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Joined: Jun 2009
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I've owned several M70's over the years.

Pre 64's and NH guns. No Baco guns, but I've owned A-bolts from the same era and have no complaints.

I've sold all the pre 64's. Still have 2 1980's NH Featherweights. A 270 and a 280. In fact I prefer them to anything pre 64 I've ever owned.

Been some really good M70's made since 1964. Some better than others. Too each their own.


"You cannot invade mainland America. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass"
~Admiral Yamamoto~

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty. ~Thomas Jefferson~
BP-B2

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The Portugal rifle work just fine.

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After learing more about the current Model 70's .......I don't think I would hesitate to buy one .On the other hand, the Pre. 64's have much less allure for me .

The reason Browning / Winchester moved assembly to Portugal : is the assembly did not fit with the military items manufactured in North Carolina.

Now , what do you think / know about the new Pythons??

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I guess between my sons and I, we have 10 model 70s we use. I bought my sons New Haven Classics because that was when they needed their first rifle. One of my sons is now a brown bear guide in Alaska and his guide rifle is a M70 .375 New Haven custom model he was given as a tip. The rifles I use are all pre-64s: some factory, some custom barrels. I've not seen any of the newest editions of the M70. I continue to use the pre-64s because I believe the actions are superior in reliability. I hunt occasionally in Alaska and when going to places like that I want to reduce the likelihood of any equipment failures. So little things like one piece bolts, reliability of a trigger design become big things to me. I've read a few posts about some of the post-64s having issues and I don't worry about that with my current rifles. And don't let anyone kid you about pre-64 accuracy. With some tuning, the factory models I own and use a lot, can shoot really good. I hunt coyotes thru-out the year and use primarily a tuned factory pre-64 that shoots really good. My most recently purchased pre-64 is a factory .375 barreled action in another bedded factory stock and the rifle shoots so accurately (with a 3x Leupold) that I won't state how good as you'd think I was lying. I don't doubt the newest models are fine rifles, but there are a few things about the action that I believe were a step backwards as far a reliability.

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Interesting ruffed grouse,

So, am I to understand , you like me,have no experience with the new 70's ?

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mr. cisco: You are correct. I have no experience with the newest models. I'm referring to the very newest ones made somewhere else with the newest trigger design. This is only my opinion, so take it for what its worth. Insofar as the trigger issue alone, I read somewhere that the lion's share of all rifles made in this country end up as whitetail rifles. That's believeable to me. So with all the emphasize today on accuracy and long range shooting, and with all the gun press that has very little knowledge of gun design, Winchester felt they had to come up with a design that felt better to the average guy than the un-tuned pre-64 trigger. My son in Alaska used to work for Phil Shoemaker on the Alaskan pennisula. One of Phil's brown bear guides is pretty knowledgeable on rifle design. In one of our conversations he told me that one of the things he's seen while guiding is that the fancy, super precise triggers some of the hunters have on their rifles have failed in the elements up there. This same guide really likes, and uses, the M70 .375 New Haven rifle, but also plans on, or maybe does by now, use a Ruger 77 for his guiding. While up on Kodiak the last time, I had a chance to handle and shoot, the old (1950) M70 .375 that Morris Talifson used that I referred to. Ross Seyfreid called this rifle "the most experienced brown bear rifle on the planet." When you look at a rifle like that, that was used over 40 years in both a spring and fall season in some of the roughest conditions you will see, and learning that his rifle, along with his partners, an almost identical one made in 1949, both having never had a functional hick-up, then you realize why so many experienced hunters think so highly of the pre-64s. Its one thing to do a little hunting where you're never far from home, or a shop. Its another to be dropped off for 10-12 days in the wilderness to hunt. For that kind of experience, you want all the reliability you can get. That's why I like of old models. But again, its just my opinion.

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Originally Posted by ruffedgrouse
. In one of our conversations he told me that one of the things he's seen while guiding is that the fancy, super precise triggers some of the hunters have on their rifles have failed in the elements up there.
Yep.. The 'elements' can and will get to an enclosed trigger... That's why the pre-64s and post-64's to 2006 still wear that wonderful, very simple trigger that just plain WORKS, period..


Ex- USN (SS) '66-'69
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LET'S GO BRANDON!!!
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