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Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: Judman] #14186693 10/08/19
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Overkill45 Offline
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Originally Posted by WTM45
Pappy nailed this down earlier in the thread.

BH209 was designed for sabot/bullet or Powerbelt shooting in .50 inlines.
It is just that simple.
Western Powders does not offer load recommendations for .45's.

Correct and clean plugs with correct dimensions, hot 209 primers and tight fitting sabots/Powerbelts and never a problem here regardless of temperatures or weather conditions.

The ease of clean up, not needing to swab between shots and the ability to leave a charge in a barrel for a LONG time makes it worth using. You just have to use it as designed by Western.




Blackhorn works fine in a 45cal. Its been proven 1000s of times just at Friendship alone. What do you think has won the majority of times at inline matches the last 5+ years?...Give ya a hint it aint sabots and it aint a 50cal.

300 BP

Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: Judman] #14186710 10/08/19
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WTM45 Offline
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I never said it did not work in .45's. Never said one HAD to use a sabot or Powerbelt.
I know it works in .40's. But those rifles are being built and shot by guys who specialize in long range muzzleloading.

Might want to re-read my post. I simply stated the facts from Western.



Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: Judman] #14186723 10/08/19
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Overkill45 Offline
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And i never said that you said it NEVER worked either skippy. laugh

Might want to re-read my post too before your panties get bunched up. crazy

Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: Idaholewis] #14189492 10/09/19
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I could actually hear it fizzling in the gun, loose grains all over the snow in front of the bench, sabot around 30-40 feet out.

Our muzzle loader season is only two weeks long at the end of December, I work weekdays, so I might hunt 4 days at most.
I did the research, not worth the cash to convert to primer only bolt and head spaced breach, and decided to try 777 loose.
Now my hunting area is in a CWD zone, and DNR lets us use any firearm season legal guns.

Last edited by JBhunter45; 10/09/19.
Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: JBhunter45] #14190994 10/09/19
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Idaholewis Offline
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Originally Posted by JBhunter45
I could actually hear it fizzling in the gun, loose grains all over the snow in front of the bench, sabot around 30-40 feet out.


Now there’s a REAL Confidence Booster Huh? Especially if you are getting ready for a Hunt, At least it was from a Bench and Not at Game. Just like When i had the 2 Bullets Pop out of my Barrel and Roll down the Rd in front of me, I was at my Shooting Bench, i actually laughed to myself 🤣 then thought WTF Just happened?? I couldn’t BELIEVE that a 209 Shotgun Primer could Go off Through a Charge of BH209 and Not set it off?? Or partially ignite, Start/Stop. BH209 is DEFINITELY NOT For me!! You Guy’s and Gals that use, and Love the Stuff can Have my Part of it 👍

I made a Prediction on another Forum awhile Back. WATCH And See There will be MORE N MORE of these BH209 Hangfire, Start n Stop Fire, Fail to Fire Threads Start Popping up in the Very NEAR future, as More n more Economical/Affordable BH209 Compatible Guns become available, The VAST Majority of new folks getting in the Sport of Muzzleloading, Along with Seasoned Folks seem to want the “Next best thing” A powder that is Less Corrosive, easier to Clean, Don’t have to Swab, Etc. Etc. Etc. Now I agree It’s Cool when these new things work, But it sure sucks when they Don’t!

I chose to Stick with Something that has Worked FOREVER in these Guns, Real Blackpowder, I can count on it Going off, In Fact i would trust my Life on it Going off, If i were to go on a Dangerous Game Hunt in Africa, or the BIG Bears of Alaska with a Muzzleloader, Swiss Real Blackpowder is what would be in my Rifle 👍

Last edited by Idaholewis; 10/09/19.

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Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: Judman] #14191973 10/10/19
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I don't know boys. I found it pretty simple to shoot. Buy the breech plug ( even though the factory plug did fine for me) load it up, use a cci 209m primer and bam! 100gr bh209, 250gr powerbelt aerolite in a $180 gun at the time. One great 100 yard 3 shot group.
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Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: JBhunter45] #14192117 10/10/19
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Overkill45 Offline
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Originally Posted by JBhunter45
I had similar partial ignition on a cold range session and I'm done with it also.
Granted my original DISC is not the ideal setup, it had worked fine in warm temps.
December 25 degrees checking zero before season, giving my uncle some loading instruction, 2" fresh snow.
I was able to follow the tracks of the skipping sabot and did find one bullet of the 5 or so misfires.
I have a feeling it was due to the temp and sabot fit of the Hornady's, maybe CCI standard 209 primers also.



Originally Posted by JBhunter45
I could actually hear it fizzling in the gun, loose grains all over the snow in front of the bench, sabot around 30-40 feet out.

Our muzzle loader season is only two weeks long at the end of December, I work weekdays, so I might hunt 4 days at most.
I did the research, not worth the cash to convert to primer only bolt and head spaced breach, and decided to try 777 loose.
Now my hunting area is in a CWD zone, and DNR lets us use any firearm season legal guns.


Well lets see
Original DISC
Standard CCI primer
SST with the easy loading red sabot?

