Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Handguns 38 spl

With the way things are going----I just bought a 1000 pieces of 38 spl brass. I'm planning on loading them & then put them away for a rainy day. I'm thinking of 125 grain jacket HP. Is that a good choice? Both the wife & I carry --LCR & S/W airweight. I've factory Federal 125 grain HP + P in both of them. That's why I was thinking of the 125 grain HP. Got a couple 357 Rugers Security Sixes----1 is on the night stand & the other a SS is in the pickup.

Am I on the right track? Thx Bob

The 125 is going to be quicker, and should expand. The 158 flat nose is another one, not as fast but hits harder so to speak.

Personally, I like the 158-160s, as that's what shoots to the sights of my little older snubby, and I like it to shoot to the sights.

But, a 125, if going fast enough, should be equal to any 9mm 125 load out there, and apparently everyone likes a 9mm these days. Heck, even I have one. I would try to load them to at least 1150fps or more, though, if the wife can handle it.

I wouldn't just load up 1000 rounds of 38 special till you do some experimenting to find out what your gun likes and if possible, shoots to the POA. In your case add what your wife can handle as well. Personally I like what's been called the NYPD round which is a 158 grain lead SWCHP pushed enough to open up. You also want to make sure your gun likes it in the sense of length for the cylinder. I loaded up a bunch of 357 mag 170 grain SWC's recently and took 2 guns out. Security Six and 357 mag LCR. Security Six shot them very well. The cylinder was too short in the LCR and they hung out and wouldn't turn. Do some experimenting.

Yes, subbies tend to shot to a point of aim. No adjustable sights. Find out where yours is at. Most I have had or shot tend to do better with heavier lower velocity rounds. 7 yards as a minimum.

I load 150-170gr SWCs over 5gr Unique as my do all 38 load. Use it in everything from a 2” M36 to 38/44s. Does good work on everything from snakes to pigs.

More ammo is almost always a good thing...exceptions being a non-combat situation where you're the A Gunner.

Definitely check point of impact vs. point of aim with the 125 grain bullets. Had a fixed sight Ruger SP101 3" that would shoot 158 bullets at various velocities to the same POI which was right on top of the front sight but would shoot 125 grain bullets a full 14" low at 15 yards.

Yep, lighter bullets shoot lower than heavy bullets,
If sights are not adjustable, stick to the158 gr

I have been told that hollow base wadcutters were very effective when loaded with the hollow base on the top.

For what it's worth, I would start by trying to duplicate the 158 grain LSWHP +P which is what I would carry if I were carrying a .38 for SD.

Keep in mind that the OP is talking about a snub nose .38, not a 4 or 6 inch barrel. It is pointless to have a cartridge filled with more powder than will burn by the time the bullet leaves the barrel. Unless you want to impress your target with an excessive amount of flame, I guess. You are only going to get velocity from the powder that actually burns in the barrel before the bullet exits. I think it could be a challenge to get some bullets to expand properly if fired from a snub nose due to not being able to gain enough velocity. Therefore, I think a heavy bullet, such as a 158 grain SWC or a similar weight WC with a reasonable powder charge would be much more effective for a snub nose. Another factor is if you should be in a combat situation in darkness, an excessive amount of muzzle blast could impair your vision. That could be a serious problem. I have heard of some loading a WC backwards for a snub nose defensive cartridge. To me, that is an interesting concept, but I have never tried it. I don't know how the accuracy would be, but with a snub nose, you ain't gonna be doing any long range precision shooting anyhow. JMHO,YMMV.

It would be an interesting test if you had a chronograph to measure the difference in velocities with different loads being fired through different barrel lengths.

In the mid 1970s and a few times in the early80s I tried the HBWC loaded backwards. They looked cool and everyone was sure that they'd be deadly. Shot a few small to medium sized critters with them and they didn't seem any better than commercial cast 150 SWCs.

These were likely my first attempt to try and find a super bullet. The lesson learned then was that a 10 ring hit was better than an 8 ring hit. And I do shoot and believe in today's better defense bullets, but the old lessons are still true.

More powder/pressure means more velocity no matter the barrel length.

With the exception of Speer Gold Dot's "short barrel" load, most (almost all) .38 special loads, when fired from platforms like the J Frame have proven to be very inconsistent when it comes to expansion, and penetration

Due to this, the recommended practice is to shoot standard wadcutters. The standard wadcutters, not hollowbase or +p have an excellent track record for penetration. They get recommended also for the fact that they tend to shoot to the sights of most guns, and they are easy to shoot well, which is extremely important for the smaller guns, where the sharp vicious recoil or hot +p type loads tends to make people not want to practice otherwise.

Wadcutters from companies like Federal Winchester and Remington all are recommended. Wadcutters from Buffalo Bore are not, if they are going to be used in a J Frame. The additional recoil of the BB loads is not conducive to effective accuracy in a timely manner.

In your case, where you have bought 1K cases, I would pick up a few thousand 148 grain hard cast WCs and use those both in practice and in actual carry, or to put back for future use/"rainy day". Maybe load 500, and practice with 500 once you have established that a load hoots to POA/POI.

Now with that said, if you are carrying a reload for your snubby I would do the following: Carry wadcutters in the gun. Then carry a jhp or similar factory ammo for your reload. The reason is simple. Wadcutters, due to their profile are not easy to reload under stress. The rounded ogive of a typical HP makes it much more conducive to a successful reload. I keep WCs in my J Frame, and HPs on my speed strip. This is a standard practice for a number of guys I know.


148s will shoot to POA in most J Frames with a typical load.

2" barrel means less velocity, period. As in, not enough to open most hollow points reliably in 38 Spl including +P.
Heavy bullets are not your friend in short barrels.

By the way, a little thing I do for my J Frame;

I used a little chunk of AVE foam and hot glued it to the backstrap of my J Frame. Then for insurance I gave my gun a couple wraps of hockey tape. This make a huge difference both in being able to grip the gun, but also for absorbing recoil.






Years ago, when I carried this gun as a BUG on the job, I grew tired of cutting the web of my hand open practicing (I shot a lot of warm loads, as well as standard loads, and this guns literally has thousands of rounds through it.). One days while at my office I took an orange foam earplug, cut it in half and glued it on the backstrap. I took a sharpie and colored it black. It was meant to be a temporary thing but it remained that way for years and was rather effective. A number of people made comments about it, but the ones who got a chance to try it at the range, some ended up doing similar mods. The earplug foam stayed on there for a few years and a couple thousand rounds.


You can see it here:




A tiny little piece of AVE foam works even better. I glued mine on, then trimmed it to the profile of the backstrap. It makes shooting 50 rounds from the gun, much more pleasant.



Back to wadcutters, .44 caliber wadcutters are Hell on Wheels. They are not only accurate, they are are mild in the recoil department (my load is) and put a serious smackdown on whatever they hit.

I shoot these in my 38

https://www.mattsbullets.com/index....266&zenid=q1mmie0kcrc358gsilo2iai953

The situation you are in, and the bad guy/guys you face will not change, based upon what you carry. Like unwrapping a present from a stranger, you get what you get, not what you want.


After BUG quals, and the opportunity presented itself (if time allowed), I would shoot my snubby at 50 yards, both to practice proficiency, and to show a few entrenched thinkers that what they "know" as fact such as "snubby's are belly guns and not accurate past conversation distance" simply is not so.

While the majority of my snubby practice is closer, 25 yard practice has always been a regular part of the routine.

There are other guns I would rather have in my hands if I need to engage a lethal threat at extended distances, but if what I have is my J Frame, I will simply get to work, and work with the tools I have. This applies to the concept of engaging a rifle armed person when you have a handgun. Get to work.

I often read here and elsewhere how a pistol armed person has little to no chance against a person armed with a rifle. That is utter nonsense. This is not directed at Henry BTW, just a commentary on the topic in general

Below is a pic of Idaho 1945s 125 grain Maxine Mouth powder coated hollow points.. Great bullet. They shoot quite well out of both my J Frame and a Model 15. The target shot on the white piece of paper (with 6 holes) was shot at 25 yards with the 4" combat masterpiece.




@Idaho1945 is a cast bullet Master! We all know he is in a class of his own when it comes to shooting and handgun hunting, but the man also makes incredible PC bullets. He should be writing for a big publication. He has far more to offer than 99% of the people I have read in the last 20 years.

Interesting and informative thread.

Can anybody recommend a good WC bullet (for handloading) from a source that is readily available?

Also, what is AVE foam and where can you get it?

Thanks.

Paul