Home Forums Birds & Dogs Upland Game Side by Sides - Easier or harder to shoot ?

I have never carried one afield - what say ye old toasters of SXS’s

Easier to shoot, or easier to make mistakes with them aim wise ?

love my sxs you don't aim you point, if the gun fits that's all there is to it, ( usually lighter and shorter)

I like ‘em stacked both ways. A gun that fits and has good dynamics is all I care about.

Prefer SxS 's with double triggers but have O&U's too. As gunscrew pointed out you point them not aim and fit makes all the difference. Patterning them is equally important like our rifles not all ammo performs to our liking in every Shotgun.

^^^^^^^^^

This, this, THIS.

If it fits.............it'll hit where you're looking. If it doesn't............it won't.

Have and have had twin-tubes stacked both ways. Some pretty pedestrian stuff and some higher end Brownings and Winchesters. Best I ever shot with a SxS was a stupid little 24" Brazilian-made (Amantino) Stoeger. I think I paid $350 for it brand new.

Really enjoy may SxS's....but I "point" better with a single barrel....why I don't know

Addition: But like pump shotguns....most today think they are something foreign and difficult....They're not

Just came back from a Pheasant hunt in S.D. and used a SxS and a pump....One guy asked me if I could get off a second shot with a pump....Friend I hunt with thinks it is an event that requires extreme manual dexterity....

And sometimes aiming is the way do it....on the hunt mentioned had two Roosters coming into the corn with wings set....stuck a vague out of focus bead on their chest and hit the trigger...Some top shotgunners will tell you there are times to have barrel awareness and other times you shoot the flash....It all depends on what the target allows based on target speed, distance, time and how you see it....

I you grew up on 1100's or 870's and then later on Beretta O/U's.

The visual clutter of SxS's and A5's make me feel like I am looking through glasses with cracked lenses.

It is all about fit......................

I like to shoot a SxS now and then.

With Zero Cast I look down left barrel; all my SxS need the stock bent to a Cast Off of about 3/8 inch.

No shotgun is aimed.............................

Before spending good money on a SxS read the book The Orvis Guide to Gun Fitting by Tom Deck.

I hadn’t heard of that book, thanks Reba.

I think it is pretty dependent on how comfortable you are with the shotgun. It also depends on why the change, I like them for the esthetics, having two chokes, instant selection of the choke, quality ones balance well for me, nothing prettier than blued steel and wood and the woo-woo part they just seem to call to me. I can't imagine going grouse/woodcock hunting with anything other than a sxs.

I tend to think I shoot them all pretty good. My favorite wild bird gun is a 25" two trigger 12ga sxs at 5lb 15oz it is fast and I get on the birds quick. On birds for hunt tests I shot a 30" 12ga single trigger O/U I needed to ride them out to give the dogs better retrieves.

As I'm getting older most of my single trigger guns are gone and the ones left are sentiment keepers.


I like them for waterfowl also.

Love the SxS. My Dickinson Estate 16 ga is my favorite field gun, but on the skeet range I shoot better with my Beretta 686 Onyx Sporting 12 ga. The SxS is stocked to shoot a little high for upland birds on the flush, makes me think my way through the high house clays.

I love a good fitting SxS with double triggers, but then again I am right handed with a dominant left eye.
I can also shoot an auto or pump but they just don't feel right.
I also can't see why having one extra shell is better than two different chokes.

I hunt birds with a 28 gauge SxS and do just fine with it. For pheasants I often switch to a 20 SxS.

I am a firm believer in Bob Brister's theory that some people have difficulty with SxS doubles due to eye dominance variations.

I don't have eye dominance problems (at least at the moment) so tend to prefer SxS's over O/U guns because I prefer two triggers, which tend to be more reliable--and are far more prevalent on SxS shotguns.

Plus, really good SxSs are coming down in price, due to the repressive gun laws in other countries--which somehow assume a 100-year-old "game gun" might be used by gangbangers or terrorists.

Prefer my sxs’s. Other than being a few ounces lighter, it’s a matter of what i enjoy/personal preference only.

IMO, for hunting, way too much is made of the “difference” between sxs’s and anything else. There is no “difference” in how you point the gun. If the gun fits you well (whole other topic), at the time of the shot the barrel(s) should be a ghostly shadow low in the visual field, something you are vaguely aware of, if “seen” at all, and that’s it. Look at the bird. The barrel configuration, the width of that shadow, means next to nothing. Beyond that, as to sxs vs. anything else, it’s a matter of 1. Familiarity and practice followed by 2. Personal taste. I grew up on pumps, got into sxs middle age though still shoot pumps and semi’s in bad weather, and still have a few break-actions. The difference is small differences in fit amongst them, then weight and balance, then muscle memory f’ing me over the safety’s location some days, yes. But as to action type or barrel configuration, neither here nor there in terms of “easier to shoot ... or easier to make mistakes with them aim wise.” Is my opinion. Heck, the pump is way more complicated - and it ain’t complicated!

MD mentioned per Brister that dominance can affect sxs use. Might be. I’d like to read that to understand it better if MD would kindly point out where to look in Brister’s work. I struggle with a neutral to *slight* left dominance, so slight it just depends on the day and (i wonder) what i ate/drank whether i can (right-handed) swing-away without care, vs. have to put a slight squint on the left to snap my dominance rightward. Same with pistol and rifle. Can’t say one shotgun action/barrel configuration vs. another seems to factor, though. Maybe it does and haven’t noticed.

Can’t answer for Brister, but the more there is to attract the off eye, the greater chance it will take over. And there is definitely more with a SxS than a single barrel.

I can hit just fine with my side by side but sometimes have a hard time pumping it if I haven't used it in awhile.

What I like about my side by sides are: Twin triggers for reliability and choke selection. English grip for more ergonomic carrying in field...hunting I walk a lot and shoot occasionally. Round actions for a slim comfortable fit in the hand for carrying long distances...I use 16 and 20 ga SxSs (both are side-locks) and they carry in hand better than any semi auto or O/U I've used.

Today shot a fine round of skeet with my CZ Bobwhite .410, but its not my hunting gun. I may give up a bird or two per 25 shots at sporting or skeet with my SxSs vs my Beretta A400 or A391, but its really fun to shoot SxSs on the range on occasion...with light reloads. Twin triggers took me about 100 rounds to get used to 18 yrs ago. I can go back and forth without thinking about it...not sure how that works but it does!

I think they're easy to shoot and carry and would love to find one that I liked. I should work on that some. I feel like they're overpriced for what you get. Am I wrong?

If you’re referring to new-production sxs, then you often have a point. You’re often paying a premium for imitation case color and laser engraving, or lofty prices for the real deal, but in either case paying inflated prices for what is often the wrong gun if a pretty gun.

We don’t know each other and say the following respectfully, you ma know and do all this I don’t know: First, study up in a book or two about shotgun fit and stew on it a while, applying it to the shotguns you own now. Decide/commit to WHAT you want and stick to it (guage, barrel length, grip, etc) Then locate some legitimate shotgun dealers in your region. Used is your friend. You can’t point at a catalogue, pointing to a gun you find impressive, and just order it (and be disappointed.) Instead, pay no mind to the grade, just to fit, and shoulder them until can’t think straight, noting/recording which fit perfect, and nearly perfect, but move on from others no matter what they “look” like. Beauty is as beauty does, and you may luck out and it’s also a looker but again, don’t be swooned.

You’ll find many superb quality older, used sxs are out there. English, Belgian, German, Spanish, French. Prices will vary, but are not necessarily high. Am fortunate to have had/have some high zoot sxs’s, but one of my favorites still is a Simson (German) 16ga boxlock, very good condition, tight, modestly engraved if nicer than most you could buy new today reasonably. $700? Can’t beat that with a stick. And it fits ME.

A simple but key tip is to note most of these older guns are short stocked, LOP around 13.5” give/take. It would be typical to lengthen the gun; how is up to you. I like tastefully done leather slip on’s so as to not affect resale, but digress. Point is, most of the time, as you lengthen the stock/LOP, the action and barrel will rotate forward and DOWN, which is going to affect your fit.

So if you like a gun but upon mounting it, you’re seeing a fair bit of top of rib (shooting high), don’t despair, because if lengthen the stock this will rotate down to a degree. How much - depends. A smidge may even be desireable; matter of preference. Conversely, if mount a gun and you are sighting dead flat over the rib, but shoot better with more length to the stock, beware. You may end up with a low shooting gun and being in SD, will do you no favors on rising pheasants.

Wrote this while reflecting on bits that affected my sxs enjoyment; learning. Hopefully there is something in all that to help you and others get together with a good sxs at an acceptable price-point and find happiness and good shootin’.

I'll simplify the above....Today. you have to make an effort to acquaint yourself with SxS's. It wasn't that way in the past.. Most often you will not find many in most gun stores. You will most likely have to make an effort to find a couple to shoot. I shoot at many ranges that rent shotguns....none that I know of have a SxS to try out.

As far as fit, some will tell you...McIntosh for one....that because of the muzzle flip of a SxS, what one sees over the rib of a single or O/U will not be the same as what one needs to see over a SxS...I have a Parker Repro that fits me well...and two original Parkers that are stocked much lower...I shoot all three about the same on game in that they are close enough...Look at the Bird hard, let your brain do the math and hit the trigger.

Best to find a couple to shoot.,.,,then make a decision if they are a direction you want to go....

There is something special about a well made SxS and the craftmanship that went into it....I can also find something special in a Model 12 16 Gauge pump...Something I can't find in a Semi-Auto...can also find it in a O/U...unfortunately the only one has been a Perazzi 28 Gauge on a true 28 Gauge frame...An itch I should have scratched when I was much younger.

And no they are not overpriced for what you get....when you get a good one....The craft or dollar value that goes into a "good" SxS far exceeds a mass produced pump or autoloader....The latter are essentially throw away shotguns in the long term....A good SxS is for someone to use and admire in the next century....

Pushing 80, if not already there and still killing Roosters......

Beautiful...

😎

Who's shooting it for you to kill the roosters?

Brister loved SxS's, but when he competed seriously (pigeons, usually) he used an O/U.

If SxS's were as "easy" to shoot accurately as single-barrels you would see more of them in competitions (American trap, International trap, skeet, sporting or flyers). You almost never see one in use by any top competitor.

However, they do work better for some hunters, and they are undoubtedly nicer to carry than an O/U or auto. They also reload faster than an O/U because you do not have to open them as far.

I know some top shooters who don't think they shoot their SxS's quite as accurately as they do their O/U's, but difference is slight, and they don't care about it.

My Sherpa....😀 Since he has to carry it...he might as well do the shooting also... only time I shoot is when we are shooting driven at Trumps place in Scotland.

So, this is what i mean by “too much made of the difference.” And am not attacking rimfire artist but the often said notion. Sure, in elite competition where one essentially expects a perfect game and dropping just one bird in 500 could eliminate one, yes it becomes apparent a slight advantage exists in single plane guns. But for every guy/gal that shoots at that level and here and there pick up a bird because of the gun, there 1000+ mere mortals whose every miss has everything to do with fundamentals, and field conditions/feet, and no gun is going to make a hoot of difference.

Compound that with upland hunting with a firearm on uneven earth, obstacles, weather, over dogs for miles and miles, etc vs. standing stationary if marathon shoots, outside fitasc probably mounted, addressing birds on repeated if not more/less known trajectories, and the balance of hunting gun additional considerations overwhelms simply what technically, rarely, could be a more precise gun shape under ideal conditions. Give me the light, nimble sxs, please, and will come by mosses honestly; won’t be the sxs’s fault! To wit, like rimfire artist said, fair number of those elite competitors carry sxs’s hunting.

Recoil reaction with SxS is the main reason more don’t shoot them in competition. Because of the barrel position the SxS tends to rotate in the hand on recoil and it messes for a second shot...while an O/U is more straight back with both barrels and the eye position is more consistent.

Other than that a top gun in competition could shoot either equally.

Years ago, some top competitions like the Grand and Skeet Worlds were won with SxS’s when single barrel shotguns were available. They mainly fell out of favor due to the cost to make them. And after WWII Americans wanted firepower...and the repeating shotgun being less expensive to make overshadowed the SxS..


Today there are “easy” to carry Semiautos and O/U’s, and the SxS has no advantage when it comes to carry.

As far as fast loading , even the O/U has taken the place of the SxS for most who can afford to shoot driven Birds. In the field, one shoots a SxS because they want to....and appreciate the qualities and aesthetics of a well made shotgun. Same can be said for a good O/U..

Ive had guys tell me the wide plain of the SxS was confusing to them. I’ve known very few I’ve grown up with and hunt with who’ve ever used one. Nine out of ten are SA guys with an occasional pump thrown in. And, you’re right, the impetus comes from WWll impressions of > 75 years ago.

Even now, I’ve had guys ask why I would also choose to shoot a Ben UL with one less in the tube than any another SA.

I went from a break-open H&R 16 ga. to a Stevens 311 in a 20 in my teens and was met with, “well if you think that’ll work, ok” looks from buds. It did fine. I have and do love SxS’s today.

The birding culture here in the ‘60’s was pheasants in corn rows, predominantly, where they could run and get up at 20, 30, 40, 50 yards and the thinking was 30” full choke 12’s with five shots at the ready. That weighed eight pounds.

Those European driven pheasant shoots would really test one’s on-coming bird, scattergun abilities. I like about everything else too but would leave the tie off and maybe the knickers..🙂

I’d gladly wear the tie, knickers, rubber boots and waxed canvas if I could afford the admission.

Knew a gal once who went with the beaters and flushing Dogs to move the Birds to the guns.....she said it was a hoooot!!!!!


Addition: Trumps Turnbeery is only 2K per day to shoot driven....tips are extra😀

For upland birds I seem to hit better with my SXS. I wonder, besides fit, if the barrels give me a better idea of lead side to side. No expert here though. However my only perfect round of skeet was with a O/U, but I notice I do better with the crossing shots with the SXS on average.

I think fit and balance are a HUGE part of how successful a shot a person is - at least is it with me.
Originally I was thinking about how the sight picture would influence that... but I think you guys are right, it’s secondary compared to fit and balance.

Of course there is always the 2 different vs. one Choke efficiency as well.

I'd even foot the bill for Montana Creek Hunter.....If I could find a hat big enough for his pumpkin.....We would make a pair for sure....."Ayyyy Mate, the Birds today are fantastic.." "Ayyyy Archangels they are!!!!" "On to the next peg...cheers!!!!"

That be me chatting up the cute Scottish lass....

Need two triggers to really work the two different chokes....Something else that confuses most Americans...

They don't....

Two triggers and two chokes is the main reason I got one. It worked well for me and my purposes and didn't take long to get used to using it effectively.

I could be happy with fixed Mod in a single or Mod/Mod in a 2 barrel and then forget about chokes......

Years ago I went in for that Barbour waxed canvas stuff. Did it keep you dry? Yes, if you were standing still. If moving it was a walking steam bath — that stuff breathed as well as a plastic shower curtain or a rubber boot. 😅

I’m kind of a jacket and jeans type — I keep eyeing those Orvis tweed sports jackets for $500-$700. One would get some strange looks in central SD decked out in Orvis wools, knicks, and rubber boots. 😳😀

$2k per day. A nice $10k plus tips for a five day week, plus flights. Rivals Africa but actually isn’t too bad. Great food no doubt and wine.

My Beretta 470 SH 12 is M/IM and I wouldn’t change it at all.

A modified choked pump works fine for me 90% of the time. I got the sxs for killing rabbits in front of my hounds. Reamed it out to modified and cyl. choke. With light loads in the open barrel could kill the 15-20 yard bunnies without turning them into spaghetti strainers and could still kill the 45 yard bunnies with the modified barrel stuffed with nickel plated #5 pheasant loads.

Barbour looks good....however there is little warmth in the name....and very little water repellency....although it does well enough in the jaggers. Stinks considerably after awhile also.

When sporting clays came here, Barbour was everywhere...now it is rare to see any wearing it..

Makes sense....

6 days with an eight guns minimum. Round it up to 100K....the Donald likes round numbers....

Great I will pack my bags! When do we fly out?

No worries Battue I got a hat!

Need seven very plush friends who tip big! Very nice looking place.

I can load my own gun. Would there be a discount for that? 😉

Yep, it didn’t like the smell of the Barbour coat after a couple of years of sweat...very working class of me.

The Donald said the only lettering allowed on hats would be MAGA....Your flower hat with SMYT, while acceptable at M&M will not be at Turnberry..

SxS for me. O/Us are for people whose eyes are stacked one on top of the other, single bbls are for cyclops.

SKB 100/200 or Charles Daly 500's can all be had for under $1K and are great "shooter" SxS shotguns.

I'm in the same boat as Battue. I love SxS shotguns, but if I'm serious about hunting, a 16 gauge Model 12 (or Benelli) works best for me.

I've found this to be a problem for me with guns with splinter forends. I pick up my finger tips in my peripheral vision and it throws me. My current two SxSs (BSS's in 20 and 12) have ample beavertail forearms, which works better for me. I've never heard anyone else verbalize this issue so may just be me.

I agree with this totally. I tend to shoot Mod in my single barrels and LM/M or M/M in anything with two barrels. I would be perfectly happy with fixed Modified in every shotgun I own and have been tempted a time or two to lock tight my Modified tubes in so I don't have to worry about tightening choke rubes any longer.

Most people that were raised shooting a single barrel seem to do better with an O/U when they switch to a double. The usual single trigger helps the transition, too--double triggers are a little quicker for barrel selection but that takes some getting used to.

In general with shotguns for wingshooting, stock fit is the most important factor: "If it fits, it hits!" One of my best hunting friends used a Mossburg bolt 20 repeater for his whole long hunting life and was one of the best wingshots I ever knew. And his cheapo gun fit him right out of the box.

I can shoot one about as well as I can the other in practical real world hunting situations. The narrower plain on O/U is an advantage but not a big one usually while hunting. I like the way a lightweight English style SXS carries and is usually what I hunt with. My clays guns are O/U’s.