets to shoot that much by not using anything other than Auto on the fire select lever, doing recon by fire in Aero Scout ops and never taking his finger off the trigger until the mag was empty.

All at taxpayer expense of course.

All our colt made M4 were turned in and our maneuver bn’s, cav sqdn and artillery bn all got brand new FN made M4.. I’m sure the bsb and beb got new m4 too.

We don’t waste millions of rounds of ammo blasting in full-auto anymore. The modern optimized M4 platform with accessories is lightyears more capable than a CAR15.

^^^^Yeah.....on both counts. The FNs are mo betta than the Colts we have/had.....and they’re far more suitable for hard use, versatility, and reliability than the older, A1s.

How can they be mo betta when both are built to the same TDP?

Cuz the Colts were (apparently) built on older tooling (or?)with occasional tolerance stacking issues (all sorts of theories/debates).....some of which has cost them $ in the past, replacing masses of weapons parts. I was privy to replacements for the end users, not the $/politics/contracts. The FNs have been more accurate and less trouble prone (no mass issues I’m aware of), but that just my observations......between the two, over 10 years at SOF or line infantry units, with several years being responsible for nearly 1k M4 and M4A1s. Colt has supposedly upgraded their machinery and tooling of late, but there’s more than likely dozens of MFGs that build parts and rifles at least as good as Colt, IME. The FNs are predominant among our teams, AFAIK, for a while. They probably have their reasons, and they get to pick these days. I don’t and don’t care what it is, really. IMO, maybe Colt just rested on their name too long, while others were innovating/working to improve/modernize the platform? Not trying to say Colt’s M4s are ‘bad’ now, or that the earlier issues weren’t great, either. Just saying they’re not the top of the heap in my mind for a while.

A-2 defeated the purpose of M-16 - too long and heavy for 5.56x45.

Pound lighter and MV 400 fps faster for the -16A1....who won that race?

A-1 hands down.

XM-177

I see the new Colt SOCOM barrel touted as one of the most accurate barrels ever built for a service carbine but FN has a cold hammer forged barrel machine as does Colt Canada/Diemaco. I can see them being more accurate in a gov't profile.

I haven't seen near the Colt guns nor parts that some have but I've seen no issues and trust them. I don't see it as Colt resting on its name as much as they got beat out by a cheaper bid. Honestly with the business trouble Colt has had in the last 20 years, I'm not surprised they lost to FN. But my limited experience with Colt has been good.

I don't predict any military would go with this suggestion but the 16" mid length has such nice balance over the A1 or A2. Yes, there is some velocity loss with the 16" barrel but it's so nice to pack around. The A1 was never a problem looking for a solution other than the twist needed to be upgraded. I still believe the 1/7 twist was over kill. The 1/8 would have been the right twist with the A1 barrel.

kwg

It seems they could of put better sights or made the A1 a flattop.

I've puzzled about the faster twist/heavier bullet metrics used in the M4, mostly questioning the need. The A1 delivered nasty wounds and during my tours I never saw man or beast survive being shot with it, but readily admit they all required at least one shot. M onkies to ele and everything in between. I did transport a NVA to the hospital one day who had been seriously gnawed on by a minigun . 15 hits give or take, he was alive when we left .

So where was ele hit?