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I'd move the 270 Win. into category 2 because of external ballistics.
So, 308 -- versus the 270, 7mm Rem. Mag. or 300 Win. Mag.

Within around 600 yards it comes down to bullet selection. Beyond that, 308 takes a back seat to the others.

Last edited by night_owl; 01/01/20.


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Originally Posted by 603Country
If you don’t reload, I’d guess the easiest ammo to find on the shelf at Bubba’s Gas Station and Feed Store will be 270, 308, and 30-06.


This is one of my top priorities with this rifle, easy access to ammunition. Don't have to seek out specialty gun or sporting goods stores. If in need and life has me running behind, I can just swing into any department store that sells sporting goods, or even Bubba's 😉

I do love the idea of reloading, getting things dialed in specifically to what I want. Just figured there would be some decent overhead involved in getting started.

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Originally Posted by OriginalUsername
Hey all. I'm looking to get into a new rifle for the next deer season. Looking for consistency from 50-250 yards(that's my hunting spot), flat and powerful but not not overly destructive. I've been going back and forth, comparing two different levels.

Category 1 - 270 or 308: Seem fairly similar, the 270 seems to edge out on most numbers, but seems I'd be just as happy with one as the other. Please share personal experience between the two of there's big defining pieces I'm missing. Would've probably had 7mm-08 in place of 308, but ammo is simply not as available around me.

Category 2 - 7mm mag or 300 mag: These are obviously a step up. My brother uses a 7mm mag, and though it seems way unnecessary, it gets the job done every time and doesn't seem to destroy the deer. I can read numbers all day, but from personal experience is there a vast difference between these two in actual performance? Or are they both in the "stupid obnoxious" realm for whitetail, and it doesn't really matter?

I'm trying to pin down the best (relative) choice in each category and then make up my mind from there. Trying not to over think it. All of these will absolutely kill a deer with good shot placement. I'm just trying to see why or if I should really lean one way or another, or just pick one and have fun.

Thanks!

Welcome to our confused and uncoordinated site of ballistic contribution.
Rule 1. (For advise only) Cartridges do not destroy meat, inadequately constructed bullets of any caliber pushed beyond their design intentions can.

Seriously, In the lower 48, there really isn't much variation in game to differentiate a cartridges value, it is really more the circumstances and terrain that creates a value for one cartridge over another. Your specified 50-250 yards is only slightly outside the normal capability of a basic .30/30 so the suggestions you have already considered meet your intended needs.

I would recommend your choice be based on whether you want to use factory ammo or dig a little deeper into hand-loading where the potential of the cartridge can be both explored and also tailored to specific animals and terrain you are likely to hunt. from your suggestions I would likely go .308 or 7mm Remington as the recoil is within a similar range with the Mag offering a little more versatility when you inevitably step up to elk sized game.


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Originally Posted by AussieGunWriter
likely go .308 or 7mm Remington as the recoil is within a similar range with the Mag offering a little more versatility when you inevitably step up to elk sized game.


I'm likely going to pull the trigger (ugh, sorry) on the .308, from the resounding suggestions I'm getting in that direction. Everyone keeps giving the same reasons, which is great: low recoil, very available, good for reloading, good off the shelf, it's just good. Very helpful thread.

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A .308 Ruger Ultralite ( way back in early 80s) kicked the snot out of me, only killed one deer with it and 150 Remington Factory load. As Aussie , I too think a 30-30 ( say a really good 3x9 scoped Marlin? is your huckleberry. I had friends use them out to 300yds on a pipeline in East, Texas! I used one for 10 yrs with irons ( but never had an opportunity past 90yds there) Most of mine were under 60yds. A 150 tight behind the shoulder and you are golden. A heavier bolt action 308 ( SPS Varmint) would be easier on recoil, especially with 150s. A .270 with 110 TTSX is very mild to shoot. I used the 7mm Mag with factory 175gr Corlokts and it was not that bad on 90# deer. But a 7mm Mag still kicks. A 300 is "going to kick" with factory loads. A .243 is another great round if you scope it right and shoot it right. Least recoiling of any listed too! Let use know what you decided on Pard, and don't apologize for your pick! smile A free American can choose what they want!

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I've come to the conclusion that with proper bullets everything 26 caliber on up will kill anything in North America. And most everything on the planet. It comes down to how far you want to shoot (or have the skills to shoot), how much recoil you want to deal with, as well as cost and availability.

With all of that in mind 308 or 7-08 are hard to beat. Either of them will kill elk at 400+ yards and that is as far as I have the skills to shoot at game. Recoil is tolerable and both have reputations for accuracy. On paper at least the 7-08 looks a little better, but the margin is razor thin and factory loads are much more common for 308 where I live too. 7-08 is near impossible to find.

Nothing wrong with the 270/30-06 class of cartridges and if a little extra recoil and a heavier rifle isn't a problem they stretch the useful range 50-100 yards farther than 308/7-08.

I've owned several 30 caliber and 7mm magnum rifles over the years. For someone with the skills to shoot well beyond 500 yards they are good tools for the job. But at the 400 yard limit I've put on myself I don't see where either the magnums, nor even the 30-06 class of cartridges offer me any advantage.

Last edited by JMR40; 01/01/20.

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Originally Posted by JMR40
I've come to the conclusion that with proper bullets everything 26 caliber on up will kill anything in North America. And most everything on the planet. It comes down to how far you want to shoot (or have the skills to shoot), how much recoil you want to deal with, as well as cost and availability.

With all of that in mind 308 or 7-08 are hard to beat. Either of them will kill elk at 400+ yards and that is as far as I have the skills to shoot at game. Recoil is tolerable and both have reputations for accuracy. On paper at least the 7-08 looks a little better, but the margin is razor thin and factory loads are much more common for 308 where I live too. 7-08 is near impossible to find.

Nothing wrong with the 270/30-06 class of cartridges and if a little extra recoil and a heavier rifle isn't a problem they stretch the useful range 50-100 yards farther than 308/7-08.

I've owned several 30 caliber and 7mm magnum rifles over the years. For someone with the skills to shoot well beyond 500 yards they are good tools for the job. But at the 400 yard limit I've put on myself I don't see where either the magnums, nor even the 30-06 class of cartridges offer me any advantage.


This is all very encouraging to hear from another person. You've pretty much put in writing what I'm reasoning with myself on, minus the 400 yard shooting. I'm not used to shooting at game that far, but I do want the ability to do it, so again that's encouraging. Same thing I've been thinking on as well with the 270/30-06 class. A very large group of hunters around this area use an 06, and live by the belief that it is THE deer rifle, haha. Good to hear some reassurance. Thanks.

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Originally Posted by OriginalUsername
Hey all. I'm looking to get into a new rifle for the next deer season. Looking for consistency from 50-250 yards(that's my hunting spot), flat and powerful but not not overly destructive. I've been going back and forth, comparing two different levels.


. . .

I'm trying to pin down the best (relative) choice in each category and then make up my mind from there. Trying not to over think it. All of these will absolutely kill a deer with good shot placement. I'm just trying to see why or if I should really lean one way or another, or just pick one and have fun.

Thanks!


I will speak only about whitetails; I have no experience with other species.

1) If all your going for is whitetail, then stick with the first category. There is very little the second will buy you.

2) Remember that most whitetail deer are taken inside 80 yards. Now that's just an average, but normally the habits and habitat of whitetails preclude a lot of long shots.

3) I generally use 300 Savage as a good starting place for whitetail. It's normal operating range matches that of whitetail hunting. Right now, I'm heavy on 30-06 rifles. I used to shoot with 35 Whelen, but after a decade I retired the Whelenizer. 35 Whelen creates a lot of sound and fury, but it did not make the deer any deader. Were I to get another rifle, I'd be looking for less recoil and probably go with 7mm-08

4) Don't expect that the 2nd class of rifles you mentioned is going to get you better results inside that 50-250 yard range. Bang/Flop and DRT are more related to bullet placement than terminal ballistics in the case of whitetails.

I used to be tasked with the "What Makes a Good Deer Rifle?" kind of article. I hadn't updated my thoughts in a few years, so I took it on myself to do so this past October:


What Makes a Good Deer Rifle


There's a trail of breadcrumbs at the bottom that will lead you to how my thoughts have changed over the years


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1. I sell more 270 win ammo than other calibers in my small shop. Buyerx are mostly subsistence hunters that hunt every chance they can get to feed their families.
2. 7mm remington mag has better long ramge ballistics. Use Schirocco(sp) or other high performance bullets.
Good luck with your choice, zMel

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I like the 7mm-08 a lot especially at the ranges you are talking. With the different websites out there, factory ammo is always available.

I also agree with most that a poorly constructed bullet or pushing a bullet faster than intended leads to destruction, hitting a heavier bone doesn't help either at times. For the ranges you are talking, a bullet going 2200-2800 fps is more than adequate and your choice in the 308 is a good one. Personally I have had a couple of 308's and liked the 165 and 180's as where I hunt, 90% of the shots are under 150 yards

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My first choices would be 6.5 Creedmoor and .25-06. Ammo available everywhere, minimal recoil and more than enough range and power.

Next two choices would be .243 Win and 7-08. The .243 will have ammo everywhere and you should easily be able to find enough 7-08 to get the job done.


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If you don't reload get a .308 or a 30-06. More load choices over the counter. I can vouch a 30-06 with a 180gr Corelokt won't tear up much meat. 165gr Corelokts in a .308 won't either.


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I hate to say it, but for deer, think about a 6.5 creedmoor. high quality affordable ammo that’s readily available seems like everywhere. Plenty of good rifle options on the market chambered 6.5. I personally favor the 260 and reload so don’t need to change. 308 is not a poor choice at all either though

I normally deer hunt with one of my 243 anymore, killed my buck at 250 yards this year using 95g nbt. Don’t see a need for much more personally

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Originally Posted by seattlesetters
My first choices would be 6.5 Creedmoor


Originally Posted by kevinJ
I hate to say it, but for deer, think about a 6.5 creedmoor.


I have considered this, and I guess I can't really come up with a good reason not to. The only two that come to mind is ammo accessibility and wanting to use this rifle for larger game (elk) in the future. But, I don't see why a 6.5 wouldn't down an elk. It's all about shot placement, right? Would there be issues with energy retention when hunting bigger game with more mass to contend with?

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Originally Posted by OriginalUsername
Originally Posted by seattlesetters
My first choices would be 6.5 Creedmoor


Originally Posted by kevinJ
I hate to say it, but for deer, think about a 6.5 creedmoor.


I have considered this, and I guess I can't really come up with a good reason not to. The only two that come to mind is ammo accessibility and wanting to use this rifle for larger game (elk) in the future. But, I don't see why a 6.5 wouldn't down an elk. It's all about shot placement, right? Would there be issues with energy retention when hunting bigger game with more mass to contend with?

Energy doesn’t kill. Bullet construction and impact velocity are the things that get it done.

A 140-class 6.5mm bullet will easily penetrate as far or farther than a 180gr 30-cal bullet with similar impact velocity, even though the “energy” numbers for the larger bullet will be higher. The sectional density of the long 6.5 bullets allows them to penetrate very deeply.

Elk are no problem at all. If you can kill one with a 180gr bullet fired from a .30-06, the same hit from a similar 143gr bullet fired from a 6.5 Creedmoor will do at least as much damage, and probably more.

Last edited by seattlesetters; 01/02/20.

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Don't over think things.

Choose a rifle you like that fits you well and get any cartridge from a 243 to a 308.

It will do what you want at the distances you stated, and if you aren't happy with it you can sell it and buy something else.

You're not going to marry it.


One shot, one kill........ It saves a lot of ammo!
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Bullets that don't come apart passing through the animal damage less meat.

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Being concerned about over the counter ammo is a no brainer. The counter today is your keyboard. Figger out which cartridge appeals to you most and buy a rifle so chambered. Order some ammo online, several boxes if it helps on shipping, and go shoot. Personally I have over the years gone from 30-30 to 30-06 to .270 Weatherby Mag and now am enamored with the 7mm-08. Wife uses same cartridge. Son started with a .260 and I've shot a few with it and also a 6.5x55. Son has also done a lot of damage with his favorite, a red pad Ruger 77 in 7x57 and another in .270.

As free advise I'd recommend the 7mm-08 even though local ammo purchase is limited. Order a few boxes of Hornady 139 gr Interlock ammo and go kill deer. You can spend more money on other brands but it won't kill any deader, deer wise, than that humble Interlock. Another favorite is the 140 Accubond. If you start to handload the 120 Barnes is wicked. For the parameters you quote the 7-08 is hard to beat.


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I don't see a reason to overthink it either. Any of the four cartridges you mentioned will take deer or elk with proper bullet construction and shot placement out to 300 yards or so. There really isn't a definitive answer to limit meat damage, as limiting meat loss is accomplished through careful shot placement and heavy for caliber bullets. Since ammo availability over the counter is important to you, I think the .308 is probably your best bet.


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Originally Posted by OriginalUsername


Category 2 - 7mm mag or 300 mag: These are obviously a step up.

Thanks!

My shoulder does not regard these two to be in the same catagory of recoil!

7 RM does not hurt with a good pad you can shoot a box from the bench and not be very sore the next day, if shooting at game you probably would not notice the difference with a 30-06. Using 160 grain bullets does not seem to damage too much meat.

If 7 RM is category 2, then 300 WSM is catagory 3 and 300 win mag is category 4 and it will beat you up from the bench, they are not fun, I would suggest to family and friends to forget about them.
Happy Hunting

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