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paper cartridges #15965049 04/02/21
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deerstalker Offline OP
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while sitting here needing something to do, i cruised into the dark realm of blackpowder mystics on youtube. big mistake!
i have had a 51 navy for about 15 years and a walker about the same length of time. both have maybe 3 cylinders fired through them. i detested the loading procedure.
i watched a vid about making paper cartridges. next thing i knew i was turning a mandrel and drilling a capping block. wife was chirping about slow coffee filters so they migrated into my mess.
printed off the pattern for the papers and went to work cutting and gluing. big fly in the ointment was i only have super glue. not going to stop me!
after i glued 5 or 6 papers to my fingers, mandrel, and block, that little fly did stop me. i may be slow but i can learn.
well i got to digging about in my night stand and found a pack of bugler's rolling papers. i had watched more than one video;)!

these papers had been in the glove box of a pick-up i got rid of 20 years ago, along with a candle.
after i destroyed most of the papers getting them apart, i cut one in half, rolled it around my tapered mandrel and in the best old west fashion licked the glue edge. it actually worked!
i then twisted the overhanging tail, stuffed it in my block, smacked it on the counter to crush it flat. made five more. charged them with 25g fffg, them with the remaining super glue dabbed on the 454 balls topped them off. left them for about 2 hours and loaded them in the navy.
this was all after dark last night. about 1 am i woke with the two brain cells i have talking to each other. "what if those balls are super glued to the cylinder? says one . Naw! says the other. they kept it up all night.
just fired my first 6 paper cartridges and those two idiots can go to sleep now!.
Have the wife picking me up some new papers and a glue stick. options. got to have options. don't take much to occupy a old fart.
keep yer powder dry!
these are made for my navy. paper is long enough for the walker too. of course i crush the ball down to the powder in the navy. smoke em if you got em.

[Linked Image]


the consolidation of the states into one vast republic, sure to be aggressive abroad and despotic at home, will be the certain precursor of that ruin which has overwhelmed all those that have preceded. Robert E Lee
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Re: paper cartridges [Re: deerstalker] #15965429 04/02/21
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know that is outstanding problem solving !

Re: paper cartridges [Re: deerstalker] #15965554 04/02/21
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When I was cowboy action shooting I made poet cartridges for my 1860 Armies. They sped up reloads considerably. I did get some funny looks from the clerk at the convenience store when I would by the rolling papers


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Re: paper cartridges [Re: deerstalker] #15965771 04/02/21
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deerstalker Offline OP
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paper cartridges are as old as percussion revolvers. why i never used them before i don't know. wife came home with a pack of new buglers papers and three glue sticks. haven't had to use the glue sticks yet. rolled 25 cartridges with the buglers then ran out of steam. tomorrow i will burn them!


the consolidation of the states into one vast republic, sure to be aggressive abroad and despotic at home, will be the certain precursor of that ruin which has overwhelmed all those that have preceded. Robert E Lee
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
Re: paper cartridges [Re: deerstalker] #15967623 04/03/21
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I have been playing with my 1858 Remington lately. The paper cartridges work fine with round ball. I tried the Johnson and Dow bullets, and boy do those shoot well. But I would have to modify the frame and plunger of the revolver to load those with the cylinder in the gun. I can still make paper cartridges with them and load the cylinder in my press.

Video posted here


https://youtu.be/CWTiRzbpRpI


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Re: paper cartridges [Re: deerstalker] #15967665 04/03/21
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.454 ball in a 51 Navy?

Last edited by Mauser_Hunter; 04/03/21.

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Re: paper cartridges [Re: Mauser_Hunter] #15967833 04/03/21
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1851

Re: paper cartridges [Re: Hooker22] #15968185 04/03/21
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Originally Posted by Hooker22
1851


I know I shot two of them in CAS. Mine were .36 cal like the real ones. Maybe someone made a .45 version but it would still be a bear to use a .454 ball.?

Last edited by Mauser_Hunter; 04/03/21.

Money can't buy you happiness, but it can buy you a hunting license and that's pretty close.
Re: paper cartridges [Re: Mauser_Hunter] #15970684 04/04/21
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saddlegun Offline
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Originally Posted by Mauser_Hunter
.454 ball in a 51 Navy?


Yes. Pietta does, and other repro companies did produce .44 Navies.

I bought one and it works fine. Not surprising when you consider that Sam Colt shrewdly built the 1860 Army on an 1851 Navy frame, allowing him to use all of the same internal parts.

He altered the cylinder frame with that step to accomodate the stepped and larger diameter .44 caliber cylinder, and added a longer grip frame and a longer streamlined round barrel with a new rack and pinion loading lever. Voila! A completely new .44 revolver.

Colt could simply have produced a .44 caliber 1851 Navy, but chose to update the design instead.

The .44 cylinder only needs to be larger at the ball end obviously, since a cap & ball revolver uses loose powder or paper cartridges. Also, it was the introduction of the Bessemer steel process that made a small diameter .44 cylinder possible, allowing Colt to replace wrought iron which he previously used.

The same concept allowed him to produce the Pocket Navy .36 caliber revolver on a .31 caliber Baby Dragoon frame.

Check out this duelist1954 video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GV38iQwySCs

Re: paper cartridges [Re: Mauser_Hunter] #15972723 04/07/21
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deerstalker Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Mauser_Hunter
Originally Posted by Hooker22
1851


I know I shot two of them in CAS. Mine were .36 cal like the real ones. Maybe someone made a .45 version but it would still be a bear to use a .454 ball.?

well to be accurate, my Lyman mold throws .4525 ball. just a nice little ring shaved when loaded. 15 yards with the paper cartridges i handicap it into a 3 inch group one handed.


the consolidation of the states into one vast republic, sure to be aggressive abroad and despotic at home, will be the certain precursor of that ruin which has overwhelmed all those that have preceded. Robert E Lee
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
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Re: paper cartridges [Re: deerstalker] #15972983 04/07/21
Joined: Nov 2013
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Pappy348 Online Content
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capandball on YouTube, sells kits for making various paper cartridges and boxes to hold them, along with other stuff. His videos are well worth watching too. He’s a Hungarian Military History teacher (professor?) and competes in international ML matches. Hunts with originals and replicas too.

His video on a pair of original wheellock pistols is amazing. I never knew how fast those locks could be.

https://capandball.com/termekkategoria/capandball-products-2/


What fresh Hell is this?
Re: paper cartridges [Re: deerstalker] #15974665 04/08/21
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deerstalker Offline OP
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thanks Pappy. if it ever stops raining i have some paper and powder to burn.


the consolidation of the states into one vast republic, sure to be aggressive abroad and despotic at home, will be the certain precursor of that ruin which has overwhelmed all those that have preceded. Robert E Lee
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
Re: paper cartridges [Re: deerstalker] #15975580 04/08/21
Joined: Nov 2013
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Pappy348 Online Content
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He just posted a video on YouTube about tube primers, used on some Yurrupean flintlock conversions. He made his own with copper foil and roll caps. The antique rifle he used was pretty dang accurate.



What fresh Hell is this?
Re: paper cartridges [Re: deerstalker] #15979323 04/09/21
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deerstalker Offline OP
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just got a shipment of stump remover. now i will nitrate my paper for less residue.
whipped up a batch of BP also today. only charcoal i had was some mesquite for the BBQ. mixed up a batch and after i screened it it was about fffg. loaded one paper cartridge with 30gv under a .454 ball. fired it out of my walker. barely out. the smoldering paper was at my feet and the ball went 3 feet. lots of smoke though! grin
got to get some willow .

Last edited by deerstalker; 04/09/21.

the consolidation of the states into one vast republic, sure to be aggressive abroad and despotic at home, will be the certain precursor of that ruin which has overwhelmed all those that have preceded. Robert E Lee
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~

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