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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,071
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,071 |
... rebore dads old 38-40 to ... something.
44-40? Call JES. DF
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 6,815
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 6,815 |
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Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 1,186
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 1,186 |
I've killed a ton of axis deer on a 10 acre homesite. The shot was a little downhill and we had a large fallen tree as a backstop. My Bushmaster .223 and 64 gr. Winchester Ranger ammunition always did the trick. I never had one run more than 10 yards.
The lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part!
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,207
Campfire Tracker
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OP
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,207 |
... rebore dads old 38-40 to ... something.
44-40? Call JES. DF The 38-40 is worn out. One of my cousins has it stashed away. It's an old Colt Lightning pump.
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,071
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,071 |
... rebore dads old 38-40 to ... something.
44-40? Call JES. DF The 38-40 is worn out. One of my cousins has it stashed away. It's an old Colt Lightning pump. Gotcha. Colt Lightning isn't the most robust design... So, it needs a LOT more than a new bore... DF
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,207
Campfire Tracker
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OP
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,207 |
Well, this topic has some legs.
Good news is that my lot is not flat. Slopes down behind the house to a wide stream bed, then up a small ridge on the other side, maybe 40 ft elevation gain from stream to top of ridge. I own most of the way up the side of the ridge, but the guy that has the lot along top of ridge hunts and has tree stands up close to the property line.
Downstream there is vacant private land for a little ways, a good 800 ft until any buildings. Upstream the next lot has a residence that I'd need to remember and would not be a good direction to shoot. Safest directions would be to set up to shoot towards base of ridge, or to cross over stream and set up on side of the ridge and shoot down towards the stream - if the back neighbor isn't in his tree stand shooting towards my lot! Will probably have to talk with him about that so he's aware of where I could be.
Good info from you folks that have hunted with shotgun slugs, didn't realize they could ricochet that much - now don't see any advantage to them.
The rifle I use most for deer is my .308 Kimber Montana, with 165gr Federal Fusion loads. Good setup for any size deer. Went to 165s to make sure I had exits and good blood trails, never had to track a deer more than about 30 yds so far with it. BUT, since its my main rifle, would not want to resight it for lighter bullets that I'd only want to use occasionally behind the house.
Feel kind of same about the 30-30, normally use 170s, so again don't think I want to sight it in for lighter ammo.
This is pushing me farther towards the 30-30 as is, or the .250 SAV.
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Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 15,297
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 15,297 |
I'd not worry too much about it. Even if a deer runs 50 yards, at most, 99% of the time whether from a solid lung/heart hit you'll be in great shape with any of your current rifles. If you can take out bone, so much the better, but I'll take a rifle over a slug anyday of the week as far as shorter blood trails and closer to instant deaths. Like a few have mentioned, I haven't seen anything wallop deer dead with lung hits everytime, but quick expanding bullets tend to make the trails shorter.
Semper Fi
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,863
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,863 |
I've done this on my property and have used: 55grn .223, 75grn .223, 70grn 25-20, 88grn 22 creedmoor, 115grn 257 Roberts, 150grn 30-30, 240grn .44 mag carbine, and have used a bow.
20 yard neck shots work really well.
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 74
Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 74 |
... rebore dads old 38-40 to ... something.
44-40? Call JES. DF The 38-40 is worn out. One of my cousins has it stashed away. It's an old Colt Lightning pump. Gotcha. Colt Lightning isn't the most robust design... So, it needs a LOT more than a new bore... DF Time to upgrade! ![[Linked Image from marlinowners.com]](https://www.marlinowners.com/forum/attachments/team-44-40/782379d1575846702-i-need-longer-range-12-7-2019-1-.jpg)
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 7,345
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 7,345 |
Just had this discussion with a friend. Believe I’ve found a small area where a good buck may try to find refuge when the shooting starts next November here in PA. Plan on waiting in ambush with either a M54 30 WCF or a 1895 Chilean 7x57.
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro."
Hunter S. Thompson
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 17,240
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 17,240 |
Among the 30 calibers, I'm leaning towards the 30-30 SAV 99. The terrain (and neighbors ) dictate short ranges, I trust the rifle (had it for 45 yrs), and to my ears the sound of a 30-30 doesn't carry as far as the others. 2nd choice 300SAV in Rem 700 Classic. The .308 is a great deer rifle, but just no need for it under these conditions, and it's the loudest.
Any of those would be winners in my book, and I believe the Hornady 125gr SST Lite 308 ammo might fit the bill for a quick-expanding bullet that should be less likely to exit.
Now with even more aplomb
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,232
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,232 |
Don't let anybody bullshyt you on cartridge effectiveness. I've used the .243, .30-30. .308 and .30-06 pretty extensively on deer. There isn't enough difference between them in how quick they'll put a deer on the ground to shake a stick at. Shot through the lungs with any of them you'll typically get a 30-60 yard death run. High shoulder, neck/spine or head and they'll drop right there with any of them. I haven't seen anything that will reliably drop them on the spot with lung shots and I've seen them shot with 7mm mag, .338 mag and .45-70... At the ranges you describe, pick your poison.
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Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 4,350
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 4,350 |
Whoever said "shoot from a tree stand" first has the right idea. Or at least in some way as to put dirt behind your shot. that will be good for your peace of mind as well as for your relationship with your neighbors. You might clear a couple of safe shooting lanes on your property.
I'm surprised at a maximum distance of 60 yd that no one has yet recommended a handgun.
Your .30-30 is all you need. Or your 12 gauge slug gun, But I would certainly pattern it at distance to see how accurate it/you are first.
If you're wanting to buy a new gun that rifled Savage 220 in 20ga is pretty hard to beat. I have a 2-7x variable on mine and it is very surprisingly accurate.
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Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 3,254
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 3,254 |
20-60 yards and a Modified 12 gauge choke full of 3" OO Buck will ROLL any deer you shoot at.
"If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die, I want to go where they went"
Will Rogers
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 74
Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 74 |
![[Linked Image]](https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/ubb/download/Number/130334/filename/1914 cataloge pagea.jpg) Always fun to read these old advertisements. Hard to beat the 30-06, 30-30, 44-40 and 38-40 unless you are out on the wide open plains.
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,207
Campfire Tracker
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OP
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,207 |
I'm surprised at a maximum distance of 60 yd that no one has yet recommended a handgun. I'm a LOT better shot with a rifle!
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 8,900
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 8,900 |
I'm in complete agreement with the elevated stand and 30 - 30. Perfect setup.
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,207
Campfire Tracker
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OP
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,207 |
20-60 yards and a Modified 12 gauge choke full of 3" OO Buck will ROLL any deer you shoot at. Shotgun slugs legal, any centerfire rifle or pistol cartridge legal. Buckshot not legal for deer (or bear), must fire a single projectile. So, technically, you could hunt with a .32 ACP if crazy enough, but no buckshot. Go figure.
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,373
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Nov 2005
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Bought a new house with 9 acres, mostly wooded, with a stream running thru the middle, and neighbors. I've never hunted in what I'd call "close quarters", but it would be legal, and the area has a lot of whitetail deer. Some of the neighbors hunt, some don't. Several cornfields nearby, and I've already found some old cobs around my lot. No intent to hunt behind my house a lot, I have areas for hunting.
Acknowledging the safety concerns, and state requirement of at least 500 ft from occupied building, my question revolves around rifle/caliber choice. No long-distance shooting here, think more like 20 to 60 yds. There are also some old stone fence rows that might be a ricochet hazard if I screw up.
Is it best to pick something that sound of shot doesn’t carry as much as others, or go for making sure the deer goes down fast and close? Or worry more about ricochet? On-hand choices include 250SAV, 300SAV, 30-30, .308, and could throw in 16 or 12 ga slugs if called for. I've already ruled out some others like my .223, .280 and .350 RemMag. The .350 will anchor a deer fast, but a little noisy!
My thinking so far:
Among the 30 calibers, I'm leaning towards the 30-30 SAV 99. The terrain (and neighbors ) dictate short ranges, I trust the rifle (had it for 45 yrs), and to my ears the sound of a 30-30 doesn't carry as far as the others. 2nd choice 300SAV in Rem 700 Classic. The .308 is a great deer rifle, but just no need for it under these conditions, and it's the loudest.
The 250SAV is a nice, accurate Rem 700 Classic, with a 2-7x33 scope, and should do the job, but don't see much of an advantage over the 30-30 at the ranges I'm looking at. I don't reload, so limited to the 100gr Rem or Hornady factory loads. However, there is a strong chance that it could feel like a .250 day and use it anyway.
Slugs. I've never hunted deer with slugs. Main advantage might be reduced chance of ricochets, but no experience with that. I do have an old 12 ga Ithaca Deerslayer that I picked up on a whim, but haven't even tried any slugs thru it yet. Confidence with it lower than the rifles right now, would have to spend some shooting time with it. Also have a 20 in smooth bore barrel with rifle sights for my 870 that I could work with. If I step down to 16 GA it would be an Ithaca 37 with a 26 in IC barrel, no idea how that will handle slugs, never tried it.
So anyone still with me? Opinions/thoughts? Any strong feeling about getting up to speed with slugs? Any of the centerfire rifle loads you mention would work fine. I have used all of them . I shoot a .250 Savage pretty well. Less recoil than a .243. You might find you like it. Slugs- I have used 12 and 20 gauge slugs Fosters, Brennekes and sabots on deer and one black bear. They all work extremely well. Very little wasted meat. If I need them to go down right there I aim for a shoulder. Specifically, I have a 12 gauge Ithaca Deerslayer with iron sights among my shotguns. The Deerslayer barrels are precisely choked and are very accurate for a smoothbore shotgun. 3-6 in three shot groups at 100 yards depending on how my old eyes are doing with the sights. One thing that is important with smoothbore slugs is they favor specific loads, try several. The silver box Winchester 2 3/4 in Super-X slugs have worked better than any others. Second best has been Federal Tru-Ball. I use the 12 gauge Deerslayer more to woods bum as I can take a grouse or rabbit and put down a bear if I see one. The Deerslayer choke is close to IC and pattens well.
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Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 17,817
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 17,817 |
20 or 12 ga slug, lungs and a shoulder.....keeps the trails shorter. But the ammo whops the shoulder and wallet, not just the deer. Rifle a better choice IMHO. Something that doesnt roar or smack. Am sold on the .35 rem......in a pump 
Last edited by hookeye; 05/22/20.
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