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Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14871192 05/12/20
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Everyone knows how this works. They ban scary black doohickies. Then some nut shoots someone with a pump shotgun or revolver. More bans are obviously needed.

Eventually you end up like the Brits, contemplating bans on steak knives and cricket bats or whatever they are currently fretting over.

I hope Canadians can nip this in the bud, because it will never be enough...

BP-B2

Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14874241 05/13/20
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A person has to wonder how Socks and Bill B are going to handle this. Clearly illegal but it is from one of their favorite groups of people. Saddle Lake Reserve. Errr Ummm Ahhh --- do they use those for hunting?

https://www.canadapolicereport.ca/2...rHX1XT9BNj8lxYD46XaueC0QFmhjXRW9D0HSqqMM


Last edited by HughW; 05/13/20.

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Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14874503 05/13/20
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You guys are screwed. Big Time.


"...the left considers you vermin, and they'll kill you given the chance..." Bristoe
Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: ingwe] #14875015 05/13/20
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Originally Posted by ingwe
You guys are screwed. Big Time.


It's just another bump in the road. We'll get through this, but it will take time.


Safe Shooting!
Steve Redgwell
www.303british.com

"Stay away from negative people. They have a problem for every solution." - anon
Proverbs 22:10: Cast out the scorner, and contention shall go out; yea, strife and reproach shall cease.
An Open Letter from Law Enforcement re: Gun Ban [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14903545 05/22/20
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From the CCFR website. Link here.

The text is below. A bit of a read but well written. Good to have a strong letter like this from one of the folks actually on the front line, rather than sitting behind a fancy desk in far-off Ottawa.


An Open Letter from Law Enforcement re: Gun Ban

Law enforcement colleagues,

Much has been said in recent weeks by politicians on both sides of the gun debate, by members of the public and by media pundits. Little has been said publicly by those of us who are professionally engaged and trained in the business of public safety. That business falls squarely at our feet.

Recently the government decided that they are above our parliamentary system and used an order-in-council to push through legislation rather than using parliamentary debate. The reason for this is simple, they wouldn’t have got the legislation passed without trampling over democracy in their bid to force an ideological, divisive, partisan agenda. The Liberals have clearly decided to follow the path of US politics and use division as a political tool rather than attempting to unite our country and work towards consensus and actual public safety. The confiscation program that is being put in place will be without a doubt a huge erosion of Charter rights and a terrible precedent for Canadian democracy. If this continues it sets the precedent that any party in power can enact whatever legislation they want without going through parliament.

I am a police member in a Western province in a major municipality that has its fair share of firearms related incidents. I work in a speciality team that has a number of areas of focus, one of which is dealing with gang crime which essentially means two things, drugs and guns. I own an AR15, a Glock and a pump action shotgun (along with a number of other rifles, shotguns and handguns). I choose to own these because it allows me to train to keep myself safe, the public safe and my colleagues safe. I also hunt. Training is hard to come by at work and with ongoing budget cuts it is likely to get worse, starting to take these firearms away from police officers that we use to train will make police officers and the public less safe. Privately owning firearms similar or the same as those used professionally is very common for police. It’s no different than training in the gym on your days off.

This is an open letter about being on the right side of history and doing the right things for the right reasons. That goes for both us and the government. You and I are accountable for every decision we make, every word that comes out of our mouths, every unholstering of a use of force option. We as Canadians deserve the same level of accountability from our government. If we can’t explain our actions when taking property from someone or taking away their liberty, there’s a problem. The same should be true of the government. The time for the government to stop lying and avoiding answering questions has come.

It is important to always keep in mind that governments, politicians and partisan ideologies come and go. We serve the people of Canada. We are not a tool of the minority government waiting to do its bidding, ready to trample over the Charter rights of the citizens of Canada and seize legally obtained property in the hands of innocent men and women.

History is replete with instances of good men and women doing awful things at the behest of their governments or their organization, whether it be a law enforcement agency or a military unit.

