24hourcampfire.com
24hourcampfire.com
-->
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 2 of 2 1 2
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424
Campfire Sage
Offline
Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424
Originally Posted by dave284
Originally Posted by deflave


They're good in theory but when you get all levels of people using them in all levels of light conditions you'll quickly realize that there's no substitute for night sights or a good fiber optic.



You're right, they aren't a replacement for good sights. Why do so many people believe that just because you have a laser that you wont use the sights? They are just another tool that may one day or more likely, one night swing the odds in your favor. I'll take Crimson Trace Grips on any defensive handgun and hopefully I'll never need them but if I do ..... Models on a rail below the barrel, I can see some use of them for training or maybe a nightstand gun where it is incorperated with a light. On a carry gun, having to flip a switch to activate it and adding bulk to something your trying to conceal, no thanks.


Not only am I stating that they are not a replacement, I'm saying they do a piss poor job of augmenting traditional sights.

They suck. They slow shooters down. And whatever gains can be made by their use (debatable) is negated by the fact that varying light conditions can alter that at any given time.

They suck. They'll always suck.

The only utility I've ever seen from them is in conjunction with Night Vision Goggles.


Originally Posted by Geno67
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual.
Originally Posted by Judman
Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit.
Originally Posted by KSMITH
My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
GB1

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,361
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,361
I can hit things way out there with a Beretta 92 with open sights.

But I can't hit anything with a Ruger LCP open sights. With the laser it is still only 10 ounces loaded in my shirt pocket.


There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self. -Ernest Hemingway
The man who makes no mistakes does not usually make anything.-- Edward John Phelps
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 202
W
Campfire Member
Offline
Campfire Member
W
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 202
Gives the bad guy a good aiming point.

Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,641
B
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
B
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,641
Laser won’t replace practice.


Imagine a corporate oligarchy so effective, so advanced and fine tuned that its citizens still call it a democracy.



Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 4,281
G
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
G
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 4,281
Have a Crimson Trace on my Sig P938. For me, that pistol is a pocket carry for when I can't carry my EDC/1911. Figure if I have to use it, it's going to be close, fast and fatal. I always train with sights, open or RMR, but it's comforting to know the laser is their if needed.

On the other hand, my wife once tried it and even from 5 yds, she would jerk the trigger enough to miss a full size IPSC, low left, even though she could see the laser on the target a split second prior to jerking. I put my CZ75 Urban Grey Suppresosr Ready in her hands and she went back to lining up the irons and was giggling as she smacked 1/2 dozen 8" rounds over and over. for her birthday, I got her a CZ P-01 Urban Grey Suppressor Ready (aluminum framed compact) and she not only loves it but shoots it well too; with irons!

IC B2

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 11,674
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 11,674
Is close and fast the right time to look for a laser dot on the target?


Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 9,009
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 9,009
Assuming adequate light, lasers are easy and fast to point and shoot with.

I have no idea how this video ended up sideways, but it still illustrates how easy it is to put a laser on target. You just point the gun where you want to shoot, put the dot in place, and yank the trigger. It's as easy as falling off a log. (And to be clear, I am not arguing that lasers should be your first choice for sights on a defensive gun--the variable lighting conditions of the world are a deal breaker.)



Wade

"Let's Roll!" - Todd Beamer 9/11/01.
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 4,949
V
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
V
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 4,949
Exactly what lasers have been used for on my pistols, shooting around shields while looking thru a viewport. I am a huge fan of white lights (lapg.con weapon light at about $50 is a steal) but have not found a laser super useful for most pistol work.

Another great use of a laser is a training tool. Put the laser on a small object and focus on breaking the trigger without disturbing the laser. It allows one to focus strictly on the trigger press without concern about sight alignment. The drill will quickly isolate problems with the trigger press, often revealing the dreaded low left impacts.

Last edited by varmintsinc; 04/13/20. Reason: Added stuff

Hunt hard, kill clean, waste nothing and offer no apologies.

"In rifle work, group size is of some interest...but it is well to remember that a rifleman does not shoot groups, he shoots shots." Jeff Cooper

Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,816
M
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
M
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,816
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]



[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]


During daylight hours in direct sunlight, it is faster generally speaking to go directly to irons. In low light conditions, for example with a J Frame, the CT grips have proven to be superior.. Same with on a full size gun when moving quickly though a structure/building.

Since most people have a tendency to look at the active dynamic, IE what is causing them concern/scaring them. In other words, the threat, it is very normal for them to not see their front sight, (or any sights at all in real life (or force on force training). A red dot on the threat is very easy to pick up . Put the dot on the threat and pull the trigger. This is also why RDOs such as the RMR have become super popular on handguns . It is essentially the same concept. You do not have to look at your front sight. You look at the threat. put the dot on the threat, squeeze the trigger, and repeat as necessary.


THE CHAIR IS AGAINST THE WALL.

The Tikka T3 in .308 Winchester is the Glock 19 of the rifle world.

The website is up and running!

www.lostriverammocompany.com

Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 13,000
O
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
O
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 13,000
The laser on my S&W 442 made a measurable difference in how fast I was able to make 10-ring hits on a B8 target at 5 yards, weak handed. Between .35 and .50 seconds compared to my S&W 642 which does not have a laser (but does have the front sight painted bright green).

If you think a laser makes no difference, or slows you down, I recommend setting up a drill requiring you to shoot under sub-optimal conditions (weak-handed, on the ground, etc.) and then compare your times and scores with laser and without.

IC B3

Page 2 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  RickBin 

Link Copied to Clipboard
AX24

373 members (1_deuce, 204guy, 1minute, 1moredeer, 1beaver_shooter, 17CalFan, 43 invisible), 2,395 guests, and 1,115 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums81
Topics1,191,167
Posts18,465,330
Members73,925
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023


 


Fish & Game Departments | Solunar Tables | Mission Statement | Privacy Policy | Contact Us | DMCA
Hunting | Fishing | Camping | Backpacking | Reloading | Campfire Forums | Gear Shop
Copyright © 2000-2024 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved.



Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.3.33 Page Time: 0.067s Queries: 15 (0.002s) Memory: 0.8444 MB (Peak: 0.9495 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2024-04-24 04:21:33 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS