Home Forums Lever Action Central Big Bore Levers 444 Marlin Rifle Production

Now that Ruger has Marlin do you think they will reintroduce the 444 Marlin in at least one model if not two? Winchester opted to dump the 444 Marlin and the 94AE Big Bore series and now has sluggish sales in their 450 Marlin Takedown Short Rifle. Do you think a compact takedown or no takedown in 444 Marlin would be a better seller for Winchester?

Personally I believe the 444 Marlin is a valuable cartridge in the field. For NA hunting it can be loaded for a wide variety of game from 200 gr to 355 gr (405 Cast GC are offered and will perform at around 1,750 fps, but rifle twist, gate feed alteration and possible neck turning are typically needed). .430 gr bullets are offered in jacketed HP, jacketed SP, Barnes Solids, Woodleigh SP and a full realm of Cast Bullet GC weights.

I think it’s a shame that this potent, easy to reload and easy to cycle cartridge is not supported well. It’s always compared constantly to the 45-70 Gov. and I think that’s why Winchester opted for the 450 Marlin as a way to sell a .458 that would compete with Marlin’s 1895 45-70. Now Henry has the 45-70 chambered in their Big Boy too. In my way of thinking the 444 Marlin offers more versatility and more pleasure to shoot on a wide variety of game. No it doesn’t offer the upper end performance of the 45-70 Gov., but it does offer enough to dispatch pretty much the same game in the field if loaded correctly matching bullet to game. I always look at the comparison of the two as choosing a .416 vs a .458 turn bolt gun, both are killers and both serve in the field for a Hunter, but as a Guide you’d probably opt for the larger frontal area as a stopper under duress. At distances of 200-275 yds with scoped rifle using a 225gr and 240 gr HP bullets/loads the 444 Marlin is an energy dumper on game in the 300 lbs class making it very pleasant and accurate to shoot at distances and very deadly on game.

What say the Big Bore Lever Shooters, should Marlin, Winchester and even Henry support new production of the 444 Marlin? Is it worth saving, I sure think so.

Remington brought back the T4 before they went under and IMO their change from Microgroove to Ballard rifling improved the accuracy and versatility of the cartridge. If Ruger got all the CNC machines in the Marlin purchase I see no reason why they wouldn't continue building the T4.

I have a 68 JM straight stocked T4 and a 2 newer Remlin 45-70's. I really like both cartridges.

Winchesters Timber short barrel ported T4 wasn't popular I'd guess due of the barrel configuration. I have a friend who's wife bought one for him years ago. I've shot it and it's a LOUD beast compared to my Marlin. It's not as accurate either. If they did bring it back I doubt many people would pay $1500+ for one which is the average price of Winchester's (Miroku) levers these days.

Not sure about Henry introducing a T4. They've already got to many calibers and configurations now.

At $1,200.00 & $1,400.00 for the new Winchester .450 Marlins I have to admit they are out of my price range for a hunting levergun.
I have a Winchester .444 Timber carbine with a 2.5x Weaver- 5 minute Lee Dot and it is a fine rifle in the thick brush. I have killed many deer with it. It IS LOUD.

FWIW Pedersoli list some of their 86/71 range as being available in 444. They list a few different options.

https://www.davide-pedersoli.com/sc...model-86-71-lever-action-boarbuster.html

The other point is that you’ll likely be able to exceed the LOA as those actions generally can cycle a longer cartridge, up to 2.80” in length. I’d imagine to utilise the longer LOA you’d need to use a bore riding cast design or open up the throat.

Tried to get excited, but just couldn't!

Could you list the benefits/features over a Marlin .45-70...

Mmmm, ,
my .Winchester 1895 405 WCF works great for me with loads from 210 to 400 grains. It nicely fills the gap between my 1892 .357 Mag and my 1886 .45-90 (.458 2.4) . Fortunately, my 45-90 also loads and shoots 45-70 ammo so there is always a wide variety of commercial ammo available.

Nothing against the Henry or Marlin, just did not work out for me. I wish them both the best.

I suppose it would depend on intended use, bullet selection and loading. For general purpose hunting anywhere in North America the 444 Marlin is capable of dropping the same game at 200 yards as the 45-70 when loaded properly. What is it that you typically hunt whereby the 444 Marlin would fall well short? One benefit of the 444 is greatly reduced recoil on a cartridge that puts the same game down on the ground. 444 Marlin recoil with light to heavy loads in a 7 lbs rifle on average is around 27 ft-lbs - 37 ft-lbs, the 45-70 light to heavy would run 33 ft-lbs to 48 ft-lbs. When killing the same game animal in a hunting situation I see no need in taking it at the opposite end when it’s not needed. For raw power or guide use when loading 430-500 gr as a stopper the 45-70 would be of greater benefit for sure. Question would be how many are in that situation every day. For everyday hunting the 444 Marlin is hard to beat regarding a slick operating lever action with big power and low recoil. For a lever action called to duty as a stopper for guide work the 45-70 is better in that role than the 444 Marlin, however better dedicated lever stoppers on a Marlin 1895 platform would be the 50 Alaskan or 50 B&M Alaskan if that is the intended use of the gun 80% of the time in the field. The 45-70 has it all over the 444 Marlin hands down when it comes to factory and aftermarket loadings, which is a great plus. The 444 Marlin is a dedicated hand loaders cartridge for sure, which makes it plenty versatile for field use. The 45-70 is a fine cartridge, there’s no disputing that, but then again so is the 444 Marlin.

This article will answer your question - https://www.handloadermagazine.com/444-marlin

The 45-70 is a hell of a cartridge, so too is the 444.

THIS

I had a .444, but it was a 1/38 twist and wouldn't stabilize 300 grain bullets.

With a 1/20 twist and the ability to use heavy hard cast LBT bullets, the .444 becomes a whole 'nother beast.

This is what my Marlin can do with 325gr har cast...

5 danged shots and nothing near the bull... might as well sell it while it’s worth something

Is that the new .45-70 or a .444?

If a 1/38 .444, hang on to it, my .444 would show signs of keyholing with that heavy of a bullet. The .45-70 has proven accurate up to 540 grains, the heaviest I've tried.

That's a good shooting rifle you have there!

Thanks for the article.

Seems to me there are some similarities in a .444 able to use *heavier* pistol bullets in the rifle like you can with a .44 magnum in a revolver and in a rifle for that caliber such as the "94". Impression is one can get high velocity at a decent recoil response.

Don't see the benefit of the .444 as I don't shoot jacketed out of my .45-70s or any large bores at high velocity...only solids 330gr-380gr (1700-1800fps) and cast from 405-420gr at 1200-1600fps. Recoil at these loadings are within my "comfort" level. Option to go even heavier of course.

Am sure the .444s are fun to shoot, but I don't see the benefit of acquiring them.

You nailed my opinion as well.

I don't load my 45/70 to thump on my end. 300g going 1400 fps hammers deer at the ranges I shoot them with little bloodshot meat.

I would look at it if I didn't already have the 45/70 though, as I would be able to use my 44mag components and consolidate stuff a little.

SIX....

Yup... it’s broke... Might as well get it gone before it infects your other rifles

I have two JM T4s with the micro groove barrels. Both of mine will shoot 300 grain bullets into an inch and a half @ 100 if I do my part. IMO the 444 is a better cartridge than the 45/70. Shoots a little flatter with all bullet weights and a little less recoil. Sure hope Ruger continues to make them.

I don’t have a 45-70 to compare with but this years buck went zero yards with my T4 , hard to get deader quicker .

My old 1970 triple 4