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Burns,
I have little interest in your affinity for trifling quarrels.
Context of 15 - 20 years was very clear for my comment. No one was confused about that other than apparently you.
The point was respond to Jud's question.
I have no beef with him, you, Stick or anyone else as I have better things to do in my life.
Just answered his question.
The Mark IV was good back in its day, but that was decades ago as indicated.
Servicing broken discontinued scopes today is/was not the focus of the discussion.
Servicing broken scopes, guess Leupold might have cornered that market, so will give you that.
Stick's memory is spot on about the reticle, back then, not now was the discussion point.
Stick was right on that point and made me cringe and laugh at the same time thinking back.
Jeff, I was pretty gentle explaining that when you said Jud was incorrect it was actually you that were wrong/incorrect. The MK IV optics are discontinued for civilian purchase but Leupold is still fulfilling older Mil contracts as in supplying new MK IV optics to fulfill those older contracts. Times move on and the MK IV line up has been supplanted in Leupold's lineup by better optics. Lil Fish's dreams of the past but there is nothing in the current Leupold lineup where reticles and turrets are not in sync and he's been called out multiple times but as is his SOP he just goes personal attack mode when he steps on his willy.
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
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Burns,
I have little interest in your affinity for trifling quarrels.
Context of 15 - 20 years was very clear for my comment. No one was confused about that other than apparently you.
The point was respond to Jud's question.
I have no beef with him, you, Stick or anyone else as I have better things to do in my life.
Just answered his question.
The Mark IV was good back in its day, but that was decades ago as indicated.
Servicing broken discontinued scopes today is/was not the focus of the discussion.
Servicing broken scopes, guess Leupold might have cornered that market, so will give you that.
Stick's memory is spot on about the reticle, back then, not now was the discussion point.
Stick was right on that point and made me cringe and laugh at the same time thinking back.
Jeff, I was pretty gentle explaining that when you said Jud was incorrect it was actually you that were wrong/incorrect. The MK IV optics are discontinued for civilian purchase but Leupold is still fulfilling older Mil contracts as in supplying new MK IV optics to fulfill those older contracts. Times move on and the MK IV line up has been supplanted in Leupold's lineup by better optics. Lil Fish's dreams of the past but there is nothing in the current Leupold lineup where reticles and turrets are not in sync and he's been called out multiple times but as is his SOP he just goes personal attack mode when he steps on his willy. Yes, I understand Leupold has surpassed the Mark IV line that is not the discussion, not sure why that is part of the discussion. I also happen to know a few good men issued Leupold scopes in the Army through the years, not USMC, and not one has been issued a new manufacture Mark IV in about the last ten years, though in fairness most of my friends are aged out of deploying anymore except for one who likely is the oldest in the SF Reserves. (I'm not SF, not high speed anything, just a guy chatting on a hunting forum.) The last one I know personally issued a new out of the box Mark IV did not work well enough to even zero his rifle, that was 10+ years ago. I gave him a Nightforce off my back up rifle to replace the Leupold issued to him a week before deployment. If you are telling me that someone is still being issued a brand new out of the box Mark IV today, I'll take your word for it as my friends are aged out of deploying now, but their CO needs his or her hands slammed in their desk drawer so they cannot approve any more orders for anything. The Mark IV sucked 20 years ago and has long been surpassed. fwiw - I knew more than few who replaced issued Leupolds with Nightforces or an S&B for one out of their own pocket. I also have personally watched as parents of modest means put down a credit card to buy a Nightforce to replace a Leupold issued to their son. I could share more stories, but will save them for another time. Carry on.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Ross told me that scope did not adjust accurately but that he figured out how to make it work
Worked awesome when I was dialing it. I suspect if he wanted me to test it again it would track like it had radar just like in the old days. Just Sayin.  Just say there was and is no BS with Ross and he was quite direct and clear about the inaccurate tracking of that scope on Miss America
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Yes, I understand Leupold has surpassed the Mark IV line that is not the discussion, not sure why that is part of the discussion. I also happen to know a few good men issued Leupold scopes in the Army through the years, not USMC, and not one has been issued a new manufacture Mark IV is about the last ten years, though in fairness most of my friends are aged out of deploying anymore except for one who likely is the oldest in the SF Reserves. (I'm not SF, not high speed anything, just a guy chatting on a hunting forum.) The last one I know personally issued a new out of the box Mark IV did not work well enough to even zero his rifle, that was 10+ years ago. I gave him a Nightforce off my back up rifle to replace the Leupold issued to him a week before deployment. If you are telling me that someone is still being issued a brand new out of the box Mark IV today, I'll take your word for it as my friends are aged out of deploying now, but their CO needs his or her hands slammed in their metal desk drawer so they cannot approve any more orders for anything. The Mark IV sucked 20 years ago and has long been surpassed. fwiw - I knew more than few who replaced issued Leupolds with Nightforces or an S&B for one out of their own pocket. I also have personally watched as parents of modest means put down a credit card to buy a Nightforce to replace a Leupold issued to their son. I could share more stories, but will save them for another time. Carry on.
That's lot of word salad when I gently exposed you being totally wrong/incorrect calling out Judman. The LOLs are kewl and your trying to appeal to heartstrings is notable if very cringey. Bottom line you called Judamn wrong when he was so right. Buck up Buttercup and admit you are miles behind the curve where the Big Boys play.
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
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Posts: 58,230
Campfire Kahuna
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Hilariously,Reoupold cain't play with MOA,IPHY,Mil'S or anything bordering a constant...which is fhuqking HILARIOUS!
Nor can their reticles align same. Hint.
Bless their hearts for trying.
Hint.
LAUGHING!..............
Brad says: "Can't fault Rick for his pity letting you back on the fire... but pity it was and remains. Nothing more, nothing less. A sad little man in a sad little dream."
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Ross told me that scope did not adjust accurately but that he figured out how to make it work
Worked awesome when I was dialing it. I suspect if he wanted me to test it again it would track like it had radar just like in the old days. Just Sayin. Just say there was and is no BS with Ross and he was quite direct and clear about the inaccurate tracking of that scope on Miss America Yeah pictures are worth 1000 words. I was there and dialed the dope. Just Sayin Ross can open his yap anytime and he don't need you to translate.
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,864
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Ross told me that scope did not adjust accurately but that he figured out how to make it work
Worked awesome when I was dialing it. I suspect if he wanted me to test it again it would track like it had radar just like in the old days. Just Sayin. Just say there was and is no BS with Ross and he was quite direct and clear about the inaccurate tracking of that scope on Miss America Yeah pictures are worth 1000 words. I was there and dialed the dope. Just Sayin Ross can open his yap anytime and he don't need you to translate. No wsy am I translating anything, I know exactly what he told me
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Just say there was and is no BS with Ross and he was quite direct and clear about the inaccurate tracking of that scope on Miss America
Yeah pictures are worth 1000 words. I was there and dialed the dope. Just Sayin Ross can open his yap anytime and he don't need you to translate. No wsy am I translating anything, I know exactly what he told me And I actually calculated drop, dialed, and shot the combo at 1 mile. grin Seems one of us has a lot more real world experience and another is running on guesses. Ross can chime in anytime he wants and I will run that Ultra to 1 mile again. Pretty sure it will track once again.
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
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[quote=jeffbird] = Bottom line you called Judamn wrong when he was so right. = the Big Boys play. Was having a friendly chat with Jud. The only person you are playing with is yourself.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Just say there was and is no BS with Ross and he was quite direct and clear about the inaccurate tracking of that scope on Miss America
Yeah pictures are worth 1000 words. I was there and dialed the dope. Just Sayin Ross can open his yap anytime and he don't need you to translate. No wsy am I translating anything, I know exactly what he told me And I actually calculated drop, dialed, and shot the combo at 1 mile. grin Seems one of us has a lot more real world experience and another is running on guesses. Ross can chime in anytime he wants and I will run that Ultra to 1 mile again. Pretty sure it will track once again. BS it didn't travk properly then, I trust what Ross said
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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[quote=jeffbird] = Bottom line you called Judamn wrong when he was so right. = the Big Boys play. Was having a friendly chat with Jud. The only person you are playing with is yourself. So we all agree Judman was right and you were wrong. Kewl.
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
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BS it didn't travk properly then, I trust what Ross said
LOL. Ross took the picture and I dialed the optic.
Last edited by JohnBurns; 09/11/20.
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
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Uh no, since you still cannot comprehend the discussion. Hopefully Leupold can withstand the weight of having your help.
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Uh no, since you still cannot comprehend the discussion. Hopefully Leupold can withstand the weight of having your help. Pretty sure my comprehension is per usual spot on. Maybe someone can enlighten me, but, a marine buddy at work 3 days ago claimed leupold Mark IV we’re being made exclusively for military? Incorrect.
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,152
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Ping pong balls for the win.
Once you've wrestled everything else in life is easy. Dan Gable
I keep my circle small, I’d rather have 4 quarters than 100 pennies.
Ain’t easy havin pals.
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Burns,
I have no idea why you love to quarrel like a junior high girl. Happy to discuss with you, have little interest in quarreling.
Stick was absolutely right on the reticles for the time frame referenced. Sorry that frosts you that he was right. If you were using one back at that point, doubtless it'd be in your memory for the mess it was. The reticle issue was then, not now.
Next, I picked up the phone and called the one friend still in SF and in a position to answer a question about the small arms equipment. He was puzzled and said he is not seeing brand new manufacture Mark IV's, but does remember the last new one being quite some years ago. The last infantry side person I knew deployed as a sniper, which as you of course know is not a MOS, but an ASI of B4 for an 11B, was in charge of the snipers for his battalion on his last deployment. He too did not know what you were talking about them still receiving brand new manufacture Mark IV's. He was around back at a time when he was issued a new Mark IV. He purchased a Nightforce fwiw, which might be something to consider rather than what the bean counters and politicians order.
I have no active USMC acquaintances in a position to know, but if you say the USMC is handing out brand new manufacture Mark IV's to 0317's, I'll just have to take your word for it. Last I heard, they had S&B 3-12's, but that the Mk 13 Mod 7 was supposed to be issued with a Nightforce, not a Mark IV. As I do not know anyone currently in that MOS, I'll not opine otherwise. If you do and say they are now issuing new manufacture Mark IV's rather than Nightforce, S&B, or the newer Leupolds, they all I can do is hang my head that we are sending some fine young men in harm's way with less than best equipment, which is what this whole thread is about which again seems to go over your head.
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Ross was the most influential Gun Writer in the mid to late 80s. Guns and Ammo drove the industry and Ross drove G&A. Back to Leupold and the Military. Tim Kennedy (Special Forces Sniper) is on Joe Rogan's podcast and he is wearing a Leupold tee shirt. Them that know. Burns,
I have no idea why you love to quarrel like a junior high girl.
Stick was absolutely right on the reticles for the time frame referenced. Sorry that frosts you that he was right. If you were using one back at that point, doubtless it'd be in your memory for the mess it was. The reticle issue was then, not now.
Next, I picked up the phone and called the one friend still in SF and in a position to answer a question about the small arms equipment. He was puzzled and said he is not seeing brand new manufacture Mark IV's, but does remember the last new one being quite some years ago. The last infantry side person I knew deployed as a sniper, which as you of course know is not a MOS, but an ASI of B4 for an 11B, was in charge of the snipers for his battalion on his last deployment. He too did not know what you were talking about them still receiving brand new manufacture Mark IV's. He was around back at a time when he was issued a new Mark IV. He purchased a Nightforce fwiw, which might be something to consider rather than what the bean counters and politicians order.
I have no active USMC acquaintances in a position to know, but if you say the USMC is handing out brand new manufacture Mark IV's to 0317's, I'll just have to take your word for it. Last I heard, they had S&B 3-12's, but that the Mk 13 Mod 7 was supposed to be issued with a Nightforce, not a Mark IV. As I do not know anyone currently in that MOS, I'll not opine otherwise. If you do and say they are now issuing new manufacture Mark IV's rather than Nightforce, S&B, or the newer Leupolds, they all I can do is hang my head that we are sending some fine young men in harm's way with an obsolete piece of equipment, which is what this whole thread is about which again seems to go over your head.
Kiddo, I simply pointed out you were wrong and MK IV sales to civilians are done and Leupold is only filling previous Mil contracts that lock in MK IV optics. You called out Judman and you were wrong. It's not a "quarrel" you're just wrong. Get over it and move on.
Last edited by JohnBurns; 09/11/20.
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,714
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Ross was the most influential Gun Writer in the mid to late 80s. Guns and Ammo drove the industry and Ross drove G&A. Back to Leupold and the Military. Tim Kennedy (Special Forces Sniper) is on Joe Rogan's podcast and he is wearing a Leupold tee shirt. Them that know. Burns,
I have no idea why you love to quarrel like a junior high girl.
Stick was absolutely right on the reticles for the time frame referenced. Sorry that frosts you that he was right. If you were using one back at that point, doubtless it'd be in your memory for the mess it was. The reticle issue was then, not now.
Next, I picked up the phone and called the one friend still in SF and in a position to answer a question about the small arms equipment. He was puzzled and said he is not seeing brand new manufacture Mark IV's, but does remember the last new one being quite some years ago. The last infantry side person I knew deployed as a sniper, which as you of course know is not a MOS, but an ASI of B4 for an 11B, was in charge of the snipers for his battalion on his last deployment. He too did not know what you were talking about them still receiving brand new manufacture Mark IV's. He was around back at a time when he was issued a new Mark IV. He purchased a Nightforce fwiw, which might be something to consider rather than what the bean counters and politicians order.
I have no active USMC acquaintances in a position to know, but if you say the USMC is handing out brand new manufacture Mark IV's to 0317's, I'll just have to take your word for it. Last I heard, they had S&B 3-12's, but that the Mk 13 Mod 7 was supposed to be issued with a Nightforce, not a Mark IV. As I do not know anyone currently in that MOS, I'll not opine otherwise. If you do and say they are now issuing new manufacture Mark IV's rather than Nightforce, S&B, or the newer Leupolds, they all I can do is hang my head that we are sending some fine young men in harm's way with an obsolete piece of equipment, which is what this whole thread is about which again seems to go over your head.
Kiddo, I simply pointed out you were wrong and MK IV sales to civilians are done and Leupold is only filling previous Mil contracts that lock in MK IV optics. You called out Judman and you were wrong. It's not a "quarrel" you're just wrong. Get over it and move on. Really? Who again specifically is receiving and being issued these new Mark IV's?? Please be specific because I intend to make a few calls and see if that can be put an end and have them given better equipment.
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Really?
Who again specifically is receiving and being issued these new Mark IV's??
Please be specific because I intend to make a few calls and see if that can be put an end and have them given better equipment.
Good Lord Chuckle Head, MK IV is done and Leupold is only making the optic for a very few old Mil contracts that require that optic. It's in wind down mode and as a civilian you can not get MK IV any more. Nobody with half a brain wants old tech MK IVs when new hotness MK 5, MK 6, MK 8 or even better VX 6/VX 5 tech is available. Judman called it and you went full retard.
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
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Really?
Who again specifically is receiving and being issued these new Mark IV's??
Please be specific because I intend to make a few calls and see if that can be put an end and have them given better equipment.
Good Lord Chuckle Head, MK IV is done and Leupold is only making the optic for a very few old Mil contracts that require that optic. It's in wind down mode and as a civilian you can not get MK IV any more. Nobody with half a brain wants old tech MK IVs when new hotness MK 5, MK 6, MK 8 or even better VX 6/VX 5 tech is available. Judman called it and you went full retard. You have no specific info. Got it. You are quite the convincing spokesman for Leupold.
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