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Originally Posted by MarineHawk
Originally Posted by bluefish
But Boston work through the argument that hunting is a privilege granted by the state and whether the state can mandate a minimum shooting ability..


A state likely has the POWER, though you could argue both sides. But, that's why we have elections--so that politicians can compete for the affections of the electorate. In commy states, and in commy countries in places like Europe, they tend to have stupid rules like that because, even if 100% of the small number of hunters there vote against the gun/hunting-regulator politician he/she still will win. But in states where some people still work with their hands and like to shoot their own food, those types of dumb regulations tend to be less common.


But getting more common by the year—sadly.

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No real takers. Fine. How about someone present their view that hunting is a right.


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It is likely a matter of expense. How many licensed hunters in the USA? 35,000,000? How long would it take to get all of them to the range? What range? Who would run the range? How would the skill of shooting a still target in a controlled range environment transfer to the woods/field?

I'd say it would be easy to make an argument against it from a simple cost/benefit standpoint.

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Originally Posted by bluefish
No real takers. Fine. How about someone present their view that hunting is a right.



I told you that the states have the power. They just won't do it if the state legislators and governor believe it will cost them elections.

The 10th Amendment says that all power not given by the federal Constitution to the federal government goes to the states. The Constitution puts a number of restrictions on what the states can and cannot do, such as in the 1st, 2nd, and 4th Amendments. There is no constitutional provision that says that hunting is an individual right. Of course, there also is nothing in the Constitution providing an individual a right to "privacy," but the Supreme Court, in the most shamelessly result-oriented manner, has read that INTO the Constitution.

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While the concept of proving shooting proficiency seems to make sense at some level, there is absolutely no chance it could be administered properly. In many jurisdictions, hunter training is necessary for young hunters to get their first license and some level of marksmanship training is usually included and this should be sufficient. Ultimately, it is enough to simply encourage all hunters to work at being proficient. I think most people want to be. GD

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The 4th Amendment deals with privacy rights most clearly.


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Originally Posted by bluefish
The 4th Amendment deals with privacy rights most clearly.


It protects the “right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures …” It protects specific forms of privacy. But they specifically enumerated which subcategories of privacy it protects. If they had intended to protect all forms of privacy, it simply would have said “right of the people to privacy,” not “right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures …”



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Yes, I can read it. Have you looked at the line of cases on this topic from the Supreme Court? It is interesting reading. But privacy is off topic. At issue now.is whether hunting is a right? While not recognized in the Constitution as.such, individual states have considered the matter. The question is what makes it a right beyond a legislative say so?


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Originally Posted by bluefish
Have you looked at the line of cases on this topic from the Supreme Court?


Yes.


Originally Posted by bluefish
The question is what makes it a right beyond a legislative say so?


Nothing.

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I think we should go ahead and have the government view/test/approve hunter accuracy, and if the hunter fails, the government won's issue a hunting license and takes the gun(s).
(and put a tracking device on the failed marksman)


“Even if you’re on the right track, you’ll get run over if you just sit there.”
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Originally Posted by smokepole
Originally Posted by MuskegMan


No need to have any training or testing whatsoever. Dare to question another man at the public range about his firearm safety protocol - they are free to do as they godddamn please!!!


Bullsh*t.


Your BS meter is broken Smokey. You should have been able to tell from the first part of my post (which you did not quote to give full context) that I was BS-ing:

"Men are born from the womb kowing everything there is know about firearms, firearms safety and shooting proficiency. It's in our DNA for chrissakes."

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But public land is public owned no? If it is then don't we, as owners, have the right to use the resource, subject to reasonable management? If so, would not the game on public land be available for use by the owners?

Last edited by bluefish; 01/14/21.

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Originally Posted by MuskegMan

Originally Posted by smokepole
Originally Posted by MuskegMan


No need to have any training or testing whatsoever. Dare to question another man at the public range about his firearm safety protocol - they are free to do as they godddamn please!!!


Bullsh*t.


Your BS meter is broken Smokey. You should have been able to tell from the first part of my post (which you did not quote to give full context) that I was BS-ing:

"Men are born from the womb kowing everything there is know about firearms, firearms safety and shooting proficiency. It's in our DNA for chrissakes."


So what's your point? And why bring "firearm safety protocol" into it? Like I said before it's possible to be a safe firearms handler and not pass a marksmanship test.



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I recently saw on TV a Scottish stag hunt where the hunter is not even allowed to carry the rifle! The fricken' guide/PH/regulator carries the cased rifle and when the time is right allows you to hold your own property and take aim.


Screw Europe.


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Everything aside...why would anyone want to encourage the government of any level to regulate anything more than it is today.

Hell...I spend my time trying to get rid of regulations. Freedom is a word I like above and beyond.

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Originally Posted by ledvm
Everything aside...why would anyone want to encourage the government of any level to regulate anything more than it is today.

Hell...I spend my time trying to get rid of regulations. Freedom is a word I like above and beyond.


Winner.

Close the thread.


You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.

You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
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