24hourcampfire.com
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Brass Picking #14990661 06/22/20
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 9,424
Dave_Skinner Offline OP
Campfire Outfitter
OP Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 9,424
I had a shoot for the first time in a month or more and it improved my attitude quite a lot. Both my rifles and I were "on" at the same time for a nice change.

Even better, someone before me had indulged in a rattle battle and policed their brass nicely, so there were 97 cases of the same headstamp in the bucket all by themselves. USA 223 headstamp, not mangled at all. I decided to recycle them, at least once, make a batch for my Bushmaster AR.

So, I'm tumbling them now, will weigh a sample for weight variance, then maybe give them a prep. Dummy me, I didn't look in the paper trash for any empty boxes. Anyone here used or shot or reloaded USA headstamp 223 cases and had any issues, like rim tearoffs or other nasties? Is it "really" Winchester as I suspect?

Thanks in advance for thine wisdom. Yr hmble svt, Dave Skinner


Up hills slow,
Down hills fast
Tonnage first and
Safety last.
BP-B2

Re: Brass Picking [Re: Dave_Skinner] #14991607 06/23/20
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 5,443
Son_of_the_Gael Offline
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 5,443
USA is a Winchester brand, but some has been made by Lake City recently. For instance:

https://www.sgammo.com/product/223-...ammo-loose-pack-made-lake-city-wincheste


"If you have a 7x57, there are a bunch of other chamberings you don't need." - denton


"Jimmy, some of it's magic,
Some of it's tragic,
But I had a good life all the way."
(Jimmy Buffet)

SotG
Re: Brass Picking [Re: Dave_Skinner] #14991674 06/23/20
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 17,228
V
VarmintGuy Offline
Campfire Kahuna
Offline
Campfire Kahuna
V
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 17,228
Dave Skinner & All: I had a couple of out of state "Varmint Hunters" (and I use the term lightly) in this past week.
And, of friggin course, a couple of their guns needed a trip to the range! I have become sick of this type thing over the last 25 years as it just wastes my time and time in the Varmint Colonies!
Anyway as they were blazing away I found 12 or 15 strange looking (to me!) pieces of brass in the dust.
They were caliber 224 Valkirie and I would gladly mail them to anyone who may need them - I believe they are Hornady headstamp.
I am always looking down when at the range it seems?
97 cases of the same headstamp is a good find.
Good for you.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Re: Brass Picking [Re: Dave_Skinner] #14991700 06/23/20
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 9,424
Dave_Skinner Offline OP
Campfire Outfitter
OP Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 9,424
It doesn't look annealed like some Lake City. I'll take a closer look at the headstamp, I wish the picture in the ad was better, but that's a clue. If it is Win, that's okay by me, but if it is really Lake City, me happier. Thanks for the information.
I didn't look at whether or not there's a primer crimp. Hope not, but not that much of an issue. I even trim commercial pockets a little because then priming goes a little better over time.

I guess when I weigh them, that will be a good hint, especially if they're "heavy" as in "military" weight versus commercial. Lake City has always been worth the work.


Up hills slow,
Down hills fast
Tonnage first and
Safety last.
Re: Brass Picking [Re: Dave_Skinner] #14993612 06/24/20
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 2,288
W
woodmaster81 Offline
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
W
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 2,288
It seems like anything in the lower price brackets have crimped primer pockets. I have Federal bulk packs of 50 gr HPs that have crimped primer pockets as well as various brands of 55gr FMJ. It used to be that anything stamped "223 Rem" wasn't crimped but now it seems this is less and less so. I hate swaging the pockets but for free brass I guess I can live with it if I do a bit at a time. I'll decap a bunch of them then tumble to clean up the cases. I'll spend odd moments swaging out the crimps over the next day or two. I can easily get a hundred a day doing this so the task is not too onerous. Sometimes I'll bring the pocket swager and a bucket of brass upstairs and punch out as many as I can while watching a movie if the wife is not around.

Our range is used almost daily by various law enforcement agencies, they leave plenty of brass to scrounge. I particularly like it when their "snipers" train as one can pick up Gold Medal, Nosler, Black Hills, Norma, and other premium brass for free. My best haul was 153 pieces of Lapua brass for the 223 and 40 of the same in 308. It must have been a Federal agency that day.

IC-A

Re: Brass Picking [Re: Dave_Skinner] #14995121 06/24/20
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 9,424
Dave_Skinner Offline OP
Campfire Outfitter
OP Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 9,424
Lapua? Me jealous.

Ours is a membership range and the LEOs we get are members, plus the club rules say, Police Up Your Mess.

But Lapua is a headstamp I don't have. I like having good brass with distinct headstamps because then I can work up a load for that batch of brass. So I'm excited about having the USA headstamps, but not as excited as I'd be if I'd scored LAPUA. Hooray!

I've dumped the cases out of the tumbler, they were grungy enough to deserve a rubbing before I get them anywhere near my die sets. The primer pockets don't look crimped, I'll post back once I know for sure, plus the results of the weight check and prepping. Will probably decap, anneal, tumble, then size and trim.


