Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Winchester StaBall 6.5

JG,

In the 7-08, Hodgdon data, there is a big jump in performance with a favorite bullet of mine and yours, the NBT 120 gr.

StaBALL shoots that one at a max reported 3,201 fps, vs. the max with H-4350, 3,039 fps. That's an impressive jump.

With 140's it's 2,976 vs. 2,868, not as big a spread, but still impressive. With the 140 gr. the H-4350 load is comprssed, the StaBall load is not compressed.

So, one may postulate that if the burn rate is similar, StaBALL could be a tad denser, thus not having to compress the top 140 gr. load vs. H-4350.

I should be getting a couple of pounds in pretty soon. I'm anxious to see what it will do.

DF

Nrut,

Apparently you, like many, do not know the difference in PSI and CUP.

Also, "similar" does NOT mean "exactly the same."

A more general comment: So far there's been the typical Campfire discussion about something nobody had even seen yet, much less tried. But several people already think they know everything about it--another Campfire tradition.

The description made me think it will be something like H450, but with better temperature tolerance. I never used H450 for anything myself even though it crossed my mind a time or two, but I remember a few guys being pretty unhappy about its departure from the lineup.

I'm guilty.

I know nothing about it, have never had a can in my posession. Hopefully that's gonna change in a few days.

I am very interested, it looks good on paper. All I can do until actually trying it, is research known info and summarize current thinking.

DF

You know what happens when we assume.

I'd guess they meant burn rate, but that's a guess because Swede65 didn't tell us in what context Winchester said it's similar to H4350. Maybe it's just similar in temp sensitivity, but different burn rate? Or maybe the burn rate is the same but the temp sensitivity is different? I'm certainly not willing to assume the load data is similar. Are you? We need more info for that statement to be useful.

I said: "In the 708 with 150gr. bullets H4350 and StaBall aren't even close in max. load or vel."

I don't see where I said anything about pressure ( PSI or CUP) at all, and that wasn't the jest of my post..
Looking at the pressures now I see the H4350 is running over 50,000 CUP (51,500 CUP) which is up there..
Most CUP pressure tested loads I see in manuals are 50,000 CUP or under..
Most PSI pressure tested loads are 60,000 PSI and under with some in the 62-63 range..
The Hodgdon StaBall load for the 708/150gr bullet is under 60,000 CUP
And yes I know there is a difference between PSI and CUP..

As far as your comment: "simular" does NOT mean "exactly the same"!
I understand that, so my question to you is what was the Winchester rep meaning when he told Swed65 that "this powder will be similar to H4350" ??
So my question to you, in what way do "you" see the similarity between these two powders?
And have you talked to the Winchester rep or Hodgdon rep about StaBall?
Going by Hodgdon Data they aren't similar in vel. and grains of powder for max. loads..

Yawn.

And to think I was trying to be nice in my reply above ..

You shouldn't jest, if you're trying to be nice.

Just looked up the definition of "jest"..
For some reason I thought there was two meanings for the word "jest" depending on how it was used in a sentence ..
Apparently not..
I should have used the word "crux" instead..

Gist dude, Gist.

Similar in burn rate and where it would fall approximately on the chart. If you want more detailed information, go to the Winchester website and fill out a information request with what you want to know. The technical group/ tech got back to me in less than 24 hours.
Just ask them what you want to know.

Thank you for clarifying that about burn rate Swede. Good to know.

For the win...

I almost miss the days when if you had H4831 and H4350 you were covered for all the medium to magnum cartridges. Almost too many choices now. And the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence syndrome or the powder burns brighter phenomena and this can lead to a big inventory of powders.
Just when I was trying to cut down on components and simplify my reloading things get more complicated.

Interesting video. I wish he would have cooled and heated the gun along with the ammo, but the results were interesting.

I might have to pick up a pound or two to test out in my 7-08 and 7-08AI.

I will be trying it. Numbers look very good.

My thoughts exactly. And in theory one powder may change/adjust its temp faster vs another powder when temps swing quickly (i.e. from 32 degrees to 140 + in the chamber).