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Joined: May 2014
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Campfire Outfitter
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OP
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,392 |
Well, my experience with the 6mm bullet failure was with a 105 grain bullet. The game was pronghorn. That bullet [bleep] under 1/4” at aN hundred yards.
I was lying down and had a perfect rest. I shot that pronghorn six times Starting from the time he first stood up in the morning and each time the bullet landed where I wanted it to. The pronghorn had the largest horns I’ve seen. I didn’t want to destroy the hide For a shoulder mount , I aimed for the lunges. Each bullet made a pencil sized hole through the lunges.
The buck eventually fell and I had not missed the lunges even once.
I have the rack of that pronghorn overlooking my rifle work bench.
I would have dropped him right away if I had shot him in the shoulder.
So, yes I blame the bullet for not expanding, me for not testing expansion, the bulket company for not having an expanding bullet etc.
Usually, if I have a problem with a bullet, it’s that the bullet expands violently. This time the bullet did not expand. I could mention a few bullet failures, but that’s not my intent. But one of the bullets often being praised right now was a rather poor bullet when first released. I wish I would have had a camera back then. Now I carry a cell phone with camera. Back the, many people still had a rotary phone that was connected to a wall outlet.
My pet peeve is poor bullet construction. I ask, “ Why doesn’t the manufacture test their bullets?” But, I think I know the answer. The bean counters want the bullet on the market and the engineers answer to the bean counters.
What bullet was that? 105 grain Speer. One of the most accurate bullets out of that 6mm Remington. But I never bought another box... (Sorry about the late response)
I prefer classic.
Semper Fi
I used to run with the hare. Now I'm envious of the tortoise and I do my own stunts but rarely intentionally
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Joined: Oct 2013
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 18,879 |
I ask, “ Why doesn’t the manufacture test their bullets?” But, I think I know the answer. The bean counters want the bullet on the market and the engineers answer to the bean counters. Pretty sure they test them to the best of their abilities in labs and they probably do have a little bit of field testing before they release those products to us but there is no real testing done until they turn em loose and hunters are able to test them on living breathing animals under real world conditions on all sizes and structures of critters.
The last time that bear ate a lawyer he had the runs for 33 days!
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Joined: Jul 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,052 |
10gaugemag,
The major bullet companies of today usually do extensive "field testing" of new big game bullets before they start selling them, including European companies. I know this because, like many gun writers, I've often partaken in such field tests. Quite a few take place in Texas, where there are abundant feral pigs, along with quite a few other animals that provide excellent bullet "feedback," such as nilgai. Have also gone on several cull hunts in Africa, where I was often provided samples of new bullets to test.
However, this is a relatively recent trend, becoming more common in the past 25 years or so.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 18,879
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 18,879 |
10gaugemag,
The major bullet companies of today usually do extensive "field testing" of new big game bullets before they start selling them, including European companies. I know this because, like many gun writers, I've often partaken in such field tests. Quite a few take place in Texas, where there are abundant feral pigs, along with quite a few other animals that provide excellent bullet "feedback," such as nilgai. Have also gone on several cull hunts in Africa, where I was often provided samples of new bullets to test.
However, this is a relatively recent trend, becoming more common in the past 25 years or so. 👍👍👍
The last time that bear ate a lawyer he had the runs for 33 days!
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,392
Campfire Outfitter
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OP
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,392 |
I'm glad they do testing now. Most of my complaints on bullets were 30+ years ago. But it seems that a few still slip through the cracks.
I prefer classic.
Semper Fi
I used to run with the hare. Now I'm envious of the tortoise and I do my own stunts but rarely intentionally
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Joined: Nov 2020
Posts: 429
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Nov 2020
Posts: 429 |
Early ballistic tips were bombs for me, even when downloaded to more sedate speeds. They aren't today.
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,392
Campfire Outfitter
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OP
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,392 |
Early ballistic tips were bombs for me, even when downloaded to more sedate speeds. They aren't today. Me too
I prefer classic.
Semper Fi
I used to run with the hare. Now I'm envious of the tortoise and I do my own stunts but rarely intentionally
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 154
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 154 |
MD, what would you say was the min barrel length for the 6-06?
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,025
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,025 |
MD, what would you say was the min barrel length for the 6-06?
Not JB; will await his reply. If I was building a 6-06, I’d go with 26”. My .240 Wby is 26”. If set on shorter, like 24”, I think I’d build a less intense round. DF
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 7,263 |
My 6mm AI is at 25" as that was all we could get after taking an inch off the muzzle. My 25-06 is 26" and it has little blast and it is easy to reach published ballistics with a grain or so less than maximum. My 257 Weatherby has a 28" barrel, since this is a Ruger #1 no handicap for the extra length. I just worked up loads for it and haven't chronograph-ed them yet but I bet I will at least be at Norma factory velocities. All my .243s are at 22-24" which seems about right.
I agree with DF don't go too short 25-27" seems to be the best compromise in length. I would say the longest barrel that will balance well and not be cumbersome to carry is what I would go with.
The 6AI has a Bartlein 0 contour barrel and I put a light weight pad on a Borden stock and it balanced with no added weight, same for the 25-06 in a wood stock.
"When you disarm the people, you commence to offend them and show that you distrust them either through cowardice or lack of confidence, and both of these opinions generate hatred." Niccolo Machiavelli
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Joined: Jul 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,052 |
MD, what would you say was the min barrel length for the 6-06?
Mine is 24" and works just fine. It gets the following velocities with various bullet weights without pushing things: 55--4250 70--3827 95-3300 105--3189 115--3049 Must admit that I am always a little amused to see how much value many hunters put on another inch or two of barrel length, after having experimented widely for many years with hundreds of rifles. In my experience they make a lot less difference in velocity than "improving" most cartridges, and even that doesn't make nearly as much difference as many guess.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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Joined: Dec 2003
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Campfire Member
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 154 |
Thanks for the input, Gents. I just sold off my 25-06 that was only 22", and looking at the possibility of a 22-24" 6mm Remington or a 6-06 on a Tikka as a "replacement". Since I've started shooting suppressed, I'm a big fan of shorter barrels!
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Joined: Nov 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,025 |
Thanks for the input, Gents. I just sold off my 25-06 that was only 22", and looking at the possibility of a 22-24" 6mm Remington or a 6-06 on a Tikka as a "replacement". Since I've started shooting suppressed, I'm a big fan of shorter barrels! Adding a suppressor, I can see that... DF
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Joined: Dec 2003
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Campfire Member
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Posts: 154 |
Adding a suppressor, I can see that...
DF
I built my 6.5-284 with a 26" barrel. Adding the Omega to that makes it like swinging a telephone pole!
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Joined: Nov 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,025 |
Adding a suppressor, I can see that...
DF
I built my 6.5-284 with a 26" barrel. Adding the Omega to that makes it like swinging a telephone pole! Not too handy in a box blind. 26” without a can, bad enough. DF
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Joined: Dec 2007
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 16,123 |
Live a little.......6 PRC.......  ![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/vq7aTmR.jpg)
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,867
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,867 |
Had to many of the same thing, 26" barrels, so I cut one to 18" and put a can on it, that added 5 1/2" now I am 23 1/2" Shooting !43 eld x, 139 Scenar, 6.5 PRC It will shoot them to 1000 yrds at 2750 to 2850 better than you would think, with R-26 Or Retumbo, still working on it but so far the 139 gr. Scenar is the ticket.
Been thinking about cutting one to 16" With a can, for a jeep gun. as if I needed another Jeep gun. Rio 7
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Joined: Jul 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,052 |
RI07,
Yep, higher-BC bullets result in plenty of downrange performance in shorter barrels, especially with some of the newer powders.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,867
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Mule Deer, I know R-26 is pretty new, but hasn't Retumbo, been around for a long time ?
Any powders you would recommend I try with a 16" barrel ??and 139 gr. Scenar. Rio7
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,052
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,052 |
The same powders that work in longer barrels.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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