Home Forums Miscellaneous Topics Rural Living Concrete at grade creek crossing

Send Miles Patton a PM. He's more familiar with those bridges than I am. I've driven across them and they work fine. He might know how they are constructed.

I leased a place a few years ago that had a concrete crossing very similar to the one in your second photo above. It wasn't as long as what you said you would need but it was wide enough for a semi and cattle trailer to cross. It had a longer approach slope than the photo on the upstream side and a normal flow would flow about three or four feet wide and few inches deep over the center of the crossing. During a flood it was the full width of the crossing and about three feet deep at the center. Not a lot of tree debris to deal with so upstream water traveled fast. The upstream edge of the crossing was probably about 18" thicker than the rest of the slab and it had a lot of salvaged sidewalk laid in at an angle to the stream. This let the water come up and over the crossing better than a vertical slab edge to go over. I think there were about four slabs in that angle and it was about twenty feet wider than the crossing drive lane. They did the same thing going downstream to prevent the water from cutting a big hole in the creek bed when it went over the drive lane of the crossing.

I also have a fairly large headgate structure on my current place and it has stacked sidewalk slabs for the walls and approach to the headgate and a lot of rip rap downstream. It has withstood highwater for about ten years without any erosion on the stream bed either up or down. The upstream ditch bed is level with the top of the stacked slabs and has a fair bit of large rock in it as it comes to the slabs. This ditch runs about six months a year and flows a lot of water. The depth going over the headgate is about two feet most of the time and a bit higher in heavy rains.

I don't know if this crossing would get any design help from your local Federal or State farm engineering sections but here is a bit about crossings showing some design criteria for what you are talking about doing. This link covers simple crossings up to multi culvert projects resembling a bridge.

https://www.fs.fed.us/t-d/pubs/pdf/LowWaterCrossings/Lo_pdf/6_Chapter5.pdf

If it is a "stream", you will have problems with the feds putting concrete in any stream without proper permits... be careful

Yes there is that element to convolute matters. I'm going to speak with the county judge before I do anything. 10 years ago there were talks of cost sharing with the county and landowners to build a "bridge" of some sort. I couldn't get everyone on board at the time and it fell by the way side. Of course, new judge now so will start back at zero.

I have some very distant connections with folks who might be able to assist with the guidance / design. Although I have a fair idea of what will and will not work. If installed properly, I think the articulated blocks like below are the best - non permanent option and quickest to build / install. I could construct the grids a hundred yards away from the crossing on dry ground and carry them to the crossing in sections.

Anything tie those blocks together?

Yes, they're all interwoven with steel cable cast in during pouring of concrete. Each grid (say 12ft x 10ft) is tied to the next grid and so on to form one continuous mat.

I tried laying silo staves, they tipped up something awful.

I though about the WW2 airfield matts. They were all over at Fort Sill fifty years ago. [Linked Image]

Pretty much the same concept with the concrete and cable. One big grid.

Now... if you "need" a bridge for "siviculture" purposes, you can most certainly build one with out going through the ASCS office. Or, if you need to build some sort of a dam to back up water for "livestock" this is another way to get around pond permits... you just need some goats/cows/horses for a few years until they forget about it.

Problem with a concrete crossing is on downstream side as you get a flood your water is going to make a big hole dropping off the hard concrete into the loose gravel bottom. You are going to need a lot of mass in the bottom. If the stream is an intermittent stream, the Army Corp of Engineers doesn’t regulate

Just my two cents

Around this place, a lot of things are an ongoing project. Most of our culvert crossings need more dirt often.

Have you talked to NRCS, County Ag Extension Agent?

They can come out and help you find cat tails.

"Wetlands"

...….and some endangered species of salamander and shut it ALL down.

No I am talking about design.
Improperly designed and built and one will be out a bunch of money and the concrete will be downstream place.
Ask around, you can surely find someone that has successful design and installation.
Spend the money to do it right, as doing it over gets to be even more expensive.

We had a similar problem with the road into our shooting range. Talked to the county about a culvert - no way! Couldn’t get approval for concrete either. One of our members had a connection with local gravel pit...he made a call for all of the big mud rock we could get. During a dry spell we dug out a pit about 4-6 ft deep across the crick and pushed in the mud rock and put large gravel on top of that. Water occasionally flowed over top but it just washed the big gravel into the downstream side and we replaced it. Last years floods backed water up over top of the fence posts in that area but the bed rock stayed put and it took very little work to get back passable.

Good luck with a tough problem!

Years ago, I worked for the Soil Conservation Service. We built mostly "at grade" rock crossings, but did do a few precast concrete crossings.
Questions ;
How deep and wide is the perrenial stream ?
How entrenched is the stream ? How high are the streambanks from the water surface to the top of the bank?
Is the stream/creek bottom soft (sand, mud, etc) or firm (gravelly, rock, etc) ?
Answers to these questions tell me if it's workable or not.