24hourcampfire.com
24hourcampfire.com
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,081
Yukoner Offline OP
Campfire Tracker
OP Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,081
Plenty of time to spare during these interesting days, so decided to reform some Winchester Super X 7mm Rem Mag to 7X61 Sharpes & Hart. Did it before, many years ago for my old Schultz and Larsen Model 54J. Decided to give a recently acquired Model 60 a whirl. I reformed, trimmed to length, and chamfered the case mouth before loading and firing the first time with loads approaching full power. No forming die was used, just resized using the regular RCBS full length sizing die.

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]


All went well at the range with 145 gr Speers starting out a tad over 3000 fps to sight in and check the rifle at different distances. Have just finished annealing after the first firing.

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]


Case capacity is very close to the Norma 7X61 Super brass I have, and the rifle has a 1:12 twist bore. This is going to be interesting.

Stay tuned ..... smile
Ted


HR IC

Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,450
C
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
C
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,450
Good Job...nice looking cases.
Do you plan to wring the rifle out a bit? Do not see, read or other wise much about the 7x61.
Keep us posted please.

Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,966
L
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
L
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,966
Originally Posted by Yukoner
Plenty of time to spare during these interesting days, so decided to reform some Winchester Super X 7mm Rem Mag to 7X61 Sharpes & Hart. Did it before, many years ago for my old Schultz and Larsen Model 54J. Decided to give a recently acquired Model 60 a whirl. I reformed, trimmed to length, and chamfered the case mouth before loading and firing the first time with loads approaching full power. No forming die was used, just resized using the regular RCBS full length sizing die.

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]


All went well at the range with 145 gr Speers starting out a tad over 3000 fps to sight in and check the rifle at different distances. Have just finished annealing after the first firing.

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]


Case capacity is very close to the Norma 7X61 Super brass I have, and the rifle has a 1:12 twist bore. This is going to be interesting.

Stay tuned ..... smile
Ted



I had a 7x61 Schultz & Larsen Model 60 with a 1 in 12" 26" barrel. It did surprisingly well with 160 grain bullets that allegedly don't shoot well in such a slow twist bore. However, my New Ultra Light Arms 7x61 has a 1 in 10" barrel, perhaps a bit more versatile. Good luck with your endeavor-

Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 17,719
W
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
W
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 17,719
Really cool caliber!! One of my mentors favorite.. Keep us posted.. Spring bear rifle??


Molon Labe
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 17,719
W
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
W
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 17,719
Really cool caliber!! One of my mentors favorite.. Keep us posted.. Spring bear rifle??


Molon Labe
IC B2

Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 10,936
D
Campfire Outfitter
Online Content
Campfire Outfitter
D
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 10,936
How many pieces of brass this round?

Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,081
Yukoner Offline OP
Campfire Tracker
OP Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,081
Originally Posted by CGPAUL
Good Job...nice looking cases.
Do you plan to wring the rifle out a bit? Do not see, read or other wise much about the 7x61.
Keep us posted please.

I think most of the rifles are in closets or collections these days. Will keep you posted on this one.

Originally Posted by lotech
I had a 7x61 Schultz & Larsen Model 60 with a 1 in 12" 26" barrel. It did surprisingly well with 160 grain bullets that allegedly don't shoot well in such a slow twist bore. However, my New Ultra Light Arms 7x61 has a 1 in 10" barrel, perhaps a bit more versatile. Good luck with your endeavor-

Thanks for the tip. I loaded one round of 150 gr Partition and one of 160 gr AccuBond to give them a try at 200 yards. Will let you know what happens after next trip to the range. What barrel length is your ULA? Interested to hear the velocities you are getting.

Originally Posted by WyoCoyoteHunter
Really cool caliber!! One of my mentors favorite.. Keep us posted.. Spring bear rifle??

Very easily could be. A few are out already. Usually try to get a nice rolly-polly this time of year; bacon, burger, chops, hams, and sausage.

Originally Posted by dye7barrel
How many pieces of brass this round?

Just made eleven for now. Some fired stuff that I had loose under the bench, all Super X that I may have picked up at the range.

Will have a few targets to show you next trip. My Model 54J was exceptionally accurate, and expect the 60 to be the same.

Ted

Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 232
B
Campfire Member
Offline
Campfire Member
B
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 232
Don’t hear much about the 7x61 anymore. I was stationed in Lethbridge, Alberta from 1971 to ‘75 and the 7x61 was very popular around there at that time. A local sporting goods store was pushing S&L and quite a few guys had them.
An old fella that I worked with had a S&L in 7x61 and swore by it. That’s the only place I’ve ever lived where I’ve encountered the 7x61.


What man, on his death bed, ever lamented, "God, I wish I had spent more time at the office."
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,081
Yukoner Offline OP
Campfire Tracker
OP Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,081
Originally Posted by Bobber257
Don’t hear much about the 7x61 anymore. I was stationed in Lethbridge, Alberta from 1971 to ‘75 and the 7x61 was very popular around there at that time. A local sporting goods store was pushing S&L and quite a few guys had them.
An old fella that I worked with had a S&L in 7x61 and swore by it. That’s the only place I’ve ever lived where I’ve encountered the 7x61.


Yes the 7mm Rem Mag quickly put the '61 in the closet for the most part. There are a few S&L rifles in 308 and 358 Norma Mag up here. Friend of mine has all three rifles.

Ted

Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,966
L
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
L
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,966
Yukoner-
My NULA has a 26" barrel. My loads with 160 grain bullets don't exceed about 2850-2875 but that can be pushed a little. I'm using a 140 TTSX BT Barnes now and load to about 3,000, but that can also be speeded up a bit. I'm more interested in accuracy. Be cautious with some of the old data.I only use H4831 and H4350 now as I've had seen very good accuracy with them and they are more temperature insensitive than many other powders. Zeros don't change in cold weather. However, Reloder 22 and N560 will give you more speed.

IC B3

Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,710
M
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
M
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,710
Do you get the dreaded donut when shoulder material is now neck?

Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 11,894
P
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
P
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 11,894
I did that for mine when i was having trouble with rims ripping off.

This rifle is built on a Mauser action.

It took a while and i tried the 7mm brass as well as 300 win.and a few pieces of 338 brass.

A friend gave me some 300 H&H brass but all i could do with them is crush,without the extra forming dies.

After getting the rim ripping/extractor thing worked out i went in search for some new brass.

The folks a Hunnington's in Calif.had what i needed and after getting over sticker shock bought a 100 pieces of brass.

What a nice way to get to shoot a rifle after trimming,neck turning and just wondering what would happen next.

My rifle seems to like all of the bullets from 120 to 168 match and it is a boring thing being able to hit the same dime spot on target.

This rifle is one made with a barrel that is 1.25 all the way and a heavy sucker.

I tried some of the older loads at first after dropping the charges a bit to start.
Even they seemed hotter,might be just newer powders.

This cartridge would be a good one in a light package.

Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 2,043
S
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
S
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 2,043
The S&H has been a family favorite for 60 years. Great cartridge, this one likes 160gr Nosler partitions and IMR4350. Doesn't get shot as much now as when my father had it built, kinda in semi-retirement. grin

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,731
S
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
S
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,731
SS336, that's a fine looking rifle. I'm sure with newer powders you could push a 160 grain NP to 3000fps without torturing the rifle or cases. And what could you not kill cleanly that combo? It would get it done near or far, good angle or bad, and the results would be the same from antelope to moose.

Last edited by super T; 04/28/20.
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,081
Yukoner Offline OP
Campfire Tracker
OP Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,081
Originally Posted by mathman
Do you get the dreaded donut when shoulder material is now neck?


Not so far. When I did this many years ago for use in my Model 54J there was never any problem either.

Ted


Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,081
Yukoner Offline OP
Campfire Tracker
OP Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,081
Thanks for the reply, lotech. Sounds like you have a real winner there.

SS336, you certainly don't have to be embarrassed carrying that outfit. Very nice indeed!

Here's a few quick test groups today at 100 meters. Crazy windy, but went anyway to continue wringing out an unknown powder more than the rifle. That's another story, but at least I know now that it's slower than 4350 and perhaps even 4831.

67 gr, 3066 fps, still using the 145 gr Speer BT
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

68 gr, 3127 fps
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

And the stability check for the 1:12 twist barrel, one shot each with 66 gr, 150 gr Partition at 3088 fps (lower print) and the 160 gr Accubond, 2978 (upper). The 160 AB is a very long bullet, and the hole shows very slight evidence of tipping. The 150 Partition is a perfectly round print.

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Scope is an ancient Leupold 2-7X28 set at 7X. smile Not a bad start for no load development.

The sophisticated targets make it pretty easy.
Ted

Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,908
K
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
K
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,908
Good shooting Ted how much less capacity than the 7 Rem Mag? thanks Kurt


kk alaska

Alaska 7 months of winter then 5 months of tourists
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,081
Yukoner Offline OP
Campfire Tracker
OP Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,081
Originally Posted by mathman
Do you get the dreaded donut when shoulder material is now neck?


Hi Mathman,

To elaborate a bit on my earlier answer, fired brass all allow a .284 bullet to slip easily into and fall through the neck, except this one.

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

I was a bit careless in initial reforming by allowing the lube, Imperial Sizing Die Wax, to get on the shoulders of a few pieces of brass. This resulted in dimpled shoulders in those cases. I have seen the same happen before a few times when reforming other cartridges that required moving the shoulder back. All the cases reformed without any lube on the shoulders formed properly.

Loaded and fired this one particular case twice to see what the consequence would be, and as expected the neck is distorted enough by the dimple that a bullet will not slide past the shoulder/neck junction. Oddly, there was very little resistance in chambering or extracting the loaded round.

Ted

Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 514
G
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
G
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 514
I bought a bunch of 308 Norma ammo and brass from an old guy down state and mixed in with it were two boxes of 7x61 super brass is that the same thing or different cartridge all together?

Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,081
Yukoner Offline OP
Campfire Tracker
OP Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,081
Same cartridge, Grumpy. The original cartridge was called the 7 x 61 Sharpes and Hart. Norma later redesigned the interior dimensions to increase the case capacity, and renamed it to Super. It has about 4 grains more volume. The original design was around 71 gr

Ted

Page 1 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  RickBin 

Link Copied to Clipboard
YB23

Who's Online Now
87 members (10gaugemag, 99Ozarks, 257robertsimp, akshooting, 14 invisible), 1,647 guests, and 746 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums81
Topics1,187,728
Posts18,400,756
Members73,822
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023


 







Fish & Game Departments | Solunar Tables | Mission Statement | Privacy Policy | Contact Us | DMCA
Hunting | Fishing | Camping | Backpacking | Reloading | Campfire Forums | Gear Shop
Copyright © 2000-2024 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.3.33 Page Time: 0.099s Queries: 15 (0.003s) Memory: 0.8992 MB (Peak: 1.0565 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2024-03-29 08:08:44 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS