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Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14455918 01/11/20
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Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14456494 01/11/20
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Quote
Does ones scope have the ability to dial out parallax?


Quote
No it sure doesn’t. Can that be a factor at 300 yards?


Next time out, prop up ones firearm on a stable platform, look through the scope, and move ones head side to side/up and down and check out just how much his cross hair intersection appears to move at a variety of ranges from near to the extreme horizon. Make sure ones firearm is absolutely stable during those gyrations. That perceived movement is "parallax." At some given range there will be none. Likely near and far, it will be present.

If ones technique is such that his eye is perfectly aligned with his scope's central axis for every round fired, it will never be an issue. That is not the case, however, in most instances. Especially so in contrived field positions. I even have adjustable objectives on my lowly 22 LR's that go to the squirrel fields.

Yes, it can be a significant factor when one is attempting to generate clover leafs at a variety of distances, and is one more variable that can be eliminated with good equipment allowing it to be dialed out at any given range.

It's likely the reason we hear some arguing their arms generate horrid groups at 100, and then their slugs settle down and start doing miracle clover leafs at some extended range.

If it cannot be dialed out, some of the better scope makers can set ones unit up to be parallax free at a specific range. I.e. if one is a 1000 yard competitive shooter, then have his fixed power scope assembled for that range.

It also becomes more of an issue with increases in magnification.

Have a good one,

Last edited by 1minute; 01/11/20.

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Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14457780 01/11/20
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Thanks for that info on parallelex 1minute. Gonna try that.

I played around with a ballistics calculator. With my load (chronoed at 3070 FPS), the difference in bullet drift between a 10 mph and 15 mph is nearly 3”. When I was shooting my weather ap showed a crosswind of 12 mph but it wasn’t steady. This is probably confirming my belief that I don’t need to shoot much farther than that. At least not until I can get better at this stuff, if I ever do.

But I’m intrigued at guys that can shoot at 600-700 yards+. And I know they exist. Unless it’s a dead calm day like you almost never get in the mountains, ??

Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14458077 01/12/20
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You certainly have the right mental outlook and dedication to reach your goals. I'll predict you won't have any problem. If you have a range that has longer distances to shoot, I would recommend that you practice at 400 or even 500 yards. It will make that 300 yarder a chip shot when the time comes. I use clay targets laid out on the face of the berm at longer ranges. It's great practice to learn wind holds and trajectory.

Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14458186 01/12/20
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Originally Posted by McInnis
But I’m intrigued at guys that can shoot at 600-700 yards+. And I know they exist. Unless it’s a dead calm day like you almost never get in the mountains, ??
I shoot thousands of round a year and I still get fooled by the winds at those ranges far more often than I like to admit. It doesn't matter if you have a bipod or a benchrest, you are gonna miss sometimes at those ranges.


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Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: Tyrone] #14458637 01/12/20
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Originally Posted by Tyrone
Originally Posted by McInnis
But I’m intrigued at guys that can shoot at 600-700 yards+. And I know they exist. Unless it’s a dead calm day like you almost never get in the mountains, ??
I shoot thousands of round a year and I still get fooled by the winds at those ranges far more often than I like to admit. It doesn't matter if you have a bipod or a benchrest, you are gonna miss sometimes at those ranges.

Agree , me too .
When i lived in Idaho i realised that i wasn't [by many folks definition] a longrange hunter .
I'd place two 12'' steel plates out on a hillside walk back several hundred yards pick a random spot lay down go through my ranging/wind call/dialing and miss the target . Shooting from one hilltop to another at several hundred yards windy conditions was a first round miss far more often than not .
Wyoming - good gracious - wind blows like a constant storm there sometimes for days . 300 yards on some of the ''windy days'' there would be a long shot on a game animal for me .

As others have said I think you'll do great McInnis unlike many people who've told me of their LR abilities .
I'd recommend getting some target bullets/brass/etc. and lots of shooting watching the wind and range with each shot like the shot is at a trophy animal . Walk around rangefinder rocks and do your best to hit them and see where you stand - you'll be a champ at 500-600 yards soonish .


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Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14458930 01/12/20
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Gravity is a cinch and quite predictable. Wind is a serious question mark. I'd not say I'm a long range person. Seemed popular on TV a couple years back, but gunners were walking around with team and a few lbs of electronics to call all the dope. Unfortunately, I do not, or more likely cannot, afford to get enough big gun slugs down range to have an intuitive feel for handling wind. A lot of difference between a snail's pace 45-70, a screaming 257 Weatherby, and several cartridges in between.

One of my passions, however, is spring time Belding ground squirrels, and I can do 7 or 8 thousand rounds on those in a season. That being, I'm a wind doping SOB with my 22 LR. I may miss a couple initial calls, but in short order might be holding 2 or 3 body widths off in a heavy blow and lobbing things right in there for the rest of the day. Just have a feel for wind now by paying attention to what my exposed skin senses and keeping an eye on mirage. Secondly, one never seems to be crucified here if he admits to gut shooting a rodent. When out after big game, I've never had the luxury of simply trying a few shots on trophy critters to dial things in. Did my first guided outing this past fall and established day one that if one draws blood he is done. No room for sloppy attempts in that arena.

One of my dreams is to one day score a Booner. I've had one opportunity when I was Johnny on the spot opening day of elk season with about 120 head around me. Four hundred + yds and what I'd guess was 40 mph crosswind. Figured I could maybe hit him but no idea where. Settled on a medium 6by that was about 100 yds away.

Have a good one,

Last edited by 1minute; 01/12/20.

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Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14462870 01/13/20
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"One of my dreams is to one day score a Booner. I've had one opportunity when I was Johnny on the spot opening day of elk season with about 120 head around me. Four hundred + yds and what I'd guess was 40 mph crosswind. Figured I could maybe hit him but no idea where. Settled on a medium 6by that was about 100 yds away."

MAJOR pat on the back to you, 1minute! Shows maturity and wisdom--and respect for the game.

Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14468541 01/14/20
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All the above is good. You said rifle is fairly new. Did you do barrel breakin? I know a lot poo-poo it, but my latest toy was sub moa at 200 but was widening at 600+. After 70 or so rounds it was matching sub moa at 600+.

Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14472621 01/16/20
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Assuming you 1, have a duplex reticle. 2. have a ballistics table run

1. With your 3.5-10 Leupold on 10X, the distance from the center cross to the point where the fine/bold meet is 5.4MOA.

2. With a ballistics table run on your load, You can use that known and fixed 5.4MOA number to slide windage as necessary and even for a quick holdover if you're not dialing elevation. Quick and dirty rule of thumb, assuming a 200yds zero, the duplex intersection @ 6 O-Clock when on 10X is pretty close to dead on @ 400yds.


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Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: horse1] #14483731 01/19/20
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Originally Posted by horse1
Assuming you 1, have a duplex reticle. 2. have a ballistics table run

1. With your 3.5-10 Leupold on 10X, the distance from the center cross to the point where the fine/bold meet is 5.4MOA.

2. With a ballistics table run on your load, You can use that known and fixed 5.4MOA number to slide windage as necessary and even for a quick holdover if you're not dialing elevation. Quick and dirty rule of thumb, assuming a 200yds zero, the duplex intersection @ 6 O-Clock when on 10X is pretty close to dead on @ 400yds.


Horse1,
In number 1 do you speak from experience with that model scope?
Just curious as when I called the manufacturer to try and verify the yardstick at a known difference. They could not tell me the information you just provided..


