Home Forums Hunting & Shooting AR and Tactical Rifles Lets talk Iron back up sights for a bit

I saw that too I think, but I'm usually flying by at a glance. Forgot where it was.

Total of 200 and 13 would not be bad off slings and irons. If I had more than 12x it was a good day for sure.

I'll post those targets here, since those sights are the topic of this thread. They seem to be doing great rost:


I'm not really thrilled with breaking the 10 ring, but the wind was so inconsistent that it was making my head spin.. I barely snuck by with that 100. Group size sucked:


Then I shot a 100-6x that I wished would have been more centered:

That shot did break the 10 ring, just barely.... Group size at 1.2 moa... That's more like what I'm wanting, but with a better score.. Its hard to get both sometimes...

One of the best scores I ever shot was with 77gr TMK at the 600yd line.

Shoot a better score with the 75 SMK, so I don't feel bad about buying 1000 of them. Plus, that's a big money saver at $82.00/1000 cheaper.. I do like the 77TMK though. It seems to be a pretty easy bullet to get to shoot well..

I know these Ultradyne sights are a little spendy, but they are made to last. Now, I've flipped these things up and down and have been to the range a few times with them now and can testify that they are an exceptional sighting system. If any of you are looking for a more precise aiming system for your AR rifles, these might be worth checking out. Here are a few more targets I shot last weekend. As of right now, I shot a top score on the black rifle challenge with these back up iron sights, so that is a testimony to how well they work. As I've stated before, this Noveske is my least accurate ar15, but the rifle gets the job done:








If any of you guys have sights that perform as well, post up them pics.. Thanks..

Dammit rost, these sights just perfom buddy. I think you owe me a beer, as they are much more reliable than a Leupold.. Ha ha.. Shot these yesterday. Finally got some good shooting weather, so I had to take advantage of it:






I didn't have to adjust these sights at all yesterday. Just flipped them up, after I was done with some load development where I fired at least 100 rounds through the rifle and fired off these 2 groups. After that, I packed up my chidt and went home. Seeing how it proves out my earlier 1.24 moa standing in the black rifle challenge...



I don't think I showed a pic of the clearance under the scope, so here is how it looks with my Burris AR556 scope and Burris PEPR mount:



Pretty slick BUIS system, and they seem to be "precise" enough for my use..

Good info,Lawrence

Thanks, I was hoping someone found this thread useful. They actually turned a rifle I was going to sell, into a rifle I really enjoy shooting now..

Know very little about current generation AR’s, what with all my experience with the M16 I’m somewhat baffled this would work so well. Were I to purchase a new one it would NEVER wear a scope.

These may be something to look into Dan. I'm very impressed with these sights. The only complaint I have is you do most of your fine tune adjustment on the front sight. It works great, but I don't like messing around with the muzzle end of the gun to adjust the sights. I had a good conversation with one of the guys at Ultradyne and asked if they could design a rear sight with a micrometer adjustment, more like a target 22 has. To me, this would be the catz azz, since I shoot more paper competitions than steel targets. These sights are awesome as far as their intended purpose, but I threw out the idea that maybe they needed to offer a more precision adjustable rear sight. This was his response:
Great information, we appreciate all of the comments. Our customers definitely help us design better products!!

Now, I can adjust the sights to hit precisely where I'm aiming, but I'd rather be doing that with the rear... More like these rifles:






I need to get out and shoot this "new to me" Savage MKI FVT 22lr to see how she does in her new stock I installed yesterday..

I don't know anything about the old AR rifles either, but I remember hearing rost say that the good shooters could hold well under moa with iron sights. I've recently watched videos on the old Colt pre ban match rifles in the 20" HBAR configuration and was not impressed in the least by the accuracy I've seen. I've shot a Bushmaster match rifle, similar to what they used at camp perry alongside the Colt HBAR and that rifle was pretty impressive. It had a rear aperature, but heavy front post. Not precise as far as I'm concerned, but I did turn in some 1.5 moa targets that scored around 99 each time. This was with a rifle I was not familiar with and with my handloads. The rifle also weighed 14 pounds with lead weighing down the butt and forend of the rifle. Given those sights and these Ultradynes, I'd choose the Ultradynes. Check out the black rifle challenge, I believe I shot 3 better scores (1.31 MOA, 1.24 MOA and most recently 1.167 MOA) than rost did and he is no slouch of a shooter. Even though he says he's rusty... These "irons" have proven themselves to me, for repeatability and precision. I haven't had them long enough to know how rugged they are, but they are made of steel and seem to be pretty robust. Time will tell on that though..

For the sake of clarity, and my post above was not,...

First time I fired the M16 was in combat. When I got back to the states the Army decided it was a good opportunity to get me qualified with the gun. So I followed orders and showed up at the range. My previous qualification had been in Basic with a M14 which was the 2d CF rifle I'd ever shot. They gave me a Marksman pin for that effort. Quals with the -16 included silhouettes at 25, 100 and 300 meters. They gave me an Expert badge for that effort The old school aperture sight worked just dandy as far as I'm concerned. Dunno why it should present otherwise to new kids on the block.

They also let me shoot my newish RSB and gave me an expert ticket for that one too. Target was at 50 meters. My eyes were a bit better back then, but I still get good mileage with peeps.




Put a tang sight on this before shooting the target below.

Very nice buddy. I think your next challenge should be the Black Rifle challenge find you a good AR with iron sights see if you can beat rosts score. In your other thread you were talking about trying something different. That would be something different

D Dan might like this. I recently put my savage mk1 FVT into a boyds laminate:





That's a 1/2" x-ring^^^^

Now down to brass tacks. The AR (Gen 1 Noveske) is shooting very consistently. I noticed my Geiselle SSAE gets a little gritty after a while. Never notice that chidt with my RRA's. In all, I'm pretty damn happy and impressed with both the rifle and the sighting system. I'd buy these sights again, even though the price is a little high. You get a lot for your money. IMHO:

From the other day of shooting:




I'm shooting consistently into the 1.2 MOA realm with this set-up. I'm thinking with the right ammo, it would do better... Next Saturday my club is having an AR shoot. Some guys from the big city are bringing their souped up AR's to play with. It should be quite interesting... One member from Vancouver brought up a speed match, so I checked to see how fast I could get 10 shots centered up on the target and it took 11.4 seconds for a score of 100-8x with my Northtech Defense. Scoped rifle, of course. And that is with ammo that only shoots .9 MOA (as per the black rifle challenge rules). With the load it likes, it shoots into the .7's...

Hey BSA...next time you're tempted to sell that AR, give a little thought to the idea of just rebarreling it. I'll betcha that would bring it into the sub-MOA realm.

Myself, I only have BUIS on our two house guns (my hunting ARs have no BUIS on them). Primary sights on these are Leupold Prismatics with illumination, which I selected because of the etched reticle in order to be free of dependence upon batteries. They work well and I do not expect a failure, but they are attached via QD mounts and can be easily removed. I did not spend a lot of money on the BUIS, just went with Guntech when I saw a sale on them. I think if my vision (and my wife's) was better I might have opted for something a little better, but there's the vision issue as well as the extremely low likelihood of ever being used. One thing I like about them is I can easily fit them with Trijicons, which I may or may not do.

My use for these guns is totally different so my perspective is completely different too, but I think it offers an opportunity to expand the discussion a little.

Thanks for the comments RiverRider. As for the barrel, I will leave it on there for a while. Set up in this fashion, it works very well for my needs. I'll see if I get my azz handed to me in the shoot next saturday though. If that happens, I may re-think that. We may have some heavy hitters come from Portland and Vancouver. Hell, If I could get a 6mm ARC barrel exactly like this Noveske barrel, I may consider changing it out. I'd keep it set up exactly the way this one is though: using these Ultradyne BUIS and my Burris AR556 4.5-14x42 combo.. Like I told rost, if I can maintain 1.1-1.2 moa and score 100-8x average, I'd be happy as hell. As it is, this rifle has been shooting just about that good. The other day, I was testing some loads and got a little better accuracy with R-P brass vs. FC brass, so I may just switch over to R-P in this rifle. I have 1500 pcs primed and ready to load, so I'm good to go there. I also burned up about 300 rounds of 223 that day with 2 other rifles, trying to find a good load for that 75gr Hornady BTHP match bullet.

The 6 ARC is a great idea. But unless you feel like you gotta have factory brass and dies the 6mm AR / 6mm Predator / .243 LBC has just a tad bit more to offer due to case capacity. It really doesn't amount to a hill of beans, though. I bet you'd really like it.

In truth, I don't think the barrel you have on there shoots bad at all.

Thanks riverrider. I currently have a 6WOA that is ballistically superior to the new ARC, if it were twisted right and had better support from WOA. As it is, you dont have a good selection of dies, brass, or load data. Hence the reason the 6mm ARC will ultimately be the demise of some of these similar "better" wildcat cartridges.

Sounds like you are ready for NRA high power or NRA mid range prone at 600yds or XTC.. Or NRA- AR tactical in midrange prone.. Our club has the go for its first 600yd shoot of the yr this Tuesday.. looks like I found the sweet spot for the 75gr eld-m all shooting from the 600yd is slowfire ie single feed.. I finally had to clean my barrel when accuracy fell off with 77 tmk. Been about 500 rds since I gave it a good scrub with wipeout.