Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Post C-19: production economy vs service economy

Production economy, pretty self explanatory.

Service industry: lots of money changes hands. Many low pay or min wage jobs. But nothing actually produced.

Do you think America will recover with a much stronger percentage of production jobs, and lower our dependence on foreign sourced goods?

Let us hope so but there will have to be laws enacted that prevent the entry of manufactured goods from countries that exploit labor to the extent that they use de facto slave labor. If we aren't learning the non wisdom of depending on enemies for necessities then we cannot learn. I keep wondering why we would import food from countries that are net importers of food. Like China.

One of the primary reason is called "comparative advantage". This theory was introduced by David Ricardo in the early 1800's.

Here's a short primer on it:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparative_advantage

I will have to read that later but I will read it. I understand that goods or any other inputs are going to be bought by industry at the lowest price possible. That's why we need legal barriers or tariffs to prevent slave produced goods and services from entering our country and disadvantaging our workers. Asian produced seafood is of terrible quality and I'm sure produced in sewage but their farmed fish and shell fish compete head to head with our wild caught or least reasonably clean domestic fish and shellfish. I would just imagine their vegetables are fertilized with human excrement. Those folks need all they can produce. Let them eat it. Also when I talk to someone on the phone it is about 1/2 the time an East Indian with very poor English skills. I assume they are in some squalid Indian call center struggling to understand me as I am to understand them. As to manufactured goods. They have to be produced by near slave labor with no safety regulations or injury compensation or they could not import raw materials and return finished products cheaper than we could make the same product without paying for a ship ride round trip. I believe Mr. Trump is looking at this and wonder what's in this arrangement for us.

I think America became less of a production nation for several reasons, cost of labor, lawsuits, insurance, facility costs and above all, regulations. There was a foundry in our little town that hired about twenty people. They were casting iron and steel. Environmental regulations forced them move to casting brass and bronze and eventually put them out of business. I read here on the fire one reason shoes are no longer made in this country is the glue they use has been outlawed. No more lead mining in this country. Therefore production moves to countries where they are less regulated.
Before we can become a competitive producer a lot of regulations are going to have to change.

Truth be told...I think both will grow. Sounds crazy but our service folks are finally being appreciated and our production is finally being missed

There are high grade lead/silver mines still operating in the USA. No smelters, but there are lead mines, I've worked in them and live next to some that are still operating in Idaho and there's one in Admirlity Island Alaska and there is the large Red Dog mine in Alaska. There's still a lead smelter located at Trail B.C.

Price is what drives a capitalistic economy. But national security is an important and necessary factor that has taken a back seat to profit. I think there’s gonna be a changing of priorities after C-19. It’s an eye opener.

DF

I agree with what folks are getting at here and saying that major changes, new regulations, and support of domestic production needs to take precident. The reality is that those with the ability and means to make this happen have no real interests to do so. They are fine and dandy as long as they are allow to status quo to continue.

The whole theory that America can remain strong functioning as a “service economy”, is ridiculous. Mowing lawns, shuffling papers, and providing healthcare may be hallmarks of a wealthy nation, but they don’t MAKE a nation wealthy.

You’ve got to have natural resources (we do) and a strong manufacturing sector (we’re losing it) to maintain wealth as a nation.

Politicians and businessmen looking to line their own pockets have “sold out” manufacturing in this country, screwing millions of blue collar folks out of decent paying jobs and creating millions of “wards” of the welfare state.

Would you rather pay a few dollars more for some shoes made in America, creating a good-paying American job, or “save a few bucks” (China made) to line some middle-man businessman’s pockets, and STILL have to support that American citizen (who can’t find a manufacturing job, and isn’t “college material”), who now sits on their rear, instead of working???

You're right, we gotta make stuff here..

Trump is talking about tariffs on imported oil. That would help stabilize the global oil market and get our domestic production back to where it was. Oil needs to be stabilized at around $50 a barrel, which is the price point below which our exploration dries up. We can't be held hostage to a Russia/Saudi oil war. Their dumping kills the market.

And, he should order anything having to do with national security be made domestically. For example, Beretta had to make the M9 pistol for the Army in MD, not Italy.

Antibiotics/medication are very important to our national security, as are a host of other products. Bringing off shore mfg back home has been a Trump battle cry. He won't waste this crisis.

DF

PREZACTLY !!!

I remember hearing about this "service economy" business as far back as 1980. I thought it was insane then, even though I was yet an inexperienced pup. I guess the blind squirrel found a nut that day. Or night. Not sure.

No one country should have a monopoly on any product we need. Communist countries should rot in hell not become stronger off our people and money.

While I agree, what do you do about the inevitable inflation? Will consumers go back saving a buck a Wallmart rather than buy American?