Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Are we being visited a curse from God?

Agreed. To me, grace is the hallmark of the Christian experience, and the moment one starts trying to earn it...through good works or circumcision or law keeping or anything else from that old covenant...one has done away with grace.

a lot of folks are not willing to let god save whom ever he so chooses. oh no. they must do something to be saved...believe a certain way, use certain words, act a certain way, talk, act, or work in certain ways.

no way are they going to allow omneity to pick and choose on his own from the various multitudes, masses, and individuals. and so be it.

You're right. Perhaps "wrath" is the wrong word to use for this.

Either way, the Potter has the last word over the vessel he created.

Everyone? An omniscient being could avid collateral damage I would think.

#carpetbombing


mike r

''All these are the beginning of sorrows" out of the mouth of Jesus. They were just the warm up act is what I believe. Mankind has never made a weapon they didn't use.

My father was Presbyterian, but I don't believe that predestination stuff. Never saw anybody expressly state that in the Bible with the exception of one essayist.

Not to mention Caligula, Ivan, Vlad, Henry VI, Joanna, Rudolph II, George III, Hirohito

Hell, I would have thought the Spanish Inquisition would have been enough to get the entire Earth toasted.

Folks, we who have never been outside America simply have no idea of what evil a human mob is capable of.

We have not yet seen the "Rape of New York City" or of Chicago, or Los Angeles.

You are so right. We have no idea. But we might find out.

2 Chronicles 7
14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

This has been going through my mind during this discussion. It's entirely where we are at today. I agree with you guys that everything we could ever hope for is by God's grace and Jesus Blood on the cross. Jesus paid the price for my sin but I still have a part to play and the scripture lets us know what that part it.

James 2
4What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? 15If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, 16And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? 17Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. 18Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. 19Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. 20But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

So, in my opinion, we have a roll in what happens to us and to those around us. We don't earn grace or salvation but when we receive it we have a desire to do things that please God. These are works. The motive is the key. Do you do good things because you want to look good or do you do them because you want God to be pleased with your life. Love God...Love thy neighbor.

Jesus Christ did away with the Old Testament sacrifices and rituals, the veil was ripped from top to bottom. That ended the old and began the new. We still need the old testament though. Just look at how many times Paul reached back to it in his preaching. And all of the great miracles done during that time. Just read about Elijah and Elisha. Then how the Red Sea was parted then later the Jordan river.

Agreed. My daughter left her job, her husband (thankfully, no kids), and moved to Staten Island, NY, where she has become a disciple of Unitarian Universalism. She now has her own Youtube channel where she preaches that there is no Hell, everyone and everything goes to Heaven. Even Hitler and Stalin reside there. My sister, who is much more well-read of the Bible than I, has tried to explain to her the true path to Salvation, to which my daughter replied, "Your God is as weak as f**k." She has basically told me to f-off as well. Very disturbing.

I like these threads very much. There are a lotta smart men here, with a lotta good insight, and some different and enlightening perspectives. Such as yours. To me, grace is the solution for just about everything. Regarding good works: to me, they are a ‘result of’ and not a ‘required for.’ Regarding the Old Covenant: to me, Paul said that obeying the Law of Moses means one is obligated to obey every regulation in the whole Law of Moses. You gotta do the whole thing; you gotta dress right, you gotta walk right, eat right, do the sabbath, there’s 600 and 30 something different laws...don’t kid yourself. You’re either all in, or you’re not in at all. If you’re trying to draw near to God by following the Law, you’ve been alienated from Jesus, and you’ve fallen away from grace. That’s the way I see it. Others may see it differently, and that’s fine.

I will pray for you instead. May your eyes one day be opened to the Glory of the Father.

It’s a curse from watching too many TV reality shows.

To me, both motives are selfish. The only difference is the size of the payoff. Yet, according to what many are saying here, some person who does good deeds for others because it's the right thing to do, and without expectation of reward, but can't get over conceptual hangups over the veracity of multi-thousand year old culturally biased texts open to much interpretation, is consigned to eternal damnation and torture. I can't reconcile that in my head.

So you don't believe Revelation 13:8 which
states all those (in the Book of Life) are on
a select list compiled way back at the time
of the foundation of the world.

To me, the reward of doing a good thing is having done it. Period. If the motivation for being a decent person and doing good is the expectation of a divine reward, then that is a pretty selfish and self-centered motivation.

Nope,they were warned.They did it to them self`s.

Real World - what's the difference?

Your knowledge of the Bible ranks with your knowledge of everything else.

LOL

God set up the scenario to ensure man would
fall.... He purposely put the craftiest creature
snake up against naive humans.

Since Jesus was appointed as the sacrificial
lamb before the foundation of the world,
the outcome/Adam's choice was predestined
by God.