Home Forums Hunting & Shooting General Big Game Which 6.5CM Bullet Do You Trust....

for close shots, say you get a chance to smack a big buck around 100 yds, between these two ONLY please?

129 LRAB 2780fps @ muzzle
130 Scenar 2750 fps @muzzle

I would go with the accubond. wouldnt be my first choice but out of the two its what I would take. i trust 140 ABLR and would trust the 129 as well

I've only used Scenars in 139gr and 136gr weights, but from my use I'd have no reservations about putting one through the shoulders of a deer at that distance.

One of the virtues of the 6.5 CM (and similar 6.5 rounds like the 6.5x55, .260, etc.) is that bullets from around 130 grains up in weight start out at velocities where most cup-and-cores tend to work fine.

The animal I killed with a 6.5 CM was a New Mexico mule deer buck that yielded exactly 100 pounds of meat, which is a pretty big deer. Put a 143 ELD-X through both shoulders and the bottom of the spine at 101 yards (laser-ranged after the shot) and the buck went straight down and never moved. The bullet ended up under the hide on the far side, retaining 60% of its weight.

Back when I was shooting the 6.5x55 , I called Pat,Scenarshooter on here,to ask him about the 120 grain Scenar. He had experience with the 120 and 140 grain Scenars on a bunch of deer,antelope,and elk and ranges from far to near.

He is the guy who makes the Montana Rifle Sling,I ordered two of them and they are the best all purpose leather hunting slings that I have used.

Call Pat,order a couple of slings and ask him about 6.5 Scenars. You will be glad you did.

139 Scenar
I've killed 3 northern whitetail bucks and a doe with them under 100 yards. The only one I caught was a north/south shot in the chest.

139 Scenar
I've killed 3 northern whitetail bucks and a doe with them under 100 yards. The only one I caught was a north/south shot in the chest.

I shoot them in the neck at that distance, either bullet will work.

I have killed 2 elk with the 139gr Scenar out of my 260, it's the only bullet I load for that rifle. I would not hesitate to take deer at any range with the Scenar.

120 Barnes flattens pigs, seems perfect for the Creedmoor

Why do you post random stuff with no relation to the topic?

JG, slam dunk Scenar....

I’m shooting the 136L Scenar in my Creed, the 139 in my Swede. Creed loves the 123 Scenar, just thought I’d use a slightly heavier bullet. Hard to go wrong with a Scenar. Easy load work up.

DF

I have used the 130g Nosler Accubonds with great success in a 6.5X57. Now have a "Creedmoor" will have to see what works well. Have not used the Scenars yet.

I’m assuming you’re referring to the 139gr Scenar? Haven’t seen that they make a 130.

After seeing all Pat’s success with them when he could be shooting many other offerings with a higher BC, I queried him about them. The gist of it was that they are so easy to get to shoot and perform so well on game that they are worth the slight reduction in BC. He described them as “Deadliest hunting bullet I've ever used. And most accurate.”

I’m looking for a single bullet for both my match rifle and hunting rig and based on Pat’s experience, fully intend on giving them a try.

John

Thanks guys. I went back and re-read Pat's thread and that will be the one. I appreciate everyone's responses.

John, yes I meant 139 Scenar for my 6.5CM. Thanks.

Don't forget the 136L. It's pretty sleek, my current Creed bullet..

My Shilen barreled Creed shot this group with the 123 gr. Scenar. Posted this before. The 136L is almost as accurate and I chose it because it's slightly heavier.

Someone posted that Scenar makes load development sooooo easy. I agree.

They hold together, IME, better than VLD's. They have thin jackets like VLD's; I'm guessing the lead alloy may be harder as they don't seem to frag as bad. They kill quickly with lots of internal damage and I do see exits with chest shot WT's.

You do need to watch velocity. I chest shot a WT doe with a 90 gr. Scenar out of my .240 at mega speed. Chest soup, nasty clean up at the skinning shed. I shoot 100 gr. NPT's in that gun these days, tougher bullet and not quite as fast.

For very accurate loads and for chest shooting WT's, the Scenar is hard to beat. Scenarshooter uses them on lot bigger stuff than WT's and has an impressive portfolio of dead critters.

We like to chest shoot our deer to preserve meat. We're fortunate to have such a wide variety of fine bullets (and powders) to chose from, way better than we had back when I started reloading in the late '60's. A reloader should be able to craft the perfect load for what he's hunting, which gives the Loony something to think about, dream about...

DF

oops, my bad, disregard and my apologies

Allow me OT then. LOL.

I have not had time to do any load work. I'll be back a week after deer is open at home. Carolyn is forced to take the 257 wtby out for the first week alone.

Her Creedmoor has a shilen tube.

I was given a box of target Berger 140s. I loaded 5 but never got a chance to shoot the gun.

Anyone have any input on a load thats proven with Berger 140s and how do they work on deer, if the hunting bergers are good the target ones should be just a bit less destructive generally.

Probably going to look at barnes bullets when I have time but just curious any 140 Berger folks out there so far?

I desire caliber in, and dime or nickel max exits, obviously staying off bone with bergers if we can avoid it.

I was told by a Berger tech to use their 140 target bullet in my 26 Nosler, as the 140 Hunting's top velocity in their data was 3,200 fps. I told him I could push that bullet a LOT faster than that. That's when I learned about the 3,200 fps cap with the Hunting VLD. Instead of using the Target VLD as he suggested, I went with 120 E-Tips and 120 TTSX in that gun at 3,450 fps. Those bullets at that speed are very destructive, about the same as 140 NAB's at 3,250 fps, which my hunting bud prefers.

DF

The 129 LRAB is working great in my 6.5x55 at around 2,950 fps. No bullets recovered from the five deer so far. Longest run was about 40 yards shortest 0 yds. I am liking these a lot so far. I answered my own question on will they come apart at close range. They haven't so far but I have not put one through anything more than a couple of ribs. A hard shoulder shot I think would be messy but would put one down quick even if it didn't exit. If anything these should work even better at Creedmoor velocities.

The Scenars I haven't tried yet.

Those weren’t as accurate in my 26 Nosler. 127 LRX was more accurate, 120 TTSX and 120 E-Tip even more accurate. The latter two were about the same at the range and on critters.

DF


Edited to add, I have not tried them in the Creed or Swede. I settled on Scenars for those two, never looked back. There were some 26 Nosler shooters here on the Fire working with Scenars. After my 240 Wby experience with the 90 gr Scenar, I was concerned about too much speed. IIRC Scenarshooter shoots the 139 Scenar around 3,200 fps with good results. That may be getting close to the max for them; I don’t know. He would.

I had excellent results with the 129 LRAB on 4 bucks last year. Closest one was probably 75+/- yards. None of the bullets were stopped, closest and biggest buck was through a front shoulder and exited on the opposite side. Nice blood trails on those that had short runs, exits looked great. Also took a coyote at probably 50 yards, it didn't move. I'm using that bullet again this year.

~125 yard exit from the 129 ABLR

Looks great JCM. Thanks.

I like 140 Ballistic tips in my 26 Nosler, they do well on deer and pigs.

At CM speeds? Dang near all of them.

Agree. Unless you really stress bullets at mega velocity, most will work OK at Creed and Swede speeds.

The 26 Nosler and 6.5-300 Wby aren't as forgiving...

DF

holy fudge, tgaht should be like tossing a hand grenade in one. I thought JB said 120 BTs where tougher than the 140s at one point. But that might have been 7mm come to think of it.

Stil dont' have a use for BTs unless driven really slowly. Like well under 3000.

Never tried the 140 NBT, but the 140 NAB works very well in the 26 Nosler.

I really like a fast mono, 120 E-Tip at 3,450 fps. It’ll go 3,500, but my rifle is near half MOA at 3,450.

It’s pretty destructive on critters at that speed, about the same damage as 140 NAB at 3,250 fps, which is almost as accurate as the 120 E-Tip. 120 TTSX has identical performance with 120 E-Tip.

DF

The one your rifle likes the best.

In my 6.5 CM, I shoot Hornady Precision Hunter 143 ELDX. Incredibly accurate and deadly on game.

Reportedly the X bullet is tougher than the 140 and 147 M versions, the latter very good on WT’s.

DF

Here’s a 143 ELD X and a 147 ELD M, both out of my CM. The jugs were at 25 yards. The 143 X was 2753 start speed and the 147 averages 2775 from my gun. Both penetrated the same amount of jugs.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

143

[Linked Image]

147


[Linked Image]

I use the 147’s, but I’m just hunting deer and whatever else around here. I’m not sure I’d pick the 143 and think I’m getting a much superior bullet myself. Probably step up to something else like a Scenar or LRX.

I'd not fret the 129 LRAB a bit, and have seen nothing but good results with it, even at 2,900fps MV. A MV of 2,780 would probably stress it just a bit less. They hold together well enough for me.

Like others in the thread have said, the 143 ELD-X is showing me good things so far this year. Looks to be holding together pretty well at 2,750 but I haven't caught one yet. Damage is not excessive and is about like other makes of cup/cores at that speed, with is on par with typical 7mm-08 and .308 performance.

Another vote for the ELD-X.

I love these threads where someone asks which one of two bullets and at least half of the responses are anything but direct responses rambling all over.

JG, I loaded up some of the Scenars in my 6.5 Creedmoor, came on down to your great state and shot a very nice Axis deer. Shot him right at 100 yards. Ran a bit, but expired. Good chance when my 6.5 SAUM is done, I’ll run them in there also as my primary hunting bullet for deer, elk, etc.

May have chased a few rabbits. But, I learn stuff, even info that deviates from the straight and narrow...

When I start a thread, I don't mind some deviation for the above reason.

DF

Thanks AK. Gotta love them Axis, especially on the dinner table! Nothing better in my book. Thanks for the first hand report, as it seems to be consistent with what others have said about this 139 Scenar. I killed a few whitetail does with them last year, but nothing under 200 yds.

Johnny.... here’s a pic of a fat mule deer doe one of my boys shot with a 139 Scenar (via .260 Rem) at about 2750 fps. Shot was inside 50 yards, right through the ribs. You can see the exit in the pic, it was about the size of a quarter. Doe bolted at the shot, made it about 75 yards and piled-up. Damage to the lungs was pretty severe.

Of the two listed, I'd tend to Scenar, though I've never shot them.

We killed a Sheep, Caribou, Moose and Goat with the 143 ELDX in the this year, and I was pretty happy with the bullet performance.

Whatever bullet I shoot in my 6.5X54 M/S! Ramble, Ramble. Be Well, RZ

I saw that deer that DF blew up with a Scenar, using a .240 Weatherby I think. My experience with .30-06 using 155 Scenar has been the opposite in several cases. While his bullet I'm positive was over 3000 by a lot mine are under 2800. More than once I've ended up with little or no expansion on a sizable hog. The 6.5 LRAB in my limited experience of shooting hogs with my neighbors 6.5 Grendel has been that they are very accurate and kill very well with good expansion but not explosive by any means. I would use the Nosler if that was my only 2 choices.

I"d like to see an exit wound picture of no expansion. Those are extremely rare. Though I did have one from a 50 bmg round once.

Generally speaking almost all bullets expand some. Some more than that. Some get really ugly.

JG

I have killed 5 deer with my .260 using 129ABLR 4 Mulie and 1 whitetail. From 80 yds to 408. Mostly pass through with a lot of internal damage. The ones I recovered were text book mushrooms.

2840 velocity

I would use this bullet on anything I might shoot with the .260 or

Oops forgot about pronghorn this year...260 yds pass through. Instant dead!

Lefty

Either will work just fine. After all it's just a deer and deer are not particularly tough.

Do you have any actual experience with either one?

Either one will work.
I personally prefer the 125gr Nosler Partition.

Good luck and have fun!
Tom

127 LRX at 2800 +

Decide on a bullet yet...again...grin...

DF, I'm inclined to agree.

And since it was Mule Deer who started this thread hijack, I don't feel any worse for hopping on the bandwagon...

So... I had trouble getting the accuracy I wanted with 140 gr NP's and 142 gr LRAB's in my wife's Howa 6.5 Creedmoor in the runup to our Zimbabwe trip this past summer. Not that the accuracy was bad with the loads I was working on, it just wasn't up to what I know the rifle and ammo components were/are capable of. And since time was running short, and since factory 143 gr ELD-X's were hitting well under MOA at 100 and 200 yards, I simply bought 6 boxes of Hornady factory loads and that's what we took to Africa.

Long story short, the 143 ELD-X killed her zebra cleanly (double-lung shot) and her warthog (farther back, both lungs and liver), I was particularly impressed with the way it killed the zebra. Not a small animal, and considerably tougher than a whitetail.

Looking good from here.

One of the interesting things about the proliferation of bullets (especially in 6.5mm) over the past 20 years or so is the agony so many hunters go through in selecting The Perfect Deer Bullet--especially when by far the most popular 6.5mm round ever introduced (take a guess) produces moderate muzzle velocities, which tend to work better when just about any bullet hits deer--or other big game.

Out of curiosity I went through my hunting notes and discovered that I've used seven 6.5mm cartridges that I'd classify as "moderate" to take deer, and other deer-sized game. In order of approximate powder capacity they are the 6.5x54 Mannlicher-Schoenauer, 6.5 Creedmoor, .260 Remington, 6.5x57R, 6.5x55, 6.5-06 and 6.5 PRC.

In those rounds I've used 10 different bullets: 120-grain Barnes X-Bullet (the pre-TSX hollow-point), 120 Nosler Ballistic Tip, 125 Nosler Partition, 129 Hornady Interlock, 129 Nosler AccuBond Long Range, 140 Berger Hunting VLD, 140 Nosler Accubond and Partition, 143 Hornady ELD-X, and 160 Hornady round-nose Interlock.

Obvious some would be better for certain purposes than others, especially in terms of retained velocity and minimal wind-drift at longer ranges. But the results when they hit game were almost all totally satisfactory, with more than sufficient expansion and penetration. Some might provide more accurate than others, but among the most accurate was the discontinued 120 Barnes X, which was not known for consistent accuracy before the shank was grooved to create the TSX.

The only one I'd never choose for hunting deer again is the 160-grain Hornady Interlock round-nose, not because of the poor BC but because it proved most erratic when it hit game--and that was from the 6.5x54 Mannlicher-Schoenauer at a muzzle velocity of not quite 2200 fps. I saw it break both shoulders of one deer and exit--and another time, at about the same range, fail to reach the opposite ribs on a behind-the-shoulder lung shot. Phil Shoemaker had basically the same experience with it, so my experience wasn't an aberration. I'd happily use any of the rest of 'em again.

Another 129 ABLR exit from this morning. Should have taken the pic before dragging...sorry. ~90 yards, angled towards me, downward angle as I was in a stand, entered just behind right shoulder, exited 1/3 way down the body on off side.

Neither.

Again, excellent.

DF,

I most certainly have to agree. I’m sure I’ve saved a small fortune from the great information gained here. Of course, I’ve probably spent five times that because of that wonderful information!

You’re a wise man sir, and I value your posts.

An interesting comment from Mule Deer on the 160 grain Hornady RN. A friend loads them in his 6.5x55 rifle and swears by them. I have a box or two but haven't shot any yet. I guess they will be shot at paper, since John and Phil Shoemaker don't like their performance on game.

Only the ones with a rainbow on them. Like the 270 bullets. Be Well, Rustyzipper.

The 130 AB is my Go to, and at 100 yds, I punched thru both shoulders of an 8 pt from a 260.

The Scenars have a reputation, but might be a bit messier of a cleaning job on some shots, depending on impact speeds and placement.

The only bullets I would avoid? FMJs and probably MKHP....the Scenars I would likely prefer in open country on longer shots if using.

BR accuracy is always nice, but most good bullets in 6.5 will do MOA if not 1/2 so that's a non issue. My last 260 had the first 2 touching as I recall at 200 yds with the 130 ABs.....I called it good. My K1-A Ruger #1, out the box did 1.1" for 3 shots at that distance with a 6x42, flattened a WT at around 275 yds....I like that bullet near and far........and not much it will likely do that the old gold standard 129 SP won't....but the AB is likely a tad more accurate, and I believe has more weight retention where needed, and perhaps an edge in BC. Both proven like the 125 PT.

BC and SD is nice, but if not shooting over 400 yds I would stick to 120-130s in 6.5CM and 260 sized rounds. They have a great track record.

I, also, agree that the 130-class of bullets are a great spot for the Creed and especially the 260-due to magazine restrictions. That being said, I shoot the heavier bullets in the Creed, because they fit the magazine better, than they do in the .260 and use the 129 Interlocks in my .260s.

[quote=joshf303
Decide on a bullet yet...again...grin...[/quote]

Ha ha Joshf303, amen brother, that is me all over because of this dang forum.

Step 1: Develop load, find coal, run the bullet you have convinced yourself is THE one at a perfect speed for your needs. Shoot it sub moa and drop a dozen animals in their tracks.

Step 2: Read stuff here and talk yourself into a need for something "perfecter."

Step 3: Get your new powder \ bullet ...create step loads, head to the range and the inevitable muzzle brake guy next to you ....and begin to wonder about yourself

Step 3: Find yourself wishing you could recreate what you had in step 1.

Speaking just for me here folks -and I still love the forum btw.

I know JG will have it sorted out fine.

kenjs1,

The Confessions of a Loony, sounds like the title for an upcoming book...

I think you nailed it. BTDT all too many times, still doing it.

The Fire has saved me money regarding loads, etc. It's also cost some major bucks "having" to build or buy guns that I otherwise would have never have even considered. Probably wouldn't have known they existed...

Oh well...

Only a fellow Loony would understand; my wife's trying to catch up..

DF

Ha ha Joshf303, amen brother, that is me all over because of this dang forum.

Step 1: Develop load, find coal, run the bullet you have convinced yourself is THE one at a perfect speed for your needs. Shoot it sub moa and drop a dozen animals in their tracks.

Step 2: Read stuff here and talk yourself into a need for something "perfecter."

Step 3: Get your new powder \ bullet ...create step loads, head to the range and the inevitable muzzle brake guy next to you ....and begin to wonder about yourself

Step 3: Find yourself wishing you could recreate what you had in step 1.

Speaking just for me here folks -and I still love the forum btw.

I know JG will have it sorted out fine. [/quote]



Lol... I hear ya...
I used to be quilty of the same thing 8-9 years ago. Now ALL that’s on my bench are Lapua Scenars, Hornady ELDMs and some old school AMaxes. Probably LOTS of good reasons (dead critters) for that. I tend not to skull [bleep] things to death anymore as I know what works for me.

JG is no stranger to my bullet preferences.

NEVER having a 6.5 anything before... the fire helped me decide on a bullet for my 6.5X55
AND Mr Denton helped me find and settle on a reasonable powder charge for same.

120 NBT and Either 4350 powders @ +/- 3000 FPS and good accuracy.

THANK y’all.
Now.......la la la la la la I ain’t listening.



Jerry

Out of only 2 animals, I still felt the Hornady 129sp was a slow killer...from a .260 Remington. The 6.5/284 was like Lightning with both the Nosler 120BT and 125 Partition. I tend to lean hard on the '06 sized cases. If I had a Creedmoor, I would start with those 2 and add the Barnes 120TTSX for real penetration. I know nothing of Scenars. So, of those 2 for the OP? Nosler. I "might" use the 140 PT in the Swede, but the Barnes 120TTSX most likely. Out to 300yds and a bit beyond, I just don't see a need for anything over 120-130 in any "standard" 6.5. In a 264WM. 140s make more sense, and tougher ones at that. I can't think of anything but Barnes for the 6.5/300Wby, ha

Odd that you think that the 129 is a slow killer. I have pretty much lost track of how many deer that I have killed with that bullet in my.260s at 2950-to just over 3000 fps. I have never had any complaints with the end result. I have used them out as far as 430 yards. I have shot them on my 530-yard range and less than moa accuracy at that range. They are my go-to in my .260s and I use the heavier bullets in my Creeds.

It could have been just a "hard Lot#". I didn't clock it, but I should have been between 2800-2900...I don't think 3000fps. First was an Axis buck around 75yds, top of the shoulder, dropped him. then gave him another through the heart/lungs. took him awhile to die. His organs had pretty small permanent wound channels. Next was a Mouflon around 90yds. Tight behind shoulder, halfway up. he ran for quite a spell, not much blood. Same small organ wounds. So, that's just two examples, late 90s. By now, that bullet may have been softened up some, but who knows? "To me" I have always thought of Hornady;s as a "hard bullet", especially compared to Speer or Sierra. We used Hornadys to save meat for those East Texas critters. The Hornady 150sp was "the" bullet for 30 cals.

Yep. “The Poor Man’s Partition”

Jerry

The 123 Lapuas and Varget are what works in mine. I shoot a grain more than you in Hornady brass and 39 grains in Lapua brass made from .22-250's, just under 2900fps

That's where I ran 123s in my 6.5x47 this year. Shot 3 whitetails, all 100 yards or less, and the bullet did great. Acted about like a Barnes.

Ive only killed 4 deer and my wife 1 with a 6.5 CM but all 4 fell to a 120 grn Nosler Ballistic Tip

I don’t think there are any bad bullets anymore. You hit em right, they die. A bad shot with any bullet is a wounded animal.

My .308 likes the 150s, at just over 2900 fps. However, deer don't!

Have a fondness for the 130's in 6.5. Currently running the 130 AB in 6.5x284 and 130 Game Changer in short barreled (18") 6.5 CM

I have taken my last 5 bucks with a 130 grain Accubond from my old 6.5x55 Swede, so I would go with the Accubond, I realize your choice is the new imporoved long range version, but I don't see how they could screw it up so as not to work for your stated situation. At 100 yards either of the bullets will do the same job as far as I am concerned if delivered to the same area of the deer.