24hourcampfire.com
24hourcampfire.com
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 68
J
JackAZ Offline OP
Campfire Greenhorn
OP Offline
Campfire Greenhorn
J
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 68
I recently acquired a 722 in 222 Rem Mag. I would like to start with 50gr projectiles. I also have quite a bit of RL10x that I would like to use, but Alliant doesn't publish any data for the cartridge.

Nosler had 55gr data using RL10x, but for their load looks really anemic. Barnes has data for the 50gr tsx with RL10. The listed max for that load is 24gr, so I'm thinking using up to 24gr with a lead core bullet is likely going to be in the safe range.

That's really all I have been able to find. Does anyone else have any experience with the 222 RM and Alliant powders?

I also have a ton of CFE223 that I could try too, but I haven't found any data whatsoever for CFE223 in the 222 RM.

BP-B2

Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 1,387
3
Campfire Regular
Online Content
Campfire Regular
3
Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 1,387
Welcome to the world of semi-obsolete cartridges. The 222RM & 223 are really close in capacity with the Magnum being a BCH larger. I would think 223 loads would be a good start working carefully upward. If you compare the Nosler data between the 2 for Benchmark you'll see that, for some reason, they show the same powder charge with lower velocity in the larger case. The 4895 & H335 loads do not show equal charges or lower velocity for the Mag, I'm unsure what to think about the anemic RL10 load especially since Alliant shows 1 1/2 gr. more in 223 with 55gr bullets. It looks like 26 grains of CFE223 is a very safe starting charge for the Mag. As always... work upward carefully watching for pressure signs, maybe 1/2 gr at a time... or get some IMR4895.


Sacred cows make good burgers when you know what temperature to cook them at.-Rev. Billy
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 18,992
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 18,992
I have loaded and shot a lot of RL10x in .223. It is a hot powder and the pressure signs come up fast. If you have the right chamber (NATO) you might get all the way up to 24 grains with a 55 grain bullet but you are going to see some pressure signs. The Alliant load for RL10 is 23 grains in .223. 23.2 is good in my Mini 14 and I go 23.4 in my AR chambers that are Wylde or Nato chambered.

A friend shoots 24 grains with a 50 grain soft point in a bolt action. He says he is not seeing pressure signs. (??) 24 grains in a .222 RM might be worth a try but I would be reluctant to go over this. Of course start lower and work up to it. I did get my best accuracy with RL10 but I suspect my velocities were on the lower side, if velocity is really required for your style of shooting. I have not tried Alliant 15 but if higher velocity is your goal that might be the one to use. It's a real long step between RL10 and Alliant 15.

I think AA2460, AA2495, AA2520, IMR8208 and Benchmark may be better options for 55 and 62 grain bullets in a .222RM but that's just me. I wasn't a fan of CFE223 because the accuracy wasn't very good with 55 grain bullets but it may shine in a .222RM if your barrel is long enough. Have fun.

kwg

Last edited by kwg020; 07/05/20.

For liberals and anarchists, power and control is opium, selling envy is the fastest and easiest way to get it. TRR. American conservative. Never trust a white liberal. Malcom X Current NRA member.
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 42,586
S
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
S
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 42,586
Load data for the 222 Rem Mag...it has Alliant data along with other powders

http://stevespages.com/224_6.html


"Minus the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the Country" Marion Barry, Mayor of Wash DC

“Owning guns is not a right. If it were a right, it would be in the Constitution.” ~Alexandria Ocasio Cortez

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 15,457
N
Campfire Ranger
Online Content
Campfire Ranger
N
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 15,457
I have two 222 Mags, a 722 and a 40-X and use CFE 223 with 223 data. Works great.


NRA Life,Endowment,Patron or Benefactor since '72.
IC B2

Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 21,914
H
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
H
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 21,914
The newest Sierra manual lists updated fully modern data for the Mag Duece as well as the Berger manual.

If one is inclined, Sierra also lists full power loads for the 223 AI, which incidentally has the same powder capacity as the 222 Mag.

If I get a chance, I can post the data.

The 222 Mag SAAMI is 5,000 psi less pressure than the 223 and about 12,000 psi less than the 5.56 NATO, due to its use in break top single shots and the Savage 340.

Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 21,914
H
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
H
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 21,914
RL-10x from the Berger Manual; 50gr. bullets24 in bbl:
21.5gr. RL-10x 3,116 starting 23.7gr. 3,388 max


Sierra Manual, 50gr. bullets, 24 in. bbl:
21gr. RL-10x 3,000 fps starting 24.3gr. 3,400 fps max.

CFE-223 is for the 52/53's, but you can sub the 50 grainers
25.8 CFE-223 3,050fps. starting 27.9gr. 3,300 max.

An Alliant load I have used recently is 27grs. AR-Comp with 50's and 26.5 with 53gr. Hornady V-Maxes.
Its a substitute load for identical charges of Benchmark that clock 3,500-3,550. They're max loads for the 223 AI data with corresponding speeds and identical charge weights (AR-Comp is really comparable to Benchmark, NOT RL-15). Benchmark in the 223 AI Sierra data also is what I've been using in 3 222 Mags with 50gr. Sierra BlitzKings for close to a decade now, with almost parallel velocities and charge weights, probably because the case capacity is identical.

I've personally also used 26.5 grs. 10x with 40gr. bullets, where its better suited. Loads clock 3,800. Ironically, it's the velocity and charge used for 40's in the fairly new Sierra data for the 223 AI. I used 40gr. Ballistic Tips.

There is plenty of 223 data with 223 CFE and the Sierra Manual also lists it in the 223 AI data. Power Pro 2000 MR, IMR 4166, IMR 8208, TAC,Exterminator, and the old Thunderbird LT-32 are some of the newfangleds used with the 222 Magnum, 223 and 223 AI.

The best Alliant 222 Mag powder is RL-15, but it starts with bullets at 68grs. up to the 75's and 77's.... and again, the data for the 223 AI is what I've been using before Sierra shot the data for both cartridges. But lots of guys here have been using 223 AI's here.
The Sierra Edition VI is a great manual if you want pressure tested data for the newest powders with either cartridge; you can go std. 222 Mag pressures into the 223 AI data with some very good direction.

Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 68
J
JackAZ Offline OP
Campfire Greenhorn
OP Offline
Campfire Greenhorn
J
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 68
Thanks folks! This is all very helpful.

Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 580
K
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
K
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 580
I have a Sako L461 in 222Mag, for about 25 years now.

I use 223 load data as a guide, and work up from there.

In general, 222Mag brass has about 5% more case capacity than the 223. I mainly use Remington brass, but also have a supply of Herter's, which is supposed to be made by Norma. The Herters brass is much more consistent in weight than the Remington. Nosler has made brass and loaded ammo, in the past.

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,823
D
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
D
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,823
Quality of brass is an issue with the .222 Rem Mag, IMO.

I like the .22-204. Better brass and ballistics are pretty close. One pass and .204 brass becomes .22-204 brass. No fire forming.

DF

IC B3

Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 21,914
H
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
H
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 21,914
I dont know if Herters was made by Norma; all of mine say "Made in Finland".
I do know Sako cases are made by Norma.
The new Nosler 222 Mag brass Ive used is actually very good, as well as certain lots of Remington runs. Vintage Remingtons (Red box) are excellent.

If 204's have better brass, a 204 case is also one pass through a 222 Mag die and can be crush fit sized without firing. I used Winchester, Norma and Hornady 204 cases before the Noslers became readily available.

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 15,457
N
Campfire Ranger
Online Content
Campfire Ranger
N
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 15,457
Originally Posted by HawkI
I dont know if Herters was made by Norma; all of mine say "Made in Finland".
I do know Sako cases are made by Norma.
The new Nosler 222 Mag brass Ive used is actually very good, as well as certain lots of Remington runs. Vintage Remingtons (Red box) are excellent.

If 204's have better brass, a 204 case is also one pass through a 222 Mag die and can be crush fit sized without firing. I used Winchester, Norma and Hornady 204 cases before the Noslers became readily available.


Yes, it can. I did that accidentally last year 😳 when one our hunting club members left some Hornady 204 brass on the shooting bench while I was shooting a 222Mag. The reloading press gave a slightly different feel with resizing the 204 than my 222 Mag brass. When I realized it, I checked the dimensions and went on to load them. When I fired them later the loads with reformed 204 were in the group with Nosler 222 Mag brass.


