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Joined: Apr 2001
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Campfire Outfitter
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You nailed it.

The Internet is a double edged sword. It can provide lots of useful information, and garbage, all in one. I would guess that the majority here do not need half the equipment they have on their benches. The ad men and the Internet told them they had to have them however.

The Internet is a powerful narcotic.


Safe Shooting!
Steve Redgwell
www.303british.com

Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please. - Mark Twain
Member - Professional Outdoor Media Association of Canada
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GB1

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Maybe a more productive discussion would be which factors matter the most often. From my experience, and others seen to concur, powder charge weight is usually consitent enough unless someone is using a thrower or scale that is really out of whack.

Going back to Denton saying 50% of the things people do for accuracy don't matter, and that you have to identify the big sources of error first - what factors are in the big 50%?

Concentricity? Seating depth?

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Assuming, of course, the rifle/scope platform is mechanically sound...

One of the first recommendations whenever a gun is behaving behaving wonky is to check the scope. It's easy to see there is a problem if your gun is printing 6+ inch groups. But if a gun shoots 2-3 inch groups, people seem to blame the load most often.

There was an interesting comparison by formidilosus (here or another forum, don't remember) where he shot his match gun with a test scope. Then he repeated the test with a known good scope and the groups were half the size of the original. The first groups weren't bad. Without a side by side comparison I think most people would have thought they needed to fiddle with loads. Opened my eyes a bit.

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One thing you should find somewhere in all these different sources.

CONSISTENCY in your method, even movements impact precision.

On a Dillon 650, I run almost 20 rounds before I start seating just to get the powder measure performing because if the powder sits vs is moving it makes a difference how much it throws.
I also made sure I use a dryer sheet on the powder measure to kill the static elec.

but the most important thing by far is if the loader is aware of things like how you work the handle needs to be consistent... is ultimately how things come out different or not.

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Campfire 'Bwana
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I still think that the most important variable is the shooter.


Not a real member - just an ordinary guy who appreciates being able to hang around and say something once in awhile.

Happily Trapped In the Past (Thanks, Joe)

Not only a less than minimally educated person, but stupid and out of touch as well.
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Originally Posted by 5sdad

I still think that the most important variable is the shooter.


Yes, it always will be.

This is the Shooter's Triangle. The shooter is the foundation of it. He is also the most volatile element of the three. The best rifle and cartridge will not perform if the shooter is unpracticed. Great shooters can turn in creditable performances with so-so ammunition or untuned rifles, but the best rifle and ammunition cannot change a so-so shooter into a sharpshooter.

Like the fire triangle, take away any one of the sides and good shooting is impossible.

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]


Safe Shooting!
Steve Redgwell
www.303british.com

Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please. - Mark Twain
Member - Professional Outdoor Media Association of Canada
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 19,179
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Originally Posted by Steve Redgwell


You are suffering from information overload. I suggest that you return to the roots. Much of what you read on this and other forums is unnecessary. If you were happy with your results, don't change a thing. Don't overthink things.

Don't worry about expander balls, specialty dies or some "magic technique".


** some won't appreciate but......my wife polishes my expander balls. ** whistle


Originally Posted by Mule Deer


Unless you're involved in some sort of target shooting, or long-range hunting, that requires the finest accuracy possible, then most of the precision stuff is irrelevant.



Originally Posted by denton
About half of what people do in the name of extra precision is wasted effort.


Well, slap my Grandma ! grin

I've been a member here since 2010 and IF I've ever read things like these ABOVE... I don't remember.

I have ALMOST quit reading some types of 'threads'. I just don't have any interest in them.
I've been 'handloading' since 1974 and I NEVER missed a deer because of A HANDLOAD. Certainly I've missed some deer but NOT because of insufficient or incorrect handloading procedures.

You guys have almost restored my interest and confidence ! ! !
Thank You


Jerry


jwall- *** 3100 guy***

A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap

Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
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Overdoing the precision can rob you of sleep. Just make sure you’re not under-doing it.


"I never thought I'd live to see the day that a U.S. president would raise an army to invade his own country."
Robert E. Lee
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Yeah, SOME knowledge of basic precision techniques can solve major mysteries--such as 3" groups from a rifle that normally shoots groups half that size.


“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
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