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Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: OldHat] #15244651 09/21/20
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Originally Posted by OldHat
Bad things can happen to experienced people in the wilderness as well. Sometimes people make bad choices despite experience.


Trying to recall accounts of this happening to Frontier folk or Indians back in the days. Can’t think of any tho they did sometimes starve or freeze to death, get hurt or die from thirst.


"...if the gentlemen of Virginia shall send us a dozen of their sons, we would take great care in their education, instruct them in all we know, and make men of them." Canasatego 1744
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Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: krp] #15244659 09/21/20
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Originally Posted by krp
Back in '09 on an elk hunt I broke my leg crossing a creek, snapped my bone completely but didn't break the skin, my foot could touch my knee and did, in denial I grabbed my foot and tried putting it back but it just fell over again. The hunter I was guiding was in front and didn't see it, he came back asking what I was doing laying on the bank with my leg in the water, I had left it in to keep the swelling down. I picked my leg up and he saw my foot dangling and freaked, I told him I was going to pass out and to stay calm, then I did... woke up and it was real.

Walter was panicked, it had been raining hard all day, we had been out all day hunting and an hour of light left in canyon, no way to make a fire easily, no phone service for miles. I told him to go and get my brother in camp for help knowing it would be after dark before they could get back.

I'm laying there with my leg in the creek, soaked from the day's rain and falling in the creek. My body would start shaking and I'd try to calm it by deep breathing, cold or shock or both I don't know. After about an hour the shaking wore down, I started feeling warm, the leg stopped hurting, all my normal pains from being 52 years old and working construction went away. Soon I felt better than I've felt since I could remember. I knew what was happening and thought of that guy who left his family in the car after days of stuck in snow, they found him dead, he had taken his coat off, I knew he thought he was warm and feeling good.

When I finally got to the hospital the leg was really bad but their first concern was my core temperature was extremely low, the leg could wait for the morning.

When I die I want to die of hypothermia, it truly was the best I felt physically, at least since being an adult.

Kent


Dang Kent, in addition to all your other talents you’re one tough SOB 😎


"...if the gentlemen of Virginia shall send us a dozen of their sons, we would take great care in their education, instruct them in all we know, and make men of them." Canasatego 1744
Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: gonehuntin] #15244660 09/21/20
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Liberal Socialist Democrats and their voters are a bane to this Nation.
Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: 260Remguy] #15244705 09/21/20
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Originally Posted by 260Remguy
Originally Posted by SPQR70AD
Originally Posted by kaywoodie
Originally Posted by troublesome82
Originally Posted by Fireball2
Hypothermia makes them feel warm at some point.



It is called paradoxical disrobing, an effect of severe hypothermia. We were on a mission many years ago looking for the wife of a local businessman in the mountains of Colorado. We found her unconscious , naked with her clothing strewn about the trail and her horse nearby. While it looked like a crime scene, it was not , she had severe hypothermia after falling off her horse. Weird stuff!


Troublesome,

You know where our ranch is in Colorado. Was setting at the dining room window one July day watching a few snow flurries when two college kids just ambled down the driveway right out of the woods. I say WTF??? When I got to them they were almost to the ranch gate. One definitely going hypothermic. They had crossed the red top ditch (chest deep). And were soaking wet! Tried to get them back to the house. They wouldn’t budge.
Called sheriff. Got one into ranch dump truck that was at the gate (the one in the worse condition). Sheriff arrives and got them out in his SUV. There were about 5-6 miles from their camp and had no clue where they were. They saw the ranches red barn from top of mountain and were trying to get to it. Missed it by about 2 miles.

One was from Denver other from Odessa Tx. Crazy!

why did you call the sheriff?


Calling the sheriff seems like a logical step to take in order to get help for two people who needed help and were unwilling to accept the offer of help despite their obvious need for it. What would you have done if you had seen the condition that they were in and because of their compromised metal state were unable to help themselves?

so if they were unwilling to get help which I dont believe would the deputy then tase and handcuff them?

Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: Birdwatcher] #15244707 09/21/20
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I’m recalling Daniel Boone said he had never been lost, but that he had been “a mite confused” a time or two. Might be that people in that time and place took episodes of being “a mite confused” as just an ordinary part of living.


"...if the gentlemen of Virginia shall send us a dozen of their sons, we would take great care in their education, instruct them in all we know, and make men of them." Canasatego 1744
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Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: krp] #15244745 09/21/20
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antlers Offline
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Originally Posted by krp
When I die I want to die of hypothermia.
Just go up on a high mountain in the wintertime, and go to sleep. There are worse ways to go.


Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: gonehuntin] #15244760 09/21/20
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Mother Nature can be a mean bitch, and is often unforgiving.


Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: SPQR70AD] #15244785 09/21/20
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Originally Posted by SPQR70AD
Originally Posted by 260Remguy
Originally Posted by SPQR70AD
Originally Posted by kaywoodie
Originally Posted by troublesome82
Originally Posted by Fireball2
Hypothermia makes them feel warm at some point.



It is called paradoxical disrobing, an effect of severe hypothermia. We were on a mission many years ago looking for the wife of a local businessman in the mountains of Colorado. We found her unconscious , naked with her clothing strewn about the trail and her horse nearby. While it looked like a crime scene, it was not , she had severe hypothermia after falling off her horse. Weird stuff!


Troublesome,

You know where our ranch is in Colorado. Was setting at the dining room window one July day watching a few snow flurries when two college kids just ambled down the driveway right out of the woods. I say WTF??? When I got to them they were almost to the ranch gate. One definitely going hypothermic. They had crossed the red top ditch (chest deep). And were soaking wet! Tried to get them back to the house. They wouldn’t budge.
Called sheriff. Got one into ranch dump truck that was at the gate (the one in the worse condition). Sheriff arrives and got them out in his SUV. There were about 5-6 miles from their camp and had no clue where they were. They saw the ranches red barn from top of mountain and were trying to get to it. Missed it by about 2 miles.

One was from Denver other from Odessa Tx. Crazy!

why did you call the sheriff?


Calling the sheriff seems like a logical step to take in order to get help for two people who needed help and were unwilling to accept the offer of help despite their obvious need for it. What would you have done if you had seen the condition that they were in and because of their compromised metal state were unable to help themselves?

so if they were unwilling to get help which I dont believe would the deputy then tase and handcuff them?


Just go away.

Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: SPQR70AD] #15246518 09/22/20
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260Remguy Offline
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Originally Posted by SPQR70AD
Originally Posted by 260Remguy
Originally Posted by SPQR70AD
Originally Posted by kaywoodie
Originally Posted by troublesome82
Originally Posted by Fireball2
Hypothermia makes them feel warm at some point.



It is called paradoxical disrobing, an effect of severe hypothermia. We were on a mission many years ago looking for the wife of a local businessman in the mountains of Colorado. We found her unconscious , naked with her clothing strewn about the trail and her horse nearby. While it looked like a crime scene, it was not , she had severe hypothermia after falling off her horse. Weird stuff!


Troublesome,

You know where our ranch is in Colorado. Was setting at the dining room window one July day watching a few snow flurries when two college kids just ambled down the driveway right out of the woods. I say WTF??? When I got to them they were almost to the ranch gate. One definitely going hypothermic. They had crossed the red top ditch (chest deep). And were soaking wet! Tried to get them back to the house. They wouldn’t budge.
Called sheriff. Got one into ranch dump truck that was at the gate (the one in the worse condition). Sheriff arrives and got them out in his SUV. There were about 5-6 miles from their camp and had no clue where they were. They saw the ranches red barn from top of mountain and were trying to get to it. Missed it by about 2 miles.

One was from Denver other from Odessa Tx. Crazy!

why did you call the sheriff?


Calling the sheriff seems like a logical step to take in order to get help for two people who needed help and were unwilling to accept the offer of help despite their obvious need for it. What would you have done if you had seen the condition that they were in and because of their compromised metal state were unable to help themselves?

so if they were unwilling to get help which I dont believe would the deputy then tase and handcuff them?


I've never been a LEO so I don't know what a deputy would do, but by calling the sheriff Kaywoodie elevated the problem to "the authorities" and whatever happened to the two young men, he had done his due diligence. Whenever I find unknown people trespassing on our property I report them to the sheriff and press charges unless they are neighbors who we are on good terms with..

Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: gonehuntin] #15246541 09/22/20
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Originally Posted by gonehuntin
A bunch of stories posted here over the years where the lost people throw away their rifle and start stripping off their clothes, even boots, and are found practically naked. WTF??? Any definitive reason why they do things that stack the deck against their survival???


In 2005 we were taken on horseback to a drop camp in the Flattops area northwest of Eagle, Colorado and at that same camp the year before one of the hunters got lost and did just as you describe. We were told his rifle was still there in the woods somewhere and that he was so sick when they did find him he had to be flown out by helicopter. I've often wondered if the people that have this happen ever spend any other time out except just for a big hunt somewhere. Staying calm and in control are our best friends, and being prepared.

IC-B

Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: gonehuntin] #15246827 09/22/20
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When day traveling in the mountains and someone looks at your pack (usually filled with gear, firearms, ammo, etc.), asking if you are camping, tell them you aren't, but don't want a memorial shelter named after you.


Don't ask me about my military service or heroic acts...most of it is untrue.
Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: gonehuntin] #15246877 09/22/20
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As has been stated so well earlier with most hunters or hikers it is pure panic. But I volunteer with a SAR team and the vast majority of the missing people we look for are either suicides, or drug related. An awful lot of suicide's don't want to be found and can make it near impossible to find remains. Some go as far as digging a shallow grave and covering themselves up as much as possible. Another left behind clues that he had ran away with someone he met on the internet.

Others have hallucinations when high on drugs and believe they are being chased. Some drugs make them feel as if their clothes are on fire. And they feel no pain. They keep running though briars naked that no normal person would go through until their hearts just give out.


Most people don't really want the truth.

They just want constant reassurance that what they believe is the truth.
Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: antlers] #15248248 09/22/20
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Originally Posted by antlers
Originally Posted by krp
When I die I want to die of hypothermia.
Just go up on a high mountain in the wintertime, and go to sleep. There are worse ways to go.

Apres ski, we would often soak in a hot tub,
and convince the girls to come roll in the snow !
Very Norwegian you know , Ya

The pins & needles feeling was just exhilarating, Ha to be young again.

Probably put me into cardiac arrest if I tried that now

Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: gonehuntin] #15248258 09/22/20
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It's easy to lose your bearings in the Appalachian mountains. I wandered pretty deep in them hunting one year. I was glad to get out.

I hunted them for several years afterwards, but I took a compass with me after the first year.

Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: Bristoe] #15248274 09/22/20
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I always have at least 1 compass, or more. I also like having a gps .
I set a waypoint when I leave the truck and disconnect the power / charger cord.
Leave it running for the duration of my hike, bike, ramble.

When it is time to head back the gps will aid my dead reckoning guess which way back to the road, offset by x meters from the vehicle.
When I intersect with the road I know which way to turn and there is the truck, Waiting faithfully !
The gps bolsters my confidence in the compass dead reckoning.

My worst missteps have come when assuming I was maintaining SA, but really something had changed without notice. Atmospherics , fog, or even just overcast interfering with a mental dead reckoning of direction + distance.

Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: Birdwatcher] #15248307 09/22/20
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Originally Posted by Birdwatcher
I’m recalling Daniel Boone said he had never been lost, but that he had been “a mite confused” a time or two. Might be that people in that time and place took episodes of being “a mite confused” as just an ordinary part of living.


Sounds like my moose hunting of years passed. I came up with the 3 definitions:

lost: you don't know where you are, but know how to get out of there.

Lost: As above, but need a little "creative navigation" to get lost, or not lost. This is the dangerous one - you have to know when to quit and get LOST. My rule waas two attempts if sufficient daylight was left.

LOST: SIT DOWN, BUILD A CAMPFIRE, AND A SHELTER IF NEEDED, AND WAIT FOR SAR.

Never been LOST, but within 5 minutes of it twice...once in northern Wis , and once here on the Kenai.

"Don't panic", they say. Ha! Easier said than done when the damned stuff starts snaking it's way up from the belly to the throat.

I got to where lost was a comfort zone, and Lost, nearly so. smile

I have had my gps go tits up on me twice. Not to mention the several times I forgot to punch in my initial waypoint.

Compasses rule! I carry two, sometimes three. Hell, you can always average them...... smile


The only true cost of having a dog is its death.
"It would have been a good distance shot if they hadn't been so far away". Seth Kantner in "Shopping for Porcupine"
Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: gonehuntin] #15248308 09/22/20
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My favorite lost story was the fall I left Denver to return to Alaska. They leave (or used to in the past) a weekend between seasons in Co to get all the lost ones found. A news report announced SAR had found the remaining missing hunter on Sunday afternoon.. The helicopter picked him up about 200 yards from where they had found him the year before.

We joked that the next year he would just tell his wife "Have the chopper pick me up in the usual place".


The only true cost of having a dog is its death.
"It would have been a good distance shot if they hadn't been so far away". Seth Kantner in "Shopping for Porcupine"
Re: Question about lost hikers/hunters/tourons... [Re: gonehuntin] #15248755 09/23/20
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One of the final stages of hypothermia is burning up. If you are on a search and rescue mission and you start finding clothes, things are grim.


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