Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Express Rifles and Big Bores Only The great 458 Winchester. Everyone should own one at least once

jwp475,

Baie danke for the flowers.
I bet you liked that .475 Linebaugh bear picture.
I have cabin fever, like in Alaska but with no access to snowmobiles and dogsleds here.

Well said, I agree.

Bob

www.bigbores.ca

Currently -24° F. Here in Delta Junction.
Looks like the sun will be out today so that is nice.
I agree with jwp 475 , you should write an encyclopedia of your exploits in rifles.
James Watts didn't have near the knowledge stored in his grey matter that you do Ron.
And where would we be without his documenting what he did.

Sir Bob,
Baie danke.
I greatly enjoyed your latest blog entry.
That blog contains many books.

Sir Spruce,

Baie danke, buy a donkey for the flowers.

I have ordered the same bullet design as you did from Accurate Molds.
But I am making mine a 2-cavity brass with the 46-485N (yours) as one cavity



and the 46-485Z as the other cavity.



I also have the N.O.E. HTC459-500-SP-BP2 2-cavity aluminum mould on the way,



That is the one that FortuneCookie45LC found pleasing with PC paint at about Mach 1 MV.
Here is some data at N.O.E. shown with that HTC459-500-grainer:



The Accurate 46-485Z is sort of like that one but with the pointy tip cut off
from 0.080" meplat on the N.O.E. to 0.180" on the Accurate,
and N.O.E. is plain base, Accurate is GC.
I bet the stubbier 46-485N with 0.285" meplat FNGC is going to be the most accurate.

BTW, note that it takes 21 grains of UNIQUE to get that N.O.E. 500-grainer up to just over 1300 fps in the .458 WM.

With the 485-grain FNGC from Accurate, about 20 grains of UNIQUE might be good to Bagwell with a .458 WinMag.
13 grains of UNIQUE is going to be quite subsonic with that 485-grainer in the .458 WinMag, whose case capacity is like a 45-98 Sharps Substitute.

I'm nervous/ hoping Spruce King likes to feed this boolit.
If he won't I'll sell the mold and get one with a smaller meplat.
But, I think it will feed. It always fed the 510 gr Winchester soft nose.

Now a bit of business for Knights of the Crusade for Truth about the .458 Winchester Magnum.
For get-togethers at the Round Table, attire is casual with Bowie carried open or concealed as per personal preference.
A Bagwell is much preferred but you will not be turned away from business functions if a Ruana or lesser Bowie is all you can come up with.
Any formal knighting ceremonies will be carried out with a Bagwell Bowie as the ceremonial sword.



Sir Spruce,

Do not worry about that 0.285" meplat.
If you seat it short, in the crimping groove instead of in the lower grease grooves, it will feed in Spruce King like poop through a goose.

That Z boolit does look pretty cool !
I hope it shoots well.
It looks like NOE hasn't been reading The Mission ! Using 3031 instead of 2230 , 2495 or 335 .
No doubt that will be rectified soon 👍

Yep, that load data is a bit dated. I would substitute Hodgdon's BENCHMARK, grain for grain, for that antique IMR-3031.
For nostalgia's sake, BLACK POWDER !
Reminds me that I am going to switch to casting in soft alloy for paper-patched and BP loads for the .45-98 Sharps Belted, aka .458 WM+.
Ross Seyfried said that for Lead & Tin mixes, 40:1 is the softest and 20:1 is the hardest that worked well in his .461 Gibbs No. 2 with a 570-gr paper-patched.
He said that one time he sucked a case neck down the bore by trying too-soft, pure lead.

The .461 Gibbs rifles were chambered with tight necks.
The actual bore diameter of the rifles was .461", and grooves were ,472".
The greatest bullet diameter that can be loaded in the .461 Gibbs No. 2 case and still be able to chamber the round is .461" to .462".
So, the paper-patched lead slicks were about .453" diameter, patched up to .461" diameter including patch.
The rear third of the bullet obturated into the rifling, and the front two thirds of the paper-wrapped bullet rode the bore diameter.
It worked well in that Metford rifling with a bit of gain twist, might have gone from 1:22" at breech end to 1:18" at muzzle end of barrel.
Hence I shall try a soft lead slick of .442" diameter/ 530-gr weight patched up to bore diameter of .450" in the .45-98 Sharps Belted.
Big Blue is the other side of that brass, 2-cavity mould, so it will get cast in 20:1 also, which should still be pretty close to 579 grains.
BP for the paper-patched, Blackhorn 209 for Big Blue the FNGC with PC paint.

BHN of Lead/Tin:
40:1 = 8
30:1 = 9
20:1 = 10
10:1 = 11

I have seen clip-on wheel weights rated at 10 to 12 BHN.
I am leery of relying on wheel weights since I am not sitting on a big pile of them, and can't know the composition of COWW I might scratch up.
I will scratch up some certified Lead/Tin mixes instead, for consistency.

As for my newest dynamic duo of 485-grainers with GC and PC paint: Hard ball alloy and smokeless powders all the way
Recreate the original 450 NE 3-1/4 Inch ballistics with those.

2125 fps with a factory Hornady 500-gr DGX, 23" barrel.
2511 fps with a GSC HV 400-gr handload, 23" barrel.
Neither load uses compressed powder.
Ain't too shabby for the first 6 shots fired in a new barrel, .458 WM.
I feel pretty confident that this 23" barrel can do 2600 fps with 400-gr Woodleigh at COL of 3.425".
A 25" Shilen did 2627 fps with heavily compressed H4895.
And the .458 Lott cried "wee wee wee" all the way home.

Will trade for Bagwell Bowie, name your boot:



Ruana Deluxe Bowie at top, 9-1/2" blade, 20 ounces.
Ruana Early American Bowie at bottom, 11-1/2" blade, 30 ounces.
Will throw in the handmade scabbard for the heavier one, factory sheath for the lighter one.
Concealed carry of either of these will require the Bill Bagwell style of sheath, inside the belly sash or belt.
Do not try sticking it down a pants leg, keep it outside of pants.



VH: Initials of Vic Hangas, son-in-law of Rudy Ruana who founded Ruana Knife Works, Inc., in Bonner, MT.
Vic's sons still run it. R.I.P. Vic and Rudy.
Here is the biggest Bowie in their catalog, the "Classic Bowie" with 14" blade, their interpretation of Jim Bowie's original:



I learned leathercraft, self taught, while in prison.
The prison I was in did not offer a leathercraft program.
Had to do something to relieve the boredom of prison life.
I even made myself a leather prescription pad cover.
Retirement from prison life sure has been great.

Everybody needs a Bowie and a .458 Winchester Magnum.
They go together like peas and carrots.
They are required equipment for all Knights of the Crusade for Truth.

LOL, slappin leather livin' the Thug Life! .................................i'll get you a pic this weekend, Bagwell Bowie and 458 Winchester Magnum+.

Missing our old Buddy bad Sir Ron, all things Sharps rifles are different now, really a confused somber journey, if He could speak to me, I'm sure he'd holler carry on Son!

AMEN !

If I may be at Liberty to do so, if i see a Bagwell Bowie, buy it and give you a call?

Sir Jerry,

Knight's honor. Sounds like a plan.
Thank you very very much.
Or as Elvis would say in Afrikaans, baie baie danke.
And as the announcer says at the Happy Hunting Grounds Knife & Gun Show when Bill takes a break to bang the ram at 500 yards with barrel sights: "Bill Bagwell has left the house."

This rifle has proven good with smokeless loads and every cast and jacketed load tried in it so far.
Rifle weight being a little on the light side, it is important to have confidence in keeping any scopes or rear sights to stay attached in recoil.
Here is one way that works pretty well:



Here is the rear scope base when she was still wearing the factory walnut stock:

Nifty red dot is secure:



Or take your pick of one peep or another:



That fold-down/pop-up Magpul rear sight cold be put on the rear base, for long range harassing fire,
along with the FastFire3 on the front base for shorter range "fast fire" use.
7#15oz with both rear sights attached and otherwise naked and empty rifle.
Add 4 rounds of ammo and still under 8.5#.

The scopes add more weight securely:





7#13oz dry weight with one peep only:

To avoid spoiling the incredible lightness of bearing such a magic wand:





Adjustable LOP and an extra slice of high-density foam rubber inside that LOP adjuster do not make recoil worse:

Compare the LA-3.4" LA to the LA-3.6" Winchester M70: