Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Winchester Collectors Winchester 30-30 - which mold to order?

I am having trouble finding 30-30 ammo. I have some 170gr and 150gr factory. I am trying to figure out which weight bullet will get me out to 200 yds max fairly accurate so I can order a bullet mold, sizing die, and top pin.

I know that a reloaded molded bullet will not be the same factory. Any suggestions?

Lyman 311041

Second from left, ballpark 180 grains. It has not had the gas check installed yet.




They do well in my experience. Alloy was a little softer than Lyman #2, no leading whatsoever. They shoot one hole groups in another gun I plink with.

Good groups Dan they shoot well for me also and in the 30-06. Mb

Accuracy still ok at 200? I mean moa coyote?

That's the one I would recommend too. Cast it softer than you think prudent for reliable expansion (wheelweight alloy is fine and it's elasticity will serve up to 2000fps give or take depending on the quality of its lube). Size the bullet to fit throat diameter- ignore groove diameter. Flat nose cast bullets are always way better than RN bullets for hunting, IMO.

That level of performance will deliver what you see from 170 grain factory ammo. Consult a cast bullet manual for powder charges but I have always found a sweet spot in the upper 20's of 3031 for cast hunting loads with 170-190 grain bullets. For example, 28gr. 3031 + 190 flat nose cast soft yields 2050fps out of my 24" Model 54 Winchester barrel, with near MOA accuracy with receiver sight, and zero leading.

If you buy the lyman 311041, do the handles of a lee mold fit the lyman or do you need lyman handles?

You need Lyman handles. Lee's won't fit.

You might, or you might not, find satisfaction with a comparable Lee mould. That's a crapshoot I gave up on long ago. In this game you get what you pay for.

You can hand lube to get started, and use a cheap Lee push-through sizing die in your loading press. Works a treat, but a bit slow.

Obtain an accurate measurement of your 30-30 chamber throat ( internet search for " chamber throat pound cast". It may be 0.310" - 0.311" - 0.312+".???

Check out Arsenal Molds . Flat nose "30 caliber" 170 grain bullet,"Ranch Dog" design. It is designed for the 30-30.
http://arsenalmolds.com/products?product_id=84

Arsenal Molds will make a mold to the diameter you desire. Match the mold diameter to your measured throat diameter. Poof. Done. Accurate bullet for your rifle.

Ok more questions from trying to find lyman mold and researching. Have not found any lyman dies in stock. I can Get a lee mold locally that is in stock.

I also have a lyman 45 sizer and lube.

The question is:
How do I select the right sizer die and top pin for either the lyman or lee mold? The dies are from .308 - .311 and the top pins are just numbered.

Consult Lyman's chart. Cross reference bullet nose shapes of other mould maker's designs. Ie: Lyman top punch for a RN bullet will work with someone else's RN bullet.

Fyi
A Lyman mold may not ( will likely not) cast a bullet diameter great enough to be "slightly bigger" than bore diameter, but will highly be likely to be too small diameter for your chamber throat. If you are lucky, the Lyman "30 caliber" mold will cast at .309", and that is still too small for best diameter. You want at least 0.310", and I'd be looking at at least 0.311" for an as-cast diameter-and maybe more, pending actual chamber throat diameter.

A cast bullet with insufficient diameter will allow gas blow-by, create leading, and less than desirable accuracy. Regarding cast bullet diameter, "go big or go home."

Take a serious look at that Arsenal mold. Night Owl Enterprises (NOE) also makes excellent molds. They were the first to make "Ranch Dog" designed molds that met quality specs of the designer. These are large meplat bullets that smack hard and transfer more energy for more shock to the animal.

"Ranch Dog" ( first name "Mike") is a member's name/handle on castboolits.com. He is/was a commercial jet pilot (retired now?) and a pretty sharp guy , and designed the "Ranch Dog" design in various calibers (.357, "44", and 30 calibers). He originally had Lee Precision make them as a special order item on their 6 cavity mold line. Lee Precision could not provide the consistent quality " Ranch Dog" wanted, so he struck up a business relationship with Swede Nelson, owner of NOE. They are very well made molds, and the Ranch Dog design have a proven track record for accuracy and hunting effectiveness. The specs are on the NOE website, and have a 0.311" diameter. Their is a "tumble lube" version that does not require the expense of a sizing die.

The only downside to NOE is that their inventory is often "out of stock". I own 4 NOE molds, and all have been great. I don't know the whole story, but there was some issue between NOE and Arsenal Molds. I am not taking sides as don't know enough about the issue between them. One very nice option with Arsenal Molds is the ability to specify a bullet diameter of your choice. This is a HUGE benefit. NOE does not offer that, but then again, NOE mold diameters are pretty much "where you want them to be" at the outset. Turn around time for a custom Arsenal Mold is about a week, and is about $70 for a two-year cavity mold. THAT is a HECK of a deal for a custom-diameter high-quality bullet mold.

Do yourself a favor, scrap the Lyman mold. You will likely be disappointed in their cureent mold specs and resultant accuracy (and they are more expensive than Arsenal Molds). The 311041 is a great design for a 30-30, but the dimensions of the current Lyman version will smaller than optimal. They (Lyman) have been absolutely unresponsive to the bullet caster's desire for full-diameter bullets for proper chamber throat fit ( and may be made in India now, ??? Not sure). You may find an older mold with a slightly larger diamter (.310"?) but that will be a crap shoot. Go with Arsenal or NOE version (made in USA), but first get your chamber throat dimension. THAT is THE critical piece of information a serious bullet caster needs for maximizing accuracy. Older Lyman molds are marked 31141. "Newer" Lyman molds are marked "311041.", but no guarantee the older / 31141-stamped Lyman molds will be " larger."

If you want the Lyman 311041 mold design, look at the NOE version, with its .311" as-cast bullet diameter: takes the "diameter crapshoot" out of the picture.
https://noebulletmolds.com/site/product-category/308-311/311-184-fn-j5. The Lyman "311041" bullet diameter will be more like 0.308"-309", which is too small for accuracy.

This is another excellent mold design for a lever 30-30 ( and 30 caliber bolt actions). Eagan-style (truncated nose, tapering bands like a Loverin), updated version of the SAECO 315 mold . It is known for its accuracy. https://noebulletmolds.com/site/product-category/308-311/311-179-fn-i5

You can read a great deal about Ranch Dog mold design history, accuracy, game performance at:
http://www.castboolits.gunloads.com

For reference on NOE
https://noebulletmolds.com/site/

Another option,( after you get your throat diameter): SAECO / Redding makes a clone of the 311041 in two diameters. The SAECO 307 has a .309" diameter. The SAECO 305 has a .311". The SAECO 305 (at 0.311" ) would be an excellent choice. Molds are high quality, but a bit more expensive.
https://www.redding-reloading.com/online-catalog/87-saeco-precision-bullet-moulds

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1010296010/

Everyone is giving good advice. I would add 311407 and 308291 (a RN) if they were available. Both are GCs and have given exceptional accuracy across several rifles; 30-30, 303 Sav, 30 US. I cast soft so cant get full jacketed velocity but they mushroom beautifully. As i look back through my notes, IMR 4227 is a common factor in the most accurate loads.

Shooting paper, I like a RN. Shooting game I like a FN.

Depends entirely on the age of the Lyman mould as to what diameter to expect out of it, not to mention what alloy is being cast. Older Lyman/Ideal moulds tend to dispense large bullets versus new moulds. Alloys with large quantities of antimony will make for slightly larger diameter bullets out of the mould than will softer alloys.

I have moulds, old and new, from every maker under the sun and enjoy all of them. My advise: just get a good used Lyman 311041, some kind of lead alloy (clip-on wheelweights your best shot), melt the stuff and start casting and see what you got. You gotta start somewhere. For a newbie to try to figure out the ins and outs before ever even making a first bullet is a guaranteed exercise in frustration.

Gary knows about which he speaks.

I'm partial to the RCBS 180 gr FP. I powder coat them and, with gas check and my alloy, they run around 184 grains. Here are the results in my Winchester M54 30 WCF:

The RCBS 30-180 -flat point is a great bullet for bolt actions, and 30-30 lever guns. Same issue of not quite enough diameter, as they cast to about .309". A bit long for a lever action, which will require bullet seating in a 30-30 with the gas check base below the neck. Not a problem, but some people don't like that.

The NOE version casts slightly bigger diameter @ 0.311", for likely better accuracy, as it will fill the throat.

NOE RCBS 311 clone ( almost 200 grains)
https://noebulletmolds.com/site/product-category/308-311/311-199-fn-j2

NOE 30 caliber mold options:
https://noebulletmolds.com/site/product-category/308-311

Thanks for the info. Reading and looking at the websites noted. If anyone has or remembers something, please add to this thread. Don’t think I have ever seen the words “Sold Out” so often.

A good article with comparison pics of 30-30 bullets.
http://www.castbullet.com/reload/meplat.htm

Very good article buttstock. But the problem is finding the molds. I ended up finding 2 lee .309-170-fn molds. One mold looked better than the other so I got it and a lb of a Lever powder. It just came down to what I could find - and for under $100. I will just start here and upgrade if needed when something becomes available. Thanks again all.