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Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14484978 01/19/20
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With a 270 and 2.5-8 on 8 is pretty spot on at 500

Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14766796 04/10/20
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Just learn windage at 200,300 and 400. Practice in windy conditions also. If you think you’ll be shooting steep angles at 3 and 400 learn cosines to be precise. Out to 200 you can hold lower when shooting up and down. Windage at 300 won’t likely be more than 7 inches for a full value 10mph wind. Even less depending on the cartridge. A simple hold off is all that’s required at that range. The key is to learn how to determine wind speed and practice in it. Of course you can just go by a Kestrel if you want. I’m like you and don’t plan to hunt much past 300. I’d rather stalk and close in on the quarry. However, I am always determining wind speed on a daily basis and checking on my Iphone how accurate I am. I watch leaves on trees,flags grass on windy days etc. I then check the weather on my phone and it will give you the wind in the area you are in.For the average non magnum small bore I figure the following for 10mph full wind as a starting reference point: 3”-200yds., 7”-300yds., 14”-400yds. 21”-500yds. Magnums are less. But you really got to verify if you want to be precise. Those are just ball park.

Last edited by Vinootz; 04/10/20. Reason: Adjust
Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14767976 04/10/20
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Lordy Lordy!


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Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: 805] #14773891 04/12/20
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Originally Posted by 805
What is your current scope? Are you shooting from a bench with bags? Bipod? Sled?
Vertical stringing can be caused by many things. Here is a good write up on it.
https://www.6mmbr.com/verticaltips.html

Good read ^^^^^

Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14774459 04/12/20
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If you have the correct equipment which involves expenditure of $$$$$$....that plus LOTS OF TRIGGER TIME will take you where you wish to go!!


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Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14775833 04/12/20
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Originally Posted by McInnis
Originally Posted by flintlocke
In those conditions, sporter weight rifle? What's the problem?


I would say I’m trying more to learn than solve a problem. If I stay within my self imposed range of about 300 yards I could hit the lungs of a deer or elk if the wind isn’t too bad. But there will be days when the wind will be a lot worse than it was here yesterday.

When the wind gets up to where its hard to deal with to me, like 20 plus, it also affects how stable of a position I can get. Even prone can get you moving some and if anything other than prone really moving.

The ability to kill to 300 in any condition should make you happy.

If you want to know how your gun really groups, wait until night, no mirage, a calm night with no wind and then shoot groups. If you are still having groups you are not happy with then you have work to do.

One of the most important things is straight ammo. Straighter the better.


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Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14776056 04/12/20
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Man,"Quigley down under" must have been an unbelievable mathematician with all the equipment in his head plus being an fantastic rifle shot.








Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14777074 04/12/20
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Very relevant.


We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
Re: Basic Questions about distance shooting [Re: McInnis] #14788000 04/15/20
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The Duplex reticle in that optic will subtend (measure) 2.6 MOA x-hair to plex post tip, about 5.2 post tip to post tip (thin opening as it's referred to in their catalog). Unfortunately Leupold's Duplex reticles were designed for rangefinding rather than establishing a simple 1-stadia ballistic reticle. Would have been much more practical to have had a 5 MOA subtension, IMO. This was one of the reasons I loved Nikon optics--they always put an even subtension in their plex reticles which is usually very good for longer range apps.

Parallax--had a 3-12X LER optic on a specialty pistol years ago and was beating my head on the bench trying to get an accurate load developed with the rig. Was sitting at the bench mulling it over and thought--hey check parallax, sure enough the parallax was as big as the gp. dialed it out and sure enough it was less than MOA. What a waste of time that was.

A buddy had a 3-12X Konus el cheapo on one of his guns with no parallax adjustment, and when we tried to zero it on his ar at 200 yds. I checked parallax and it was like 3 ft. at that distance. It didn't work very well.

Sometimes I will adjust the optics magnification to establish a second zero for a particular range I may want to shoot with a plex post tip. It's inversely proportional, i.e. suppose your 350-yd. zero is say 4 MOA-- so 2.6/4= X/10, X=6.75X. Now crank the scope to 6.75ish power and the plex post tip will be very close to the 4 MOA. Check it, and hunt with it always at that power.

Last edited by sscoyote; 04/15/20.
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