If the official opposition or the Canadian courts don’t undo this decision, police members in Canada as well as other parts of the legal system will be involved in breaching the Section 8 Charter rights of law abiding Canadian citizens when we are involved in the unlawful seizures of privately owned property. As we are all aware, it is not enough for a seizure to be authorized by law, the law must also be reasonable. As this change has been made through order-in-council by a minority government without parliamentary debate and approval I have deep concerns about it being found to be reasonable. Until the Canadian court system rules that this law is reasonable, we are putting ourselves once again in a position of being on the wrong side of history. It is entirely possible that in the coming years we will be involved in criminalizing innocent individuals, entering their homes and removing their property.

All of these actions will be carried out because a small group of people in a minority government decided that they were above our parliament and our courts.

It is the role of parliament and the courts to figure this mess out, until then I believe that we as law enforcement professionals and Canadians should give a lot of thought as to whether we want to be agents of the government or protectors of our communities.

I encourage all of you reading this who agree that the government should stop this action and focus on criminals to write a letter expressing your thoughts and send it anonymously to the CCFR. They will provide you with details of how this can be done. We need to make our voices heard. We are the professionals in public safety, we are the ones who run towards the criminals with the guns, we are the ones who must speak the truth.

Sincerely, a concerned colleague and Canadian citizen.


Canada: Everything from Eh to Zed.
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Firearms group launches charter challenge of weapons ban as Blair clarifies rules for shot [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14913752 05/26/20
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UPDATE: Today, the CCFR filed an Application in Federal Court in opposition to the recent firearm ban announced by the minority Liberal government on May 1. This ban was brought into effect by an Order in Council made by the Governor in Council amending the regulation that classifies firearms in Canada.

I have donated money for this fight. Please do the same. If you cannot afford to, please spread the message. Thanks!

https://firearmrights.ca/en/legal-action-filed-will-you-help/



The CCFR’s Application asks the Federal Court to strike down the amended regulation on the grounds that:

1. The regulation is invalid, unlawful, and outside of the scope of powers the Criminal Code could have delegated to the Governor in Council.
2. The regulation and the means by which is was created and amended is unconstitutional;
3. The regulation and its effect breaches each of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms, the Bill of Rights, and section 35 of the Constitution Act, 1982;
4. The exercise of the regulation-making power by the Governor in Council was and is irrational, and contrary to clear fact and all available evidence; and
5. Specifically, the firearms purported to be banned by this Order in Council are obviously suitable for hunting and sporting purposes in Canada, because that is exactly what we have been doing with them for decades.

Following the Order in Council, the RCMP began making amendments to the Firearms Reference Table (“FRT”), changing the classification of hundreds of firearms to “prohibited”, thereby unilaterally writing law and creating criminals out of law-abiding Canadians. Accordingly, the CCFR is asking the Court to declare that these purported “bans by FRT” are of no force or effect, both for similar reasons as applied to the regulation above, as well as the fact that the RCMP simply have no legal power to unilaterally make laws reclassifying firearms in Canada and creating criminals out of Canadians. This is especially troubling given that the RCMP aren’t even notifying the affected Canadians about these unilateral reclassifications.

Because the firearms affected by the regulation and the “bans by FRT” are in fact reasonable for use in Canada for hunting and sporting purposes, the CCFR is asking the Court for a declaration of that, and also for a consequential declaration that all of these firearms are to be deemed to be classified as non-restricted for all purposes, and therefore may be enjoyed by Canadians for both hunting and sporting purposes.

In order to protect the interests of Canadians from irreparable harm in the interim, the CCFR is also asking the Court to grant an injunction staying the effect of both the regulation and the “ban by FRT”, until these matters can be properly adjudicated.

This court action is the first in a series of actions planned by the CCFR to defend the rights, freedoms and liberty of law-abiding Canadians.


Safe Shooting!
Steve Redgwell
www.303british.com

"Stay away from negative people. They have a problem for every solution." - anon
Proverbs 22:10: Cast out the scorner, and contention shall go out; yea, strife and reproach shall cease.
Re: Firearms group launches charter challenge of weapons ban as Blair clarifies rules for shot [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14913884 05/26/20
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I got that message in my email today, too and have passed it on. I'll be making (another) donation for this.

As we all know, it has zero, nowt, zip, nada, bupkis to do with "public safety" and everything to do with ideology, and is relevant even if you don't own or have any interest in "scary, black, military-style assault rifles". If they don't get a good slap in the face on this, your grandfather's venerable Model1894 will probably eventually have to be blocked to 3 rounds and all those thousands of .303's will have to have their magazines pinned- SACRILEGE / QUEL HORREUR!


Canada: Everything from Eh to Zed.
Re: Firearms group launches charter challenge of weapons ban as Blair clarifies rules for shot [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14915503 05/27/20
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Donated today - Thanks for sharing!!

We are in for the fight of our lives here - If possible all Canadian Gun owners should join the Conservative Party of Canada and donate to them as well. They are the only party that supports private gun ownership in Canada.

I feel if this is destained to be overturned it probably will be at the political level.

Last edited by PSE; 05/27/20.
Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14917067 05/28/20
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I mailed a letter to Mr. Trudeau as follows:
Quote
re GST credit

Dear Mr. Trudeau,

Just a quick note to thank your government for the recent GST credit in the amount of $321.40. I have donated it to The Canadian Coalition for Firearms Rights, to which I have belonged for many years, to continue the fight for fair and equitable firearms legislation that is FACT AND SCIENCE-BASED (a term you may vaguely remember) and not tainted by personal political ambition, the wilful dissemination of mis/dis- information or pandering to the myopic ignorance of fringe groups.

Yours sincerely


That was about as civil as I could manage at that point.

Last edited by Stuart; 05/28/20.

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Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14917417 05/28/20
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Good morning all. Yesterday, I gave a donation to the cause. I sure hope ya'll can get this mess straightened out. We are praying for you.

Jim

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Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: texasbatman] #14917460 05/28/20
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Originally Posted by texasbatman
Good morning all. Yesterday, I gave a donation to the cause. I sure hope ya'll can get this mess straightened out. We are praying for you.

Jim


Thank you, sir. That is bove and beyond the call of duty, as they say smile


Canada: Everything from Eh to Zed.
Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14917536 05/28/20
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Now this is chilling. An article by Lorne Gunter in the Toronto Sun, Liberals goot themselves in the foot

The article is quoted in full below, but here's the shocking part:

Quote
...Ed Burlew, a Toronto-area lawyer who is one the country’s foremost experts on firearms law, received a copy of an email from Kingston Liberal MP Marwan Tabbara.

In response to a constituent’s complaint about Liberal gun policy, Tabbara explained the government had chosen to confiscate hundreds of millions of dollars of personal property from law-abiding Canadians using a cabinet decree because, “We can’t get the necessary unanimous consent for introduction of a Bill on this subject and this has waited too long for action.”

Since when is there a deadline for how long you have to try democracy before you can give up and shove whatever you want into law? I guess if you’re a Liberal, it’s okay to bypass the democratic process so long as you’ve grown impatient with Parliament....




The federal gun ban, announced May 1, just gets worse and worse.

At first the confiscation covered nearly a dozen popular models of rifles and about 1,500 variations of those models.

Some 250,000 guns – maybe more – would be taken from over 100,000 legal owners.

Except they wouldn’t be taken right away. The federal Liberal government doesn’t have the money (perhaps a quarter of a billion dollars or more) to “buy back” all those guns from their (non-criminal) owners.

So current owners would be allowed to keep the newly banned guns, even to the end of their lives. They just wouldn’t be able to sell, swap, shot them or take them to a range or out hunting.

How does that make any sense? The Liberals’ justification for banning these firearms is that they are too dangerous to let civilians own them. Yet in the next breath, the Liberals turned around and let every current owner hold on to his or her “military-style” firearms for as many as 70 more years.

Then we learned the ban would be authorized by an order-in-council, not by an act of Parliament. And it would be introduced when Parliament was not really sitting due to the pandemic.

This was followed by the revelation that many larger shotguns – perhaps over a million common hunting guns – could also be banned because the Trudeau government’s decree was poorly written (or deviously written) to define which guns to confiscate according to barrel size rather than a gun’s function.

Now we are learning that the Liberals – who don’t have a majority mandate to undertake such a massive confiscation – are plotting legislation that would permit municipal governments to outlaw the possession of handguns in homes.

True, more than two-thirds of firearms crimes in Canada involve handguns, but almost all of those are committed by drug dealers and gang members using illegal handguns. Legit collectors and target shooters don’t commit crimes.

If the Liberals follow through, city governments could order law-abiding handgun owners to store their firearms at some central location such as a police warehouse.

As if all of that wasn’t bad enough, we learned this week the Trudeau government chose to legislate its ban via cabinet order, because Parliament had become too – um – inconvenient.

Ed Burlew, a Toronto-area lawyer who is one the country’s foremost experts on firearms law, received a copy of an email from Kingston Liberal MP Marwan Tabbara.

In response to a constituent’s complaint about Liberal gun policy, Tabbara explained the government had chosen to confiscate hundreds of millions of dollars of personal property from law-abiding Canadians using a cabinet decree because, “We can’t get the necessary unanimous consent for introduction of a Bill on this subject and this has waited too long for action.”

Since when is there a deadline for how long you have to try democracy before you can give up and shove whatever you want into law? I guess if you’re a Liberal, it’s okay to bypass the democratic process so long as you’ve grown impatient with Parliament.

This is similar to them deciding early in the pandemic that would like the power to tax and spent at will until the end of 2021 without Parliament having any say over it.

For the last two months, the Liberals have governed largely without opposition. There have been very few sessions of Parliament during which the Liberals have been subjected to opposition questioning.

Since mid-March, government in Canada has largely consisted of Prime Minister Justin Trudeau descending the steps at Rideau Cottage and decreeing what will and will not be done.

This is then followed by a few questions from friendly journalists based largely in Quebec.

The longer the pandemic lasts, the more dictatorial the Liberals become.


Canada: Everything from Eh to Zed.
Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14923659 05/30/20
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Bill Blair's alcoholism is going to give him a fatal heart attack. When that happens, I hope it's a real nasty, painful one.

Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: BowRiverFlyGuy] #14924279 05/30/20
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Originally Posted by BowRiverFlyGuy
Bill Blair's alcoholism is going to give him a fatal heart attack. When that happens, I hope it's a real nasty, painful one.

If he is in fact an alcoholic (and it looks like it), it needs to be documented and used against him.

I emailed Lorne Gunter about that MP's e-mail, which really should be made public. If it's legit, as Gunter claims, no doubt Ed B will use it in evidence. The Turd's Teflon™ coating needs to be removed, and him after it..

Last edited by Stuart; 05/30/20.

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Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14925489 05/30/20
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I found this tidbit of information. For those who like to point the finger at the east for their troubles, your anger should be directed at Toronto.

According to the CBC, the Canadian Broadcorping Castration, and Stats Can, there are 37.6 million people in Canada. The figures below represent the population of the GTA vs the rest of Ontario. Also, the square km of each.

GTA + Hamilton -- 7.9 million -- 7,124 km²
Rest of Ontario -- 7.0 million -- 1,076,000 km²

The GTA represents less than 1% of Ontario's total land mass, but has 53% of its population. Of the 7.9 million people in the GTA, some are either too young to vote, or don't bother.

As of last election, the GTA had 57 federal seats, or about 17% of the 338 seats in Canada.

49 of those 57 seats are held by the Liberals.

The Liberals hold 157 seats nationally. 31% of those - about 1/3 - are from the GTA, an area that is less than 1% of Ontario's total land mass. And probably 0.3 or 0.4% of Canada's total land mass.

Crunching the numbers, 1/3 of the sitting Liberal government was elected from an extremely small geographic area - the GTA. While it may be easy to blame "the East" for Canada's troubles, Toronto wields a huge chunk of the power. Those of us in "the rest of Ontario", do not like being lumped into the group who is to blame.

It is the large number of people in the GTA that continues to be a thorn in the side of the Conservatives, the NDP, etc. The Liberals know this, and that is why they spend so much time campaigning in the large urban centres.



Safe Shooting!
Steve Redgwell
www.303british.com

"Stay away from negative people. They have a problem for every solution." - anon
Proverbs 22:10: Cast out the scorner, and contention shall go out; yea, strife and reproach shall cease.
Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14925693 05/30/20
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Well, Steve, for those of us "out west", Toronto IS "back east" grin

But yes, you are right and it was never more obvious than when "Windy" Wendy initiated her pathetic "Ban AR15, handguns, potato guns" etc. ePetition 1923 in the fall of 2018. Over a period of 120 days, it received 20,110 signatures, 16,081 (80%) of which came from..... (drum roll, please)..... ONTARIO!

The subsequent two, (petition 2341,sponsored by Glen Motz) ran for only 60 days and received 175,310 signatures, reasonably distributed across the country (56.071 from Ontario); the current one, sponsored by Michelle Rempel Garner, beginning on May 5 and not closing until Sept. 2, has already received 219,013 verified signatures, again reasonably distributed across the country (72,477 from Ontario).

No bloody wonder the west is fed up frown


The link to any of these can be accessed by replacing the "xxxx" in the following URL: https://petitions.ourcommons.ca/en/Petition/Details?Petition=e-XXXX.
To see the provincial distribution, click on the "down" arrow to the right of the Signatures line.


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Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14925742 05/30/20
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You're missing the point, Stuart. Surgeons do not cut off the head to cure an ear ache.

One third of the Motz petition support was from Ontario, as was Garner's. I'll repeat that - 1/3. That's from 10 provinces and three territories. I suspect, but cannot prove that most of the Ontario support was from outside the GTA.

Stay on message. Cut out the cancer. Leave the healthy tissue alone. The Liberals use that to keep you off guard and the pro-gun people splintered. Don't fall for their tricks.


Safe Shooting!
Steve Redgwell
www.303british.com

"Stay away from negative people. They have a problem for every solution." - anon
Proverbs 22:10: Cast out the scorner, and contention shall go out; yea, strife and reproach shall cease.
Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14925786 05/30/20
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Points well taken, Steve. Perhaps I was a little hasty. (Of course, you' re in ON, too.) Naturally Ontario will have a larger response on most issues, simply due to the size of the population base. Undoubtedly most of "our" support indeed came from outside the GTA, just as most of the 80% support for Windy Wendy likely came from within it. The western "objection" to Ontario is largely due to the preponderance of Liberal/left suppport in the GTA, just as it is out here around Vancouver. and doesn't apply to the rural ridings.

Turdo is, intentionally or otherwise, worsening the divide between urban and rural Canadians. The "cancer" is the disinformation campaign to vilify sports shooters in the country and that cancer needs to be cut out!


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Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14940455 06/04/20
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Has anyone received a letter from the RCMP briefly outlining what firearms the government has decided are banned?

I have been away from the house for a couple of days on business. My wife phoned, saying that I received a letter yesterday from the RCMP. I will be home in a few days and actually see it. I cannot be the only person to have got one in the mail.


Safe Shooting!
Steve Redgwell
www.303british.com

"Stay away from negative people. They have a problem for every solution." - anon
Proverbs 22:10: Cast out the scorner, and contention shall go out; yea, strife and reproach shall cease.
Re: CCFR launches charter challenge of wpns ban as Blair clarifies rules [Re: Steve Redgwell] #14940477 06/04/20
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Hi Steve,

My hunter neighbour up the street got his a couple of days ago and I got mine yesterday. I haven't bothered opening it as a) I don't own any "nasty-scary-military-type->20mm bore cane guns/whatever" and b) it will probably be irrelevant in a week or so as Herr Bimmler instructs the RCMP to add stuff. (No, I'M ot bitter or angry. Not me!) But I could scan it and post it here or PM if folks want to see what Der Kanadienischer Gestapo is up to.


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