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Oily business among motorcycles #15974967 04/08/21
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Jim in Idaho Offline OP
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Yeah, it's a click bait title. wink

Anyway, here is an interesting study done showing the cleanliness of oil on the first service oil change of motorcycles from various manufacturers. Except for China - they really do make total crap - the results are kind of surprising, particular the Royal Enfields from the new plant in India. Worth the 7 1/2 minutes if one is interested in this kind of thing.

*** Spoiler below video ***








For those that like spoilers, here are the results ranked from cleanest to dirtiest oil:
1. Royal Enfield
2. BMW
3. KTM
4. Yamaha
5. Kawasaki
6. Honda
7. Triumph
8. Suzuki
9. Harley Davidson
10. Aprilia
11. Ducati
12. Yin Xiang - these suck ass in a major way


Gunnery, gunnery, gunnery.
Hit the target, all else is twaddle!
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Re: Oily business among motorcycles [Re: Jim in Idaho] #15975021 04/08/21
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KFWA Offline
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The Royal Enfield oil is clean because you have to replace all the oil that leaks out every 100 miles.

Last edited by KFWA; 04/08/21.
Re: Oily business among motorcycles [Re: Jim in Idaho] #15975048 04/08/21
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centershot Offline
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Would be an interesting study to do on new 1/2 ton trucks.


A true sportsman counts his achievements in proportion to the effort involved and fairness of the sport. - S. Pope
Re: Oily business among motorcycles [Re: Jim in Idaho] #15975080 04/08/21
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KFWA Offline
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Slightly off topic but I watch a youtube channel called Project Farm

This guy does alot of tests in regards to oil.

The one I recently watched he took a 30 year old motor oil called Arco that had graphite in it and compared it to modern Quaker state oil.

The Quaker State was superior in cold starting, but did not contain wear additives and was inferior to engine protection (except in cold starts) than the 30 year old oil with graphite. The Quaker State also resulted in a run time of 44 minutes and 30 seconds versus 44 minutes and 10 seconds on a motor test, so the claims of increased fuel efficiency , at least compared to 30 year old motor oil are true, not so much for engine wear. The older oil did have a noticeable evaporation compared to the modern oil which might lead to a discussion on modern motors not burning as much oil as older motors when the oil is the actual differentiator.

Then he took modern oil - I can't remember which - but it wasn't Quaker State and added graphite to it.

It increased compression in the test motor by 15 PSI - which would kind of lead you to believe that adding graphite to modern oil would give you the best of both worlds, but when he took the head off the pistons, heads, everything was coated in an oil graphite mixture. That might be a good thing, I don't know

Anyways, it was interesting to watch. I believe that adding a table spoon of graphite to your oil in an older lawn mower engine is probably more good than bad based on his tests.

Last edited by KFWA; 04/08/21.
Re: Oily business among motorcycles [Re: Jim in Idaho] #15975107 04/08/21
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gunzo Offline
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I must have missed the part where it was indicated they all used the same lube so that one very big variable wouldn't be a player.

I.E. the worst oil in the best engine is likely to skew results.

Actually, the test meant even less when I think more about it. Different riders on each unit not likely even 2 of them would treat an engine the same, warmups, shift intervals, etc. etc.

IC-A

Re: Oily business among motorcycles [Re: Jim in Idaho] #15975181 04/08/21
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MM879 Offline
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Interesting study. I would not take the results seriously. The obvious gets in the way too often. I have a KTM 400 xcw that would paint the oil black in less than 100 miles. The similar Honda engines would go 10 - 20 times farther before oil staining. The problem with the KTM was a solid cast iron oil control ring stolen from Porsche engine designs. The KTM oil control ring was much, much softer than the rough nikasil cylinder coating. The problem of the rough nicasil and the butter ring would have the KTM worn out in less than 25 hours. I fixed the KTM design problem by switching to a Woessner piston with three-piece automotive oil control ring. I installed the Woessner piston and ring on a worn smooth nikasil bore. It took longer to break in but, the result was good. My KTM will match the similar Honda engine for initial oil staining.

Re: Oily business among motorcycles [Re: gunzo] #15975458 04/08/21
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Originally Posted by gunzo
I must have missed the part where it was indicated they all used the same lube so that one very big variable wouldn't be a player.

I.E. the worst oil in the best engine is likely to skew results.

Actually, the test meant even less when I think more about it. Different riders on each unit not likely even 2 of them would treat an engine the same, warmups, shift intervals, etc. etc.


Add in the fact that different bikes have different engine speed ranges..
BOWs tend to be lower revving bikes than ducatis and Japanese sport bikes...

At least from the auto side current BMW auto engines have much tighter tolerances than older ones...
And of course modern cold-hot viscosity oils are supposedly better for the close tolerances...


-OMotS



"If memory serves fails me..."
Quote: ( unnamed) "been prtty deep in the cooler todaay "
Re: Oily business among motorcycles [Re: KFWA] #15975673 04/08/21
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ChuckKY Offline
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Originally Posted by KFWA
The Royal Enfield oil is clean because you have to replace all the oil that leaks out every 100 miles.



You know why the British where never known for building computers?




They couldn't figure out how to make them leak oil.

Re: Oily business among motorcycles [Re: KFWA] #15975758 04/08/21
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ringworm Offline
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Originally Posted by KFWA
The Royal Enfield oil is clean because you have to replace all the oil that leaks out every 100 miles.


What does leaking oil in a Harley tell you?
It still has pull in it.


TRUMP SCOTT 2024
Re: Oily business among motorcycles [Re: Jim in Idaho] #15975785 04/08/21
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gwrench Offline
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I wonder what was in the respective filters?


We all know advertising works, we just don’t think it works on US!
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Re: Oily business among motorcycles [Re: ringworm] #15975812 04/08/21
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benchman Offline
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Originally Posted by ringworm
Originally Posted by KFWA
The Royal Enfield oil is clean because you have to replace all the oil that leaks out every 100 miles.


What does leaking oil in a Harley tell you?
It still has pull in it.

I realize Harley had oil problems in the past, but my 2009 Lowrider doesn't use hardly any, and leaks zero. 24,000 plus miles on it, so it isn't super low mileage, either. Really does very well for an air cooled motor .

Re: Oily business among motorcycles [Re: ChuckKY] #15975855 04/08/21
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Originally Posted by ChuckKY
Originally Posted by KFWA
The Royal Enfield oil is clean because you have to replace all the oil that leaks out every 100 miles.



You know why the British where never known for building computers?




They couldn't figure out how to make them leak oil.

From the Germans:

Lucas parts are Bosch parts that failed final inspection.

Re: Oily business among motorcycles [Re: benchman] #15976996 04/09/21
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Redneck Offline
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Originally Posted by benchman
Originally Posted by ringworm
Originally Posted by KFWA
The Royal Enfield oil is clean because you have to replace all the oil that leaks out every 100 miles.


What does leaking oil in a Harley tell you?
It still has pull in it.

I realize Harley had oil problems in the past, but my 2009 Lowrider doesn't use hardly any, and leaks zero. 24,000 plus miles on it, so it isn't super low mileage, either. Really does very well for an air cooled motor .
None of the HDs I've had since '05 have leaked so much as a drop...


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Re: Oily business among motorcycles [Re: Jim in Idaho] #15977012 04/09/21
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Teal Offline
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The whole "Harleys leak oil" thing as a general rule basically stopped with the introduction of the Evo.

That was 1984. It's been a while....

That said - had a TC and 2 different M8's - zero issues.


Me

Re: Oily business among motorcycles [Re: Jim in Idaho] #15977020 04/09/21
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JSTUART Offline
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Originally Posted by Jim in Idaho
Yeah, it's a click bait title. wink

Anyway, here is an interesting study done showing the cleanliness of oil on the first service oil change of motorcycles from various manufacturers. Except for China - they really do make total crap - the results are kind of surprising, particular the Royal Enfields from the new plant in India. Worth the 7 1/2 minutes if one is interested in this kind of thing.

*** Spoiler below video ***








For those that like spoilers, here are the results ranked from cleanest to dirtiest oil:
1. Royal Enfield
2. BMW
3. KTM
4. Yamaha
5. Kawasaki
6. Honda
7. Triumph
8. Suzuki
9. Harley Davidson
10. Aprilia
11. Ducati
12. Yin Xiang - these suck ass in a major way




That fellow is an amusing presenter...I enjoyed that.


These are my opinions, feel free to disagree.
Re: Oily business among motorcycles [Re: Jim in Idaho] #15977027 04/09/21
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high_country_ Online Content
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Air filtration plays a MAJOR part in oil cleanliness. Every gulp of air is stuffed into the oiled hole and compressed.


Originally Posted by BrentD

I would not buy something that runs on any kind of primer given the possibility of primer shortages and even regulations. In fact, why not buy a flintlock? Really. Rocks aren't going away anytime soon.

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