NRA Life,Endowment,Patron or Benefactor since '72.
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,823
D
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
D
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,823
Originally Posted by navlav8r
Originally Posted by HawkI
I dont know if Herters was made by Norma; all of mine say "Made in Finland".
I do know Sako cases are made by Norma.
The new Nosler 222 Mag brass Ive used is actually very good, as well as certain lots of Remington runs. Vintage Remingtons (Red box) are excellent.

If 204's have better brass, a 204 case is also one pass through a 222 Mag die and can be crush fit sized without firing. I used Winchester, Norma and Hornady 204 cases before the Noslers became readily available.


Yes, it can. I did that accidentally last year 😳 when one our hunting club members left some Hornady 204 brass on the shooting bench while I was shooting a 222Mag. The reloading press gave a slightly different feel with resizing the 204 than my 222 Mag brass. When I realized it, I checked the dimensions and went on to load them. When I fired them later the loads with reformed 204 were in the group with Nosler 222 Mag brass.

Wasn't aware you could do that. Guess that would solve any .222 Rem Mag. brass issues. Good to hear.

DF


Edited to add, that's good news for .222 Rem Mag rifles.

If I was building one, I'd go .22-204 with fast twist. less trouble prepping brass. I have one 7 twist and one 14 twist. 75's and 80's do great in the fast twist, 40's are my choice for the slow twist. The older .222 Rem Mag rifles won't be fast twist, so limited to lighter bullets.

Ballistics are pretty close. It's the twist that makes the biggest difference, IMO.

DF

Last edited by Dirtfarmer; 07/10/20.
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 7,195
K
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
K
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 7,195
R10 burns very, very hot. This makes it tough to get the carbon out of the barrel, so is R#15..

H335 and CFE are excellent powders for the 222Mag with 50 and 55's, they clean up easy.

Speeds I am getting with the CFE and the 22/204 are unbelievable with 69g Sierra's, 3350 is the accuracy node with 69g Sierra with a very short freebore reamer, .015, in a 9T Shilen select match.

Last edited by keith; 09/06/20.
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,455
R
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
R
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,455
CFE,,varget or n-133 work up from .223 loads

Last edited by roninflag; 09/20/20.
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,823
D
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
D
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,823
Originally Posted by keith
R10 burns very, very hot. This makes it tough to get the carbon out of the barrel, so is R#15..

H335 and CFE are excellent powders for the 222Mag with 50 and 55's, they clean up easy.

Speeds I am getting with the CFE and the 22/204 are unbelievable with 69g Sierra's, 3350 is the accuracy node with 69g Sierra with a very short freebore reamer, .015, in a 9T Shilen select match.

Good info,

Thanks,

DF

Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 159
H
Campfire Member
Offline
Campfire Member
H
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 159
I am a Duce Mag fan and have been for many many BEERS--the issue with the Mag is that is not longer manufactured from MOST manufactures and there is very little if any
data using the new powders AKA last 30 years

My best loads have been with one of these three powders Benchmark,H-4895 or 748 I have a 722 Duce Mag that is in a 700 Classic stock and will shoot 3/4' with thany of these powders with the H-4895 having the edge with the 50-52 gr

Good Luck

Jim


"2Day is the 1st Day of the rest of UR Life"
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,881
O
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
O
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,881
Handloader #323 has a good article covering newer powders and boolits in the old 222 mag


One man with courage makes a majority....

~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 8,073
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 8,073
222 mag brass is what I used in my 6x47. Hasbeen


hasbeen
(Better a has been than a never was!)

NRA Patron member
Try to live your life where the preacher doesn't have to lie at your funeral

Moderated by  RickBin 

Link Copied to Clipboard
YB23

Who's Online Now
725 members (02bfishn, 12308300, 11point, 10gaugemag, 10Glocks, 12344mag, 88 invisible), 2,730 guests, and 1,293 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums81
Topics1,187,698
Posts18,399,950
Members73,820
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023


 







Fish & Game Departments | Solunar Tables | Mission Statement | Privacy Policy | Contact Us | DMCA
Hunting | Fishing | Camping | Backpacking | Reloading | Campfire Forums | Gear Shop
Copyright © 2000-2024 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.3.33 Page Time: 0.164s Queries: 14 (0.004s) Memory: 0.8819 MB (Peak: 1.0172 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2024-03-28 23:46:29 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS