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Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: aalf] #15138488 08/15/20
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Originally Posted by aalf

You wanna help Jack off the mule?

Why is Jack offing the mule?


Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
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Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: las] #15138489 08/15/20
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Originally Posted by las
So this sea lion came 17 miles upriver to our fish counting station on the Sapsuk (Nelson) River, some decades ago. In just a few minutes I watched it make repeated passes through a deep pool where salmon were holding. It killed at least 50 that I saw. Because it could. Last I saw of that lion it was headed back down to sea.

When I turned the .338 in at the end of the summer, the box of shells was down to 18. I used one to kill a caribou for camp meat, off my license. Must have lost the other one on one of my walks.

I would think tranq guns with lethal overdose loads would be an option for this cull. Dispose of therm as they wash up, if needed. Bears and coyotes gotta eat too. Well maybe that wouldn't be a good idear after all with the residuals...



Was that sea lion eating just the bellies out of those fish? Common occurrence on the Columbia. Eat the fat rich parts, leave the carcass.


The desert is a true treasure for him who seeks refuge from men and the evil of men.
In it is contentment
In it is death and all you seek
(Quoted from "The Bleeding of the Stone" Ibrahim Al-Koni)

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Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: flintlocke] #15138516 08/15/20
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They do not state limits on sexes of the animals to be removed. Killing 500 bulls will do little. 500 cows would have a powerful effect.


Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: Valsdad] #15138527 08/15/20
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Originally Posted by Valsdad
Originally Posted by las
So this sea lion came 17 miles upriver to our fish counting station on the Sapsuk (Nelson) River, some decades ago. In just a few minutes I watched it make repeated passes through a deep pool where salmon were holding. It killed at least 50 that I saw. Because it could. Last I saw of that lion it was headed back down to sea.

When I turned the .338 in at the end of the summer, the box of shells was down to 18. I used one to kill a caribou for camp meat, off my license. Must have lost the other one on one of my walks.

I would think tranq guns with lethal overdose loads would be an option for this cull. Dispose of therm as they wash up, if needed. Bears and coyotes gotta eat too. Well maybe that wouldn't be a good idear after all with the residuals...



Was that sea lion eating just the bellies out of those fish? Common occurrence on the Columbia. Eat the fat rich parts, leave the carcass.

Bears eating fresh salmon eat the skin, guts, and sometimes brain. They leave the rest for the birds. When they eat rotten salmon the eat the whole thing. They much prefer rotten.


Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: flintlocke] #15138555 08/15/20
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Flintelock: Indeed this is to little and to late!
For just one instance the "sea lions" killed off both a wonderful native Chinook Salmon run in the Cedar River (just south of Seattle where I was born and raised and lived the first 49 years of my life) then decades later they (the "sea lions and seals"!) finally killed of the native and distinctly shaped Cedar River summer run Steelhead and the winter run Steelhead.
Yep to little and WAY to late in my experience/learned opinion.
Sad.
Hold into the wind
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Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: Sitka deer] #15138615 08/15/20
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Originally Posted by Sitka deer
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Originally Posted by las
So this sea lion came 17 miles upriver to our fish counting station on the Sapsuk (Nelson) River, some decades ago. In just a few minutes I watched it make repeated passes through a deep pool where salmon were holding. It killed at least 50 that I saw. Because it could. Last I saw of that lion it was headed back down to sea.

When I turned the .338 in at the end of the summer, the box of shells was down to 18. I used one to kill a caribou for camp meat, off my license. Must have lost the other one on one of my walks.

I would think tranq guns with lethal overdose loads would be an option for this cull. Dispose of therm as they wash up, if needed. Bears and coyotes gotta eat too. Well maybe that wouldn't be a good idear after all with the residuals...



Was that sea lion eating just the bellies out of those fish? Common occurrence on the Columbia. Eat the fat rich parts, leave the carcass.

Bears eating fresh salmon eat the skin, guts, and sometimes brain. They leave the rest for the birds. When they eat rotten salmon the eat the whole thing. They much prefer rotten.



I might be mistaken. Might be the large sturgeon their eating the bellies out of.

Lots of times they grab the salmon by the belly, kill it and shake it into smaller pieces to eat. I've seen numerous salmon upriver (400 miles +/-) with bite marks, most of which are on the soft underside.

Lots of interesting videos on the web of them killing sturgeon, salmon, and lamprey .


The desert is a true treasure for him who seeks refuge from men and the evil of men.
In it is contentment
In it is death and all you seek
(Quoted from "The Bleeding of the Stone" Ibrahim Al-Koni)

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Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: las] #15138635 08/15/20
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Originally Posted by las
Originally Posted by Heym06
Originally Posted by FishinHank
Too bad every native I've come across has been a terrible shot. Running 270 ammo through a 280 and wondering why they can't hit anything......

That must be an Alaska thing. Natives around here shoot very well.


Ours do too, with the right ammo. They do seem to be very recoil shy tho.

There are idiots, fools, and incompetents in any group of people.


Town natives are different from village natives IME. Worked with a couple that hated white people. Asked them if they knew how to speak russian and when they said no
I said why is that....

Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: flintlocke] #15138643 08/15/20
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Easy the seals.

Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: flintlocke] #15138704 08/15/20
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Sea lions aren't bulletproof. a 243 teaches them right

Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: RockyRaab] #15138707 08/15/20
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Originally Posted by RockyRaab
Oh, the tragedy of the missing little hyphen. The thread title as written means Columbia salmon are killing seals. What you meant was the opposite. It should have read "Columbia Salmon-killing Seals." Or better yet, "Columbia Seals Are Killing Salmon".

I only clicked because I wondered how salmon kill seals.



Exactamundo!


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Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: Heym06] #15138855 08/15/20
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Originally Posted by Heym06
Originally Posted by FishinHank
Too bad every native I've come across has been a terrible shot. Running 270 ammo through a 280 and wondering why they can't hit anything......

That must be an Alaska thing. Natives around here shoot very well.


They shoot whiskey, heroin, meth....

Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: Gooch_McGrundle] #15138876 08/15/20
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Their sister...

Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: las] #15139180 08/15/20
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Originally Posted by las
So this sea lion came 17 miles upriver to our fish counting station on the Sapsuk (Nelson) River, some decades ago. In just a few minutes I watched it make repeated passes through a deep pool where salmon were holding. It killed at least 50 that I saw. Because it could. Last I saw of that lion it was headed back down to sea.

When I turned the .338 in at the end of the summer, the box of shells was down to 18. I used one to kill a caribou for camp meat, off my license. Must have lost the other one on one of my walks.

I would think tranq guns with lethal overdose loads would be an option for this cull. Dispose of therm as they wash up, if needed. Bears and coyotes gotta eat too. Well maybe that wouldn't be a good idear after all with the residuals...


A tranq gun, water and gravity would probably be all that's needed.
One not recovered is one not counted!


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Only to God!

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Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: flintlocke] #15144559 08/17/20
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WDFW NEWS RELEASE
Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife
1111 Washington St. SE, Olympia, WA 98501
https://wdfw.wa.gov
August 17, 2020
Contact: Ben Anderson, 360-902-0045
WDFW, partners receive approval to expand removals of sea lions on Columbia River and tributaries
OLYMPIA – The National Marine Fisheries Service (NMFS) on Friday approved an application allowing the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife (WDFW) and partners to expand a program to lethally remove sea lions preying on threatened and endangered salmon and steelhead in the Columbia River basin.
WDFW, along with Oregon, Idaho, and six regional tribes, submitted the application in June 2019 after Congress passed an amendment to the Marine Mammal Protection Act (MMPA) in December 2018 allowing wildlife managers greater flexibility in determining when predatory sea lions may be lethally removed in areas where salmon and steelhead listed as threatened or endangered under the Endangered Species Act (ESA) might be present.
The new permit allows removals to take place on a portion of the Columbia River mainstem between the Interstate-205 bridge and McNary Dam, as well as any Columbia River tributary that includes spawning habitat of ESA-listed salmon or steelhead.
Sea lions congregate along the river in increasing numbers every year, including at bottlenecks like Bonneville Dam, where they consume thousands of salmon and steelhead annually.
The expanded removals could begin as early as this fall, said Kessina Lee, Southwest region director with WDFW.
"Sea lions traveling up the Columbia have had a detrimental impact on already-troubled salmon and steelhead populations, and this permit represents a significant step forward in our ability to give these fish species an immediate boost to increase survival while we continue working on long-term solutions," Lee said.
The Washington Legislature this spring approved additional funding to expand these operations to protect salmon and steelhead and provide benefit to the endangered Southern Resident Killer Whales, which rely on salmon as a key part of their diet.
The additional funding was contingent on approval of the permit by NMFS.
"We don't expect this program to solve the problem on its own," Lee said, "but it represents one more tool in the toolbox as we continue working to also restore habitat, manage hatcheries and fish harvest, and develop hydropower policy."
Though managers have carried out lethal removals of California sea lions on the Columbia River for years, the new permit represents the first time Steller sea lions may also be removed.
Partners are unlikely to remove the total number of animals allowed for by the permit, which includes as many as 176 Steller sea lions and 540 California sea lions over a five-year period.
Both California and Steller sea lions have made strong recoveries in the years since passage of the MMPA, with California sea lions now numbering more than 250,000, along with more than 70,000 animals in the eastern population of Steller sea lions.
Other entities who submitted the application with WDFW include the Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife, the Idaho Department of Fish and Game, the Nez Perce Tribe, the Confederated Tribes of the Umatilla Indian Reservation (CTUIR), the Confederated Tribes of the Warm Springs Reservation of Oregon (CTWSR), The Confederated Tribes and Bands of the Yakama Nation, and the 3.6.D Committee, which includes ODFW, CTUIR, CTWSR, the Confederated Tribes of the Grand Ronde Community, and the Confederated Tribes of the Siletz Indians of Oregon.
The Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife is the state agency tasked with preserving, protecting, and perpetuating fish, wildlife, and ecosystems, while providing sustainable fishing, hunting, and other recreation opportunities.


