Home Forums Hunting & Shooting AR and Tactical Rifles Mossberg Shockwave or Remington ?

Looking to acquire an “other” for the camper.

Shockwave or Remington 870 TAC 14?

I like the top safety on the Mosssberg and it’s easy to modify for th Aquila short shells.

Who has either? Pluses or minuses?

I don't have either but the two things you mentioned make the Mossberg a good choice to my thinking. The Rem 870 has a better rep for quality, even with Rem's recent history of QC issues, I've been told, but with arthritis the 20 gauge might be my choice if I go down this path.

And if I were to buy a 12 the Federal or Aguila short shells would make me lean towards the Mossberg.

I don’t know anything about Mossberg’s QC, but I wouldn’t buy any new Remington 870. They’ve been terrible for years.

I've had both. Sold the Mossberg after the third time a live shot shell fell through the skeletonized elevator, jamming up the gun, in the process of racking the pump action. Then I went out and bought a Remington Tac-14. No problems with the Remington. Only drawback to the Remington is one less round in the mag, but you can get a plus one for it.

Here's what kept happening to the Mossberg:

The only thing worse than Remington QC is Mossberg QC. Since they moved almost all production to Eagle Pass, TX, everything has sucked.

I have shot the Reminton and it is easy after you get the HANG of it.

The cut down shells make it a lot easier to handle.

It took 2 shots to get where i could hit 25 yards from the hip.

Have not shot the Mossberg.

Remington. Mine works flawlessly.

Yep.

Mossberg needs to narrow the skeletonized elevator so shells cannot partially fall through and jam up the gun.

The minus' I can see at the moment is that the tac 14 seems to have become scarce lately & the Mouseburger prices are going up daily. $286 two weeks ago, now $399 at the same place.

Tac 13's & Shockwaves are being bid above retail on GB.

Good luck finding either of your choices at a reasonable price right now.

These are some really good points.

If you are already well armed, and I suspect you are, I'd be patient and see what the post Corona used market looks like. I imagine there will be a fair number of first time gun owns who put these on the market after shooting it for the first time.

I personally have two Mossberg 500's that I've owned for many years. Both have had thousands of rounds pumped through them with zero malfunctions. I think you are cursed.

I would consider a Mossberg shockwave 590 in 20Ga, or even .410 for motorhome/camper/travel use. Winchester makes the .410 ammo with Copper cutting discs and pellets that would make the .410 into a nasty close/medium range defense shotgun. All plus sides are the safety on the back of the receiver (not on the trigger guard), no adapters needed, and it would be better to handle for a wife/daughter, than a 12Ga IMHO. YMMV. -TomT

I totally agree.

And you’re right, a significant number of zombies would have to storm the castle for me to need to call for a resupply.

A quick canvas of local gun stores yielded three outright laughs, two “not even for you” and one, “seriously?”

At this point, I’m just gathering data.

I bought the 12 ga Shockwave right after they came out. Was torn on Shockwave vs Rem because I have two 870s already and I'm comfortable with the safety position. It came down to the extra round and the strap on the forend with the ability to shoot the 1 3/4 shells.

It's run perfect with anything I've fed it weather bird shot buck or slugs. Runs everything from 1 3/4 to 3 inchers although 3s tear up my hands.

When the FedEx truck shows up next week it'll get a Streamlight Shockwave forend and a SB brace.

If I can find an in stock ported Carlson barrel it will get one of those too.

I watched it happen to Hickok45. Same exact thing. Shell fell through the skeletonized elevator as he was pumping forward after pumping backward. It was only stopped by its rim from falling to the ground, jamming up his Mossberg pump shotgun. He just nonchalantly stopped what he was doing, and fidgeted with it, working it back up into the action area, then shucked it in, with little comment. He doesn't like to bad mouth the products he's shooting.

Remington was smart to use a solid elevator, lacking skeletonization.

Never seen it happen personally. Can't make mine do it and never had a customer come in with that complaint in the four years I worked in general gunsmithing full time. I suppose it's possible they've changed something in the action since then that could cause it but that seems unlikely.. There simply is not enough room in the action between the shell stop at the front of the trigger guard and the extended tab on the lifter for a 2 3/4" shell to rotate and allow the nose to fall through on either of my 500's. Two guys I work with now have shockwaves and both run perfectly. As to the 870 lifter being superior, obviously you've never seen a shell get trapped between the lifter and the bottom of the bolt when it wasn't fully seated in the magazine and clicked in ahead of the shell stop before releasing it.

One wonders if duct or Gorilla tape over the opening is a reliable and quick fix?

There is nothing to fix unless they've changed the length of the extended tab at the bottom front of the elevator or the location of the shell stop at the front of the trigger guard since either of mine were made. When I get back to work I'll try to remember to have one of the guys bring in a shockwave so I can check it out.