Gee what else could you do to make it fail?...Not much. The orange DISC leak like mad. The red SST sabot is very small.

Correct breach plug is about $30 with 1 vent liner. I have several and never had a problem. If you know how to clean your DISC bolt its simple to swap the bolt housing. Takes 2 minutes. I know, ive done it. Its what i shoot when im smoking but if you like a filthy breach then enjoy that ancient orange DISC. I would rather spend less time cleaning regardless of powder. I would rather not have to buy stupid little plastic primer holders. A couple boxes of those pieces of junk are almost as much as the new plug.

Bare primer only bolt?...Wrong again. You can use the Extreme bolt or bolt housing. Then you can use red DISCs or a bare primer plug. Same bolt assembly or bolt housing works for both if you get the $30 Lehigh conversion. All you need is the Lehigh conversion and the Extreme/Elite bolt housing. Your firing pin assembly will screw right into it.

Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: Judman] #14193539 10/10/19
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As I’ve said many times before, Shoot what works for you, if YOU are Confident in a Powder that is ALL that matters. Confidence in your gear is REALLY important, especially on a Hunt, If you are not Confident in your gear, BURN IT and Switch to Something you DO have Confidence in 👍

Just Remember, BH209 is not the only Gig in Town for inline Rifles, Swiss 2F Real Blackpowder works STELLAR in them as well, as I’ve WELL proven.


“Absolutely nothing is good enough if it can be made better. And better is never good enough if it can be made best." Author Unknown
Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: Judman] #14194610 10/11/19
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JBhunter45 Offline
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Except it has never failed in warmer temps.
Not that easy anymore. I did the research two years ago, Lehigh no longer makes the breech plugs, and finding a Extreme conversion kit is almost impossible, $150+ if you can.
If I scoured Modern Muzzleloader board I might be able to source the parts, but a lot easier to switch powders.

Last edited by JBhunter45; 10/11/19.
Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: Judman] #14194743 10/11/19
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Overkill45 Offline
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Lehigh most certainly still sells the conversion kit. They quit for awhile until the Knight contract ran out.

Plug with vent liner $16.50 https://sskfirearms.lehighdefense.com/all-products?product_id=259
Adapter for the Extreme bolt $14.50 https://sskfirearms.lehighdefense.com/all-products?product_id=258

Call Knight and ask for Steven. Its $61.25 for just the Extreme bolt housing. You dont need the entire bolt. Just swap the guts. Takes 2 minutes.




Bravo

Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: Judman] #14240094 10/29/19
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Try rio primers with blackhorn . Cleanest setup i ever shot by far in my triumph. 100 grns blackhorn,rio g-600 primer with 295 powerbelt in my 21” barrel tc triumph . Shot it 10 times last week. Last group was 1” at 100 yds. Ran a dry patch theu the barrel and it was shiny. Breechplug was black but just wiped it off clean. Breechplug canal was so clean a pipe cleaner showed no black at all .

Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: srwshooter] #14241012 10/30/19
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LeonHitchcox Online Content
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Are RIO primers hot enough to ignite BH 209 in cold weather?

Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: Judman] #14241051 10/30/19
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Pappy348 Offline
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Yesterday I read a review of the new CVA .45 rifle that's similar to the Remington Ultimate. Uses rifle primers in a special holder. Their recommended load is a specially-designed 280gr Powetbelt over 140gr (by volume) of BH. No reason to futz around with anything else, according to them. Velocity is about 2200, IIRC.

Interesting, but at over 10lbs before you put a scope on it, not for me.

BTW, I never said BH can't work in .45s. They just didn't work up data for them because .50s are the overwhelming choice these days. Maybe that will change.

At present I have BH, 777, and regular Goex FF on hand, plus some Old Eynsford FF and FFF. Musket caps, 11s, and 209s. All have their uses for me depending on the rifle and projectile.


What fresh Hell is this?

Don't be a Provincial Nitwit.
Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: Pappy348] #14241674 10/30/19
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LeonHitchcox Online Content
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My cousin has a .45 caliber Encore barrel and he called Western Powders and was told that his .50 caliber loads would work. He was using 100 grains by volume.

Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: Judman] #14242223 10/30/19
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Originally Posted by Judman
Gettin ready for elk season, sounds like this is the shnizzle for loose powder? Anyone runnin it? Should I be trying something else? Thanks

As others have noted, as long as you use the right breech plug/primer combination, Blackhorn 209 is an excellent black powder substitute.


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Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: Judman] #14243108 10/30/19
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Ohio7x57 Online Content
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I used CCI 209M magnum primers in Iowa. Worked great in sub zero weather. I'll be using Blackhorn 209 until they invent something better!

Ron


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Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: Judman] #14244630 10/31/19
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Timbo Offline
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I'm also a Blackhorn fan. It's as accurate as anything else I've tried and much cleaner.

Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: LeonHitchcox] #14260154 11/06/19
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[quote=LeonHitchcox]Are RIO primers hot enough to ignite BH 209 in cold weather?[/quote
Ive never had a miss fire, hang fire of any kind

Re: Blackhorn 209?? [Re: srwshooter] #14261408 11/07/19
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Thanks.

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