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Joined: May 2004
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Campfire Kahuna
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Brought about by determination?

Some of you no doubt have read my babble about the .30 Sneezer. It has been an ongoing project for several years. It is a .357 necked down to .30 cal with a long neck, intended specifically for subsonic suppressed and rampant hog slaughter.

Since no load data was available I started from scratch, with powder, primer and alloy, not to mention two different bullets.

Powder: Bullseye, WW231, WW540, 700X, 800X, Blue Dot, Li'l Gun, Lord Black and more recently RX7.
Primers: CCI 400 and 500
Alloy: 30:1, 50/50 and the equivalent of WW w/ tin.

OK, years have passed and I've seen the good, bad and ugly. Ugly came with the WW equivalent which leaded. There was a sign? 30:1 never quite came up to snuff and eventually I went with the 50/50 + tin at a 30:1 ratio. The bullets are the Lyman 311041 shot w/o gas check and a bullet I designed with the help of Steve Brooks which is a flat base pointed round nose which has a calculated BC of .400 +/-. It is a bore rider with rather petite grooves.
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Time passed and I found the 311041 shot well with Blue Dot at an average speed of about 950 fps. The Brooks bullet shot pretty well with that load as well, but....
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Well, my buddy Muffin caught the virus and started playing with cast bullets and the .300 BO, also with a Contender platform. Of course he has a somewhat larger case capacity and tried some slower powders and I looked at his targets and thought "Hmmmmm....." You know I wanted another 100 fps, right?

I had tried some SRP early in the parade and likely due to low load density and fast powders they did not impress, so I sorta forgot about them. And here we are in the year of our Lord with the component shelves barren and well, I only have about 1,900 SPP and near about 5K SRP. So, OK I think, I'll try some RX 7 and SRP. Went out a week or so back and was surprised to see the 311041 performed quite well with this combo and the velocity bumped up of course. And guess what? The ES numbers I'd grown accustomed to were cut in half or better and the Brooks bullet did mo better too. A lot better. Bumped the charge up a little more and went plinking a couple days back. Now I don't know the fine details about pressure curves/peak pressure on this load, but understand the concepts. 5 groups shot with both bullets trotting along ballpark 1050 fps with ES numbers in the single to very low 2 digit range. The groups measured in the .1-.3 range for 6 loads.

Now I gotta shoot all those old pedestrian loads so I can shoot more better faster. Harmony came to town and I'm smiling.

laugh

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Last edited by DigitalDan; 10/30/20.

I am..........disturbed.

Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain


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Dan sometimes you just gotsta hold your mouf right as "ET" would say grin


You better be afraid of a ghost!!

"Woody you were baptized in prop wash"..crossfireoops






Woody
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Campfire Kahuna
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That sure ‘nuff helps!


I am..........disturbed.

Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain


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Dan, when you mention 50/50 alloy, you're talking about wheel weight and pure lead at 1:1? How does that alloy expand at subsonic velocity?


I belong on eroding granite, among the pines.
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Campfire Kahuna
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It expands but not a great deal with the Brooks bullet. The flat nose 311041 does fine. It is the reason I started out with 30:1. OTOH, I use CNS shots on hogs do it matters little. And yes, 50/50 pb/ww.

Pic below is a Brooks bullet fired into dry sugar sand at ~950 fps. It is 30:1 alloy which tests ~6 BHN. They pass thru hogs and I haven't haven't recovered one there. The 50/50+Sn tests at 9BHN.
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

I have no pics of the 311041 of this nature.

OTOH, here's a pic of a CCI .22 CB short that was recovered from a hog.
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

I'm disposed to put them where they count rather than rely on hellfire and damnation.

Last edited by DigitalDan; 10/30/20.

I am..........disturbed.

Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain


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And my other gun is a .45-70. grin


I am..........disturbed.

Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain


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Nice targets. Be Well, RZ.


Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy. Its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery. Winston Churchill.
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Boy DD you sure make some pretty bullets! Someday, when I retire it is my hope that I can learn to cast like that. Accumulating materials now and casting when time allows.

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Ring, if you can load good ammo you can cast good bullets.


I am..........disturbed.

Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain


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Dan, will the Sneezer launch a 170-200 grain bullet with sufficient velocity to remain super-sonic out to 200 yards? I'm thinkng it would make for a dandy chambering in a Martini Cadet dedicated to paper punching. (Swell. Just what I need, yet another project.😀)


"You can lead a man to logic, but you cannot make him think." Joe Harz
"Always certain, often right." Keith McCafferty
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Good question. The only supersonic rounds fired to date were some round balls just a few days back. I am reasonably certain that supersonic is doable but can only speculate on that point. Depending on powder choice load density ranges from about 50% to 90% when tickling the 1050 FPS realm.

Case capacity to the neck/shoulder junction is weighed at 13.4 gr. of H2O. Case capacity with a sample of powders vs loads and velocity follows:
Reloader 7 10.4 gr - 1059 FPS / Capacity 12.7 gr
Li’l Gun 6.5 gr - 1032 FPS / Cap. 13.5 gr.
SR 4759 7.8 gr - 1063 FPS / Cap. 9.1 gr.

I have limited additional info but I think this illustrates the landscape. The case holds about 17 gr of Swiss 1.5...,😁

The Brooks bullet weighs ~180 gr with 9 BHN alloy. JBM calculation puts the G1 BC at .413 with a velocity of 1050 FPS.
I have not toyed with SS velocity calculations at all, nor do I have any reliable pressure data. An acquaintance did a little work up with one of the load calculators with preliminary data on case dims, none of which correlated to actual chrony data at all. I’m using Starline brass and some has been fired over 20 timed w/o case loss. I anneal about every second firing.

My gut says that something in the range of 1500-1700 FPS is possible, but that’s just a WAG. What that looks like at 200? Haven’t a clue. Very early testing with loads/alloy long abandoned on the 100 yd line yielded 5x groups of about 3”.


I am..........disturbed.

Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain


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Dan been casting bullets for the 9mm,38-357,40 S&W,41 mag and the 458 SOCOM.

So far powder coating them has payed off with less mess when it comes time to clean.

And i forgot the 380 acp,45 Colt and the 45 ACP.

It has been a warm week or 2.

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Campfire Kahuna
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Just fiddled with a Hornady calculator and with MV of 1500 it says 1240 FPS @ 200 yds.

MV 1400 gives 1168 FPS at 200.

I haven’t fiddled with PC yet. Might happen one of these days.

Last edited by DigitalDan; 11/09/20.

I am..........disturbed.

Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain


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Thanks Dan. Food for thought. One of my Martini Cadets is next up on the chopping block after the current High Wall .32-40 project is finished. (#3 Weight Ron Long barrel.) Was leaning toward another small .22 CF but I have plenty of them. A small capacity .30 wildcat + cast bullets would give the same performance as the .30 caliber .32-20's that are popular with the short range ASSRA target boys these days- with some added panache.

Do you have the .30 Sneezer reamer?


"You can lead a man to logic, but you cannot make him think." Joe Harz
"Always certain, often right." Keith McCafferty
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Campfire Kahuna
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Yes I do and you let me know when you want it. Hornady already knows how to make dies.


I am..........disturbed.

Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain


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I guess I used hellfire and damnation on a couple of hogs last Saturday evening. I'm sure you know that beast of a cartridge, the 250 Savage. grin

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Campfire Kahuna
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I surely do. laugh

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Two different loads @ 100. Guess which is the Partition....
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]


I am..........disturbed.

Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain


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Campfire 'Bwana
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Your loaded question leads me to #16, but it's so obvious it must be a trap. But it's so obvious it can't be a trap. Wait ...

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Campfire Kahuna
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Wow, figured it out already! Good job! The other was some 85 NPT’s.


I am..........disturbed.

Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain



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