Blackheart, did you see the picture I posted? That's a full sized 2 and 3/4" 12 gauge shell, and I didn't stage that picture. It happened three times just from racking the action with a loaded magazine. The third time it happened, I laid it down in my gun case and took a picture of it to show my gunsmith. Same thing happened to Hickok45 while reviewing a Mossberg pump shotgun. If it were impossible, it would not have happened three times to me, and been captured once in a Hickok45 video. He was using standard 2 and 3/4" shells, too.

Did you check to see exactly how/why it was able to happen ? It's certainly not the norm or at all common for a Mossberg to do that. Was the shell stop portion of the trigger guard broken, deformed or missing ? How about the extended tab on the bottom front of the elevator ? All check out ? Did you compare parts with another Mossberg that functions correctly ? I haven't seen that particular Hickock45 video but have seen enough flubs on his other videos with various guns to know he's a boob not well versed in the operation or mechanics of many of the guns he tests.

OK I watched the Hickock45 video. I was right, the only time he had one get stuck through the elevator was a boob move on his part where he dropped one in through the ejection port NOSE DOWN. No malfunctions of the gun occurred in that video. All rounds fed through the magazine functioned perfectly as did all dropped into the ejection port horizontally. It is possible to "boob move" an 870 by getting one caught between the lifter and bolt as I described in my previous post too.

That would be operator error. Not the fault of the 870
I’ve been ruining 870 Remington’s since I was 16. That’s 44 years and I’ve never had it happen. Not once.
Like I said, my 870 Tac 14 runs flawlessly. Even with the Mini Shells.

Yep and Hickock45's boob move with the shockwave was operator error too. I've been running Mossberg 500's for 40 years and have never done it. A buddy of mine has an 870 Tac 14 and it does not run dependably with the 2" shells.

Could you post the video so I can see if it's the one I was talking about?

Look it up yourself. His son was in it and they had three shockwaves for testing.

I’ve seen the 870 malfunction BH described quite a few times. But it’s operator error.

For many years now, pump shotguns have been made with the price point market in mind. I grew up with a 37 Ithaca made in 1948. It was always flawless in function. The pump guns around, for the most part, were 50’s vintage or older’37’s and ‘12’s as well as early 870’s. Compared to those guns, the “price point “ guns from the mid to late sixties on are, by and large, junk. While the idea of a little shotgun like that has appeal, I’d much sooner go with a Beretta or Benelli automatic in that format, or even a good sxs than one of today’s pumps.

Every mass produced gun made today is built to a price point. Doesn't mean they aren't good guns and beyond a doubt there were lots of guns produced prior to 1960 that were junk. There were also without a doubt many shotguns produced pre 1960 that were less durable and dependable than many of today's price point pump guns.

I'd love to see it, but as I recall it was a full length version of the Mossberg pump gun that he was shooting when he had the same issue I had, illustrated in the image I provided in my first post here.

I don't have the time or desire to go through all of them. I watched two of Hickocks videos on the shockwave. The one previously mentioned and another where they tested a 20 gauge version. There were no malfunctions in either video. You either had a lemon or it was operator error. I've seen my share of lemons from about every manufacturer. Including Remington 870's. Mossberg pumps normally work well and continue to do so for a long time.

I was about certain that was the wrong video, and I just watched to to make sure. Yep, wrong video. The one with the three Shockwaves isn't the video where he has the same issue I had with my Shockwave. In the correct video, it was a full stocked version of a Mossberg pump shotgun.

PS No user error. I was just pumping the action to load a round into the chamber. On the forward motion, before it reached the chamber, it turned downward and the face of the shell dropped straight down while I tried to close the action on the shell rim, which was blocking closure. I then looked at the gun and saw what you see in the picture I provided.

I've had pump shotguns since I was seventeen. In fact, I had a Mossberg 500 back then. Never had a problem with it.

PPS The Mossberg 500 in question is still in the family. I sold it to my brother in law at some point, and then he sold it to his son, my nephew, who's a cop. Still works great.

Sounds like you just got a lemon. It happens sometimes. My bedside gun is a Mossberg 500 with 18.5" smooth bore slug barrel that I bought back in '97. It has been through thousands of rounds since then with no malfunctions or breakdowns of any kind. It wouldn't be my bedside gun if I didn't trust it.

Could be, but it turned me off to the Mossberg Shockwave. Happy with the Remington Tac-14.

Not saying there are no lemon 590s out there, but the Marines are not reporting this malfunction and they run the fuque out of their 590s.

good luck, my bud had the remington pump with I think magpul fore end, neither of us could hold on to the forearm with 23/4 buckshot, put a strap on forearm, broke it in 3 shots, I got the remington semi auto, was fine and fun but tried to put a flashlight on it, hit my thumb with the streamlight switch, cant remember who made it but it has to come back a way for you to reach flashlight switch, after firing twice that was enough with the flashlight, had a lot of fun blowing up beer cans, coke cans water bottles,., but sold the gun as its impractical, I guess it would be a good truck gun for daytime, no easy way I could see to put a usable light on it I can see. If its anywhere near your hand its gonna hurt. Would not touch the pump model of any variety.

This is the forend I have coming for the shockwave.

Like.

Never had that happen, but my Mossberg's extractor wouldn't grip the shell rim and would leave the empty in the chamber despite racking the action. Twice, after replacing the first extractor. The top tang safety also went tits up on me and the components of it needed to be replaced.

I went to an 870 Marine (not a TAC 14 mind you) and haven't looked back. It has worked flawlessly, though I admittedly do not shoot it much.

I love my Remington Tac 14, but like T Inman said, hard to beat a standard 870 Riot Gun.

I always replace a Mossberg safety with a steel one from Brownells before the plastic one breaks, which they are very prone to do particularly in cold weather. It's a 5 minute job and last I knew they were about 20.00. That takes care of the issue for good..Your extractor likely wouldn't grab the shell sufficiently to extract reliably because the extractor recess in the barrel wasn't cut deep enough. I've seen and corrected the same problem on lots of shotguns including 870's. If I started listing all the problems/manufacturing defects/broken parts I saw in supposedly better guns including 870's and Ithaca 37's when I was working as a general gunsmith it would take me a week and be 20 pages long. About 90% of the time when a Mossberg came in for repair it was for a broken safety button.

I hope it works for you, the pump guns in that configuration are too vigorous to control, best make the first shot a good one, let me say this "we was aiming them" up near our faces people shooting them from the hips can largely just be making noise. One wonders if one of those ar15 pistols with the braces on them would be a better idea?

Believe it or not, it's perfectly legal, and common practice, to put one of those braces on the Shockwave or Tac-14.

This.

"I went to an 870 Marine & haven't looked back"

Bud's had a bunch of those last year that were police trade ins. I picked one up that I liked the looks of the most & was in love. The plating made the gun unbelievably smooth.
How smooth? I've had 870's from the 50's, 60's 70's etc. etc. Trap models, & one 870 I own has had several thousand shells through it. The plated gun felt better.

500 plus dollars & the fact I had five 870's at home held me back, but man, those things are nice. No wonder they bring big bucks.

Nowadays those seem to be as scarce as hen's teeth.

I have them both and for what ever reason I like the strap on the Mossberg
I dont have thousands of rounds but have shot it and runs fine
My Son in Law has the 870 and shot it more that I have shot mine he is happy with it

If I ever find a fair deal on a Tac 13 semi auto I will own that

Over all I am happy with both shot bird shot00 buck and a few slugs

Hank

Only thing I have to add is I've NEVER had a smooth mossberg. Every 870 including fairly recent ones have been MUCH smoother. Not wingmaster smooth but smoother.

That said never shot these short ones and can't quite think of a need for one at the moment but tommorrow is another day. It would be a Rem if I decided FWIW. Take my chances and all.

Kind of like Douglas barrels. I've yet to have one that drove tacks so after 3 or 4 I just gave up on em.. mossberg same...

My Ithaca 37 is super smooth and positive in the pump action. Very confidence inspiring.

A Tac 13 would be fun!

No pump shotgun ever made is or was smoother than the Ithaca Model 37.

But I’m sure some Winchester Model 12 aficionados will be along shortly to disagree.

I like my 870’s. But I LOVE the Model 37 Ithaca.

"A Tac 13 would be fun"

"IF" dependable, they make more sense than either of the pumps. If a person has to cut loose with something like these, I figure they are gonna be in a lot of trouble & really busy trying so save their hide. Like defensive or evasive driving for instance. Or, running for cover while taking a family member with you & trying to shield them.

I wouldn't really want to shoot a Tac one handed but it's doable. Keeping a pump going in certain circumstances would require a lot more manipulation.

I guess "smooth" might be important for the limp wristed, weak and frail. I have several pump guns in the house including a Browning BPS, an 870, an Ithaca 37 and two Mossbergs. They're about all I've ever used my whole life. The BPS, 870 and 37 are all smoother than the 500's though the older 500 from the 60's is pretty good but it makes precisely zero difference as far as how fast I can deliver repeat fire. I am so used to using a pump that I don't even think about it and cycle the action purely instinctively. I can deliver repeat fire on target with any of them about as fast as most folks can with an auto or over and under.

The Shockwave safety with a pistol-gripped brace is not a natural combo, due to having to move one's thumb around and above the grip in order to disengage the safety.

I would go Remington, add a +1, big-head safety, maybe tinker with some better internals/springs upgrades, and be all set for adding a pistol brace when desired.

Let me know how that works out, I have a feeling its not going to produce user friendly results, but I could be wrong. Interested, yet the gun still needs a light and I can figure no safe way to put one on it.

@jimmyp,

Did you miss this post on page 4?

Do they make that for the Tac-14?

Yep. No fun at all to shoot slugs or buckshot with.

I believe I also saw them for the Remington. More lumens and about 1/3 the price of a Surefire.

Just ordered one from Optics Planet for my 870 Tac-14. Great discounted deal there, and zero shipping.

Turns the Tac-14 into a large flashlight that you can, if you choose, use to blast a hole in whatever you're lighting up, LOL.

Neither. These things are a total waste of time. Run a standard scattergun with less LOP and a short tube. These things are worthless +P

@Passport,

Based on how many you've shot?

exactly, a toy.

It would be pretty ideal if you lived in a camper where it wasn't legal to possess a handgun.

@JimmyP,

Same question.

This toy is a great Social Distancing implement. Just saying.

what’s functionally different from that to a “shotgun?”

Remington. After playing with both.

A quick tale of the tape. Maybe 4-5 inches shorter. Pistol grip on a 18 1/2 inch barrel nets you slightly shorter but still the factor of no butt stock.

Not a probemo if you want a tax stamp. Gotta be less time than time out for a suppressor and cheaper too.

Gotta say the Remington does work better with the safety with the pistol grip than the Mossy but you lose the option of the 1 3/4 shells. Game changer. 9 shots vs 4.

Screw both of them, they remind me of the Mare’s Leg.

I’ve been looking at the Kel-tec.

Let us know what you choose and how you like it.

Daveed,

I bought one of the first Shockwaves I could find and my brother did the same with the Tac-14. He visited and a huge part of our day-to-day entertainment was throwing clays and shooting both of them side by side.

Neither gun saw boxes of shells. They saw cases of shells.

At the end of the week we all (my brother, myself, and my son) agreed that the edge went to the Shockwave due to the tang safety and extra capacity. But we had no malfunctions with either one and both shot great.

Anybody that thinks they are toys either has no experience with one or can't shoot a shotgun. They are deadly accurate once you get through the slight learning curve they require.

Deflave, do you still have it and like it?

At my side as I type.

Love it.

How about the Remington V-3 Tac-13? Semiauto and reportedly reliable.

Not getting into the pissing match of what is better, Mossberg or Remington pump but I can tell you, when I started hunting at age 12 over 38 years ago, I used a used 70's vintage Mossberg 500, 20 gauge, the one that had an adjustable choke at the top of the barrel. Between shooting clays, ducks, rabbits grouse and woodcock, I would guess I put over 1000 shots through that gun and never had a malfunction.

For my 18th birthday/HS Graduation, my fathers best friend and a man I called uncle Joe gave me a Mossberg 500 20 gauge camper, had a pistol grip stock in a shoulder strapped carrying case. Being young and trying to figure out what to use it for, I shot clays, rabbits, ducks and used to bring camping for plinking and protection, 500+ rounds later, that gun still sits next to my bed for self home defence.

Mossberg 500's just seem to work and work well for me, my boys and a large number of friends. I have thought many times about a shockwave but the pistol grip just works for me and the 20 gauge then was just as effective as now. Nothing against the shockwave, I just seem to control the PG a bit better. I am also biased in my love for the Mossberg as they were made in not just my home state, my hometown, the factory a half mile away from where Marlins were made

I have fired TAC 13 and 14 fun but not practical. 13 will not cycle if held loosely, but kicks less than 14, 14 cannot hold onto slick magpul fore end if you aim it, about 200 rounds fired buck, bird and a few slugs. The 13 is a lot of fun to shoot, it’s just not a practical self defense gun. The 14 flies out of your support hand with buck.

Thanks for that info.

we even put a strap on the fore end of the tac 14, which we promptly broke with my AH buddy put a turkey load in the gun and did not tell me, the strap tore right off and it flew up out of my left hand. IF I could have discovered a reasonable way to put a light on the 13 I would have kept it, holding in front of my face and firing, I could go thru the magazine and hit with it very well, it was a mean sob. To me if I need a gun, its most likely going to be when most criminal activity takes place, at night.

Well which

Which one did you buy? Have you shot it?

I happened to be browsing sportsman’s warehouse site. I see the Mossberg makes them in 410 and 20 gauge too.

my buddy bought one from a guy who had a 20 and a 12, he was eager to sell the 12 TAC14, and having shot it extensively I know why.