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Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: flintlocke] #15144685 08/17/20
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Sea lions, seals, cormorants (amongst other birds), smallmouth bass, walleye, squawfish, channel catfish, blue catfish, gill nets (commercial and native), thousands of recreation fisherman, habitat loss on a huge scale, turning a free flowing river system into a series of lakes, amongst other issues have all contributed to declining salmon stocks on the Columbia/Snake rivers. I mean hey, what could go wrong? crazy

Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: Hastings] #15144697 08/17/20
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Originally Posted by Hastings
The story I read said that firearms will not be permitted so I assume some very expensive inhumane trapping, lethal injection method will be implemented. Which will create a public outcry and a court order to stop the killing. What would be wrong with a rifle bullet and let them wash out to sea? I've heard the Stellar Sea Lion can weigh over a ton. How do you properly dispose of a sea lion?


Feed the great whites?


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Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: flintlocke] #15144775 08/17/20
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Originally Posted by flintlocke
No one knows how many salmon a seal will kill, like wolves, they kill for sport, but it's pretty clear that each female salmon lays from 2000 to 5000 eggs. Apparently biologists don't take math courses in college.


Browsing around, only about 15% of eggs ultimately produce free-swimming young salmon, so figure 300 to 750 young salmon going downstream per female. Out at sea the survival rate to adult is about one half of 1% such that even without the sea lions the salmon were operating at onliy about replacement-level fertility.


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Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: flintlocke] #15144890 08/17/20
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I’d buy a tag.


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Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: flintlocke] #15144969 08/17/20
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I'd buy a bunch


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Re: Columbia Salmon killing seals [Re: ryoushi] #15145093 08/17/20
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Originally Posted by ryoushi
Sea lions, seals, cormorants (amongst other birds), smallmouth bass, walleye, squawfish, channel catfish, blue catfish, gill nets (commercial and native), thousands of recreation fisherman, habitat loss on a huge scale, turning a free flowing river system into a series of lakes, amongst other issues have all contributed to declining salmon stocks on the Columbia/Snake rivers. I mean hey, what could go wrong? crazy


And as a fish person, who made their living dealing with fish, I have always found it interesting there is a bounty on a native fish, the pikeminnow/squawfish in an interest to keep the population primarily below 9", but no bounty on smallmouth bass, largemouth bass, crappie, walleye, channel cats etc which are all introduced non-natives to the Columbia system.

The politics of fishing is involved there, certainly not biology.

Also seems a very expensive fish passage structure around the Grand Coulee dam would reopen a tremendous amount of lost spawning/rearing habitat. Instead, they keep throwing money at other alternatives.

Interesting world of fish, that Columbia system is.


The desert is a true treasure for him who seeks refuge from men and the evil of men.
In it is contentment
In it is death and all you seek
(Quoted from "The Bleeding of the Stone" Ibrahim Al-Koni)

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