Up hills slow,
Down hills fast
Tonnage first and
Safety last.
Re: Brass Picking [Re: Son_of_the_Gael] #14995402 06/24/20
Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 7,456
OldmanoftheSea Offline
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 7,456
Originally Posted by Son_of_the_Gael
USA is a Winchester brand, but some has been made by Lake City recently. For instance:

https://www.sgammo.com/product/223-...ammo-loose-pack-made-lake-city-wincheste


Olin is in a transition year taking over Lake City Transition ends in October)


-OMotS



"If memory serves fails me..."
Quote: ( unnamed) "been prtty deep in the cooler todaay "
Re: Brass Picking [Re: Dave_Skinner] #14997724 06/25/20
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 36,665
S
Seafire Offline
Campfire Oracle
Offline
Campfire Oracle
S
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 36,665
USA is made in the Philippines, its serviceable.... I have a batch I am testing I've had 2 neck splits in 18 reloads so far.. test group number is 20....
am annealing each reload.....

some would be happy with that... Ive seen better life expectency on other brands....


"Minus the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the Country" Marion Barry, Mayor of Wash DC

“Owning guns is not a right. If it were a right, it would be in the Constitution.” ~Alexandria Ocasio Cortez

Re: Brass Picking [Re: Dave_Skinner] #14998135 06/25/20
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 9,424
Dave_Skinner Offline OP
Campfire Outfitter
OP Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 9,424
Pillipino?

So it's not the same formula as LC, then. I deprimed then annealed then decrimped the pockets (they're annular crimped), the anneal coloration isn't the same as it is with Lake City, much less rainbow effect. Will FL size them tonight, length trim, chamfer neck, then check weights. But so far, seems okay.

I've also transitioned to a different method for FL sizing 223 brass, especially "other" brass. Station 1 on the 650 gets a pure decapper, 2 gets a naked FL die, 3 gets the expander ball only. I slime the cases big time, and run the entire batch, then tumble off the slime. Then I have another plate with the powder measure and seater, with the primer feed loaded.

The reason for doing so is, if you get a "sticker" or a tear-off, it really mungs things up. A naked FL die, I can get a nice fat punch in there and really whack the case out, otherwise the decapper and ball is toast (eventually). Second reason, just having prime/drop/seat makes for a smoother ride and more-consistent powder dumps.


Up hills slow,
Down hills fast
Tonnage first and
Safety last.
Re: Brass Picking [Re: Dave_Skinner] #15003343 06/27/20
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 9,424
Dave_Skinner Offline OP
Campfire Outfitter
OP Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 9,424
Cases are prepped and ready to load. I killed two necks before I woke the he// up and Dremeled the expander ball I was using post FL.

All the cases checked were over 1.765 after sizing, so I trimmed them all to 1.755 and 11 degreed them, then weighed. Not a lot of variation in the length and trim time.
No FL tear-offs.
Average weight was 99 grains with no primer, sample of 20 -- 25 or so, lightest 98 plus, heaviest 100 minus, so not bad at all. Most were spot on 99. I didn't sort for weight, I just wanted to see if there was enough variation that sorting/culling would matter.
Primer seating was consistent, I 45ed the crimp and the pockets are snug but not tight.
So, every indication is, these USA cases might be worth the effort. The only thing I haven't done is a mirror test, to see how they roll on a mirror (concentricity). I hope I remember to do that before I load them.


Up hills slow,
Down hills fast
Tonnage first and
Safety last.
IC-B

Re: Brass Picking [Re: Dave_Skinner] #15008913 06/29/20
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 9,424
Dave_Skinner Offline OP
Campfire Outfitter
OP Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 9,424
Did the roll test for concentricity, on an angled truck mirror. The idea is, lay the case on the glass, and watch it roll slowly down a gentle slope, just enough to roll the case once you let go of it. If it rolls smooth, it's concentric "enough," if it wobbles, it will probably pitch flyers.

I rolled ten random cases, 8 looked nice, two had just a fuzz of wiggle I could barely see. Better than average.

Other brands grind out cases that can barely roll on their own.

So -- this first cycle, what I will do after shooting is look closely at the base of the case to see how they fireformed, centered or off-centered -- and pitch the off-center cases. Doing so has been effective in other batches. In my experience, and experiments, there's no cure for a case that doesn't have a full annular ring after first firing. FL sizing doesn't help, they still blow out sideways, upsetting the bullet as it launches. This becomes really obvious with good rifles, sometimes I'll get a target flyer or MISS a critter and sure enough, the case will be blown asymmetrical. Trash!

I've pitched a lot of cases but it works out in the end with a more-reliable result on target.


Up hills slow,
Down hills fast
Tonnage first and
Safety last.

Moderated by  RickBin, SYSOP 

RR1b
Who's Online Now
302 registered members (1sgLunde, 204guy, 257Bobs, 257Ackley, 2ndwind, 1moredeer, 49 invisible), 2,165 guests, and 996 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
RR2/3










Fish & Game Departments | Solunar Tables | Mission Statement | Privacy Policy | Contact Us | DMCA
Hunting | Fishing | Camping | Backpacking | Reloading | Campfire Forums | Gear Shop
Copyright © 2000-2020 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
 
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.3
(Release build 20190728)
PHP: 7.3.29 Page Time: 0.052s Queries: 14 (0.003s) Memory: 0.8204 MB (Peak: 0.9265 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2021-07-24 05:18:30 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS