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The Code of Conduct


I
I am an American fighting in the forces that guard my country and our way of life, I am prepared to give my life in their defense.

II
I will never surrender of my own free will. If in command, I will never surrender the members of my command while they still have the means to resist.

III
If I am captured I will continue to resist by all means available. I will make every effort to escape and aid others to escape. I will accept neither parole nor special favors from the enemy.

IV
If I become a prisoner of war, I will keep faith with my fellow prisoners. I will give no information or take part in any action which might be harmful to my comrades. If I am senior, I will take command. If not, I will obey the lawful orders of those appointed over me and will back them up in every way.

V
Should I become a prisoner of war, I am required to give name, rank, service number, and date of birth. I will evade answering further questions to the utmost of my ability. I will make no oral or written statements disloyal to my country and its allies.

VI
I will never forget that I am an American fighting for freedom, responsible for my actions, and dedicated to the principles which made my country free. I will trust in my God and in the United States of America.


-The Code of Conduct is a Presidential Directive empowered by th UCMJ. Violations are punishable up to and including DEATH!-



I so rarely come to this particular string of the forum because of the anger and disappointment it generates. The use of freedom earned so dearly by those of us that serve or have served is disheartening to say the least.

It seems to me the loudest opinions against the military and military action are from those who never served. Some of the negative statements I've seen are stated with the utmost display of ignorance. I wonder, would you be able to express your opinion without those of us that are willing to die for your freedom to do so? How much is your life worth?

So, shut up and be thankful that you give us a job? Let's take a look at the reality of those outstanding benefits that are paid out of the unwilling taxpayer's hands.

The benefits are so outstanding that no one wants to join. Depending on the unit, manning is about 60%. When is the last time you worked 60-80 hours without overtime?

An E-1 has a starting salary of $1064.70 per month.

If you have a family, you can look forward to and additional $447.60 for housing and $242.81

A total of $1755.11 MONTHLY

You qualify for food stamps until you reach E-6 (our base paper says it's part of our benefits package so we should pursue it).

Let's not forget the free medical (provided you are on a base with a hospital). Unless of course I get referred off base, then it's likely a co-pay / and my family has to go off base... I have counseled way too many troops through eventual bankruptcy over this one. I'm doing well personally. I have a normally healthy family, I only owe a couple months pay to local docs.

Try explaining to your kids that you will be gone for a few months. Sorry, I'll miss your Birthday, Thanksgiving, Christmas, your first ball game, and our tenth wedding anniversary. We'll go fishing next year. We'll visit Grandpa and Grandma next summer...maybe. You just hope the little ones still remember you when you get home.

How about an AA/AS degree to be eligible for re-enlistment; won't likely make it past E-6 without a BA/BS.

Retirement? After 20 years of such an easy life we get half our pay and no food or housing allowance. For the typical lowly enlisted man (that's what most of us are) - About $1000 monthly after tax. Of course we can always look forward to a VA disability. Maybe make it to $2000 a month...

So why do it? -Conviction of Purpose- Lack of support for the military makes it very hard to remember the why... Someone has to pay for your freedom. If you're not willing, then at least support the individuals that are. The time for protest is over. Support the troops!

Isn't it ironic that freedom isn't free.

What have you done to earn your freedom?

Thanks for your support
Strider

Strider, it's just like Harly-Davidsons, if you have to explain they will never understand anyway!

I served in the 17th Cavalry, 82nd Airborne Division during the early 70's.

If I had my way, you would not be eligble to vote in any elections unless you
had served your country in the Military. Maybe figure out some other service for those who physically or for what ever ligitimate reason, could not serve and defend our country. I think that would be a reasonable request.

Shades of Heinlein (Starship Troopers). Might have some merit. Just the mention of it is enough to start the howling.

My father served in the Navy, I was in the Navy, and my son is currently aboard a nuc sub in the Navy. That does not mean I have to agree with a president and if I don't I am unpatriotic. That seems to be the trouble with the far right, if you don't agree with them they start calling you names and saying you don't support the troops.

Sounds alot like Nazi Germany in WWII. You have to be a patriot and support Hitler. To not do so is unpatriotic. The very essence of freedom is to actually be free to express your opinion. It seems that I have heard many times on this board that if you don't agree with the war in Iraq and you express that opinion, you are not a good patriotic American.

I support the troops and want them all to do their duty to their country. The reasons for this war seem to change daily. Have you seen all the weapons of mass destruction that have been found? Take off the blinders and see that this war was fought for oil and to get Hussein for trying to assasinate George I.

You're kidding yourself if you believe all the B.S. from Washington. Read your history books and see what those unpatriotic folks like Thomas Jefferson, Ben Franklin, John Adams and many other like Americans said about the right and the NEED to not blindly follow the government and the importance of dissent.

We have seen the results of nationalistic fervor in Nazi Germany.

You don't need to list your credentials in order to express your opinion. You're a citizen. That's all it takes. Everyone has a right to their opinion and a right to express it. Don't see that anyone here has tried to stop anyone from doing that. Some opinions are more popular than others. That's life. If you have the courage to express an unpopular opinion that's fine. Just don't expect everyone else to embrace your opinion or your cause just because you feel courageous, virtuous or right. You also should realize that expressing your opinion can have consequences and be prepared to accept them. That's part of having the courage of your convictions. Next time you're feeling sorry for yourself because others haven't "seen the light" as you have you might advance a logical and reasonable argument to support your opinion. You'll get a lot farther that way than by resorting to name calling. That just shows how bankrupt your argument is. Kinda like "food good, fire bad".

As far as the oil thing goes, you need to go back to school and learn some simple math. If all we wanted was the oil we could have gotten a lot more a lot cheaper by just buying it.

Jefferson, Franklin, Adams et al were not only unpatriotic, they were down right tratiorous toward their legitimate government. Fortunately for them, and for us, their opinion prevailed. Had it gone the other way we'd have all been taught what a hero Benedict Arnold was. Do you have the courage of your convictions that they had? They recognized the consequences of stating their opinion and stood to lose a lot more for it than a little heckling. If you want to call me names, go for it. It won't make your argument any stronger. Face it. You lost. There was a war. We won. Its over. Move on. There'll be plenty of things for you to disagree about in the future. Look forward to that. Embrace the future!

First off, the topic asks specifically, what have you done to earn your freedom. Hence my reply stating how for the past 3 generations, one of my family has served in the military.

Secondly, I don't expect everyone to agree with me or feel sorry for myself. If anything, I feel sorry for the people who blindly accept the governments propaganda and can't ask themselves "Why did the government have to lie about the nuclear arms?" My experiences have taught me that once you hear one lie, a bunch more usually follow.

As far as it not being for the oil, what was it for? To free the Iraqi's? Why are we not going into the Congo? North Korea? Argentina? I've got news for you. Are economy is dependent on oil. Whoever controls the worlds oil supplies wields alot of power and that is what this war is about. Power.

As far as the name calling goes, you should really read the post again. I didn't call anyone any names. The reference to Nazi Germany was to point out to people the dangers of unquestiongly believing the propaganda put out by the government. I did not say anyone was a Nazi.

Would I have the courage of our forefathers? I don't know. I do know there were alot of loyalists who probaly supported England at all costs and thought of all the people we now refer to as patriots as a bunch of traitors who didn't support their country.

As for the war being over, I sure hope it is. This may end up being more of a mess than we realize.

Even so, as long as you're a citizen of the United States simply being a citizen is enough. We don't have to "earn" our freedom. We inherit it. Maybe we should have to earn it. Might value it more. But that's another discussion.


Then why do you seem so petulant when stating your opinion and responding to the responses you receive? Why aren't you giving others credit for using their intellect just as you've used yours to form their opinions? Is it because they don't agree with you that you consider them blind or is it because you see yourself as being more a more credible source of information than anything else they may have been exposed to? Just because someone disagrees with you that doesn't make them blind. It just means that they disagree with you. Do you have unequivocal proof that our government lied to us? If so show us. Do you really think that everyone who disagrees with you only listens to government news releases? Why can't you give those who disagree with you credit for making an informed decision just as you believe you have?


Have you ever even considered the possibility that any of the reasons given had merit? If our economy is dependent of oil then why aren't we doing more drilling? Could it be because the same people who opposed the war oppose more drilling in the U.S. ? Of course the war was about power. That's what war is all about. That's what everything is all about. While most won't acknowledge it every action a person makes is about seeking or relinquishing power. Often it comes disquised as humanitarian aid. Doesn't providing someones food and having the ability to increase or decrease the available supply amount to power?


If you didn't come right out and say it, the implication was there.



I don't know if I would either.


You may well be correct, but look at the bright side. It will give you a whole new basket of issues to disagree with. Don't sit there gathering moss! Investigate the possibliities!

Strider,

Like T Lee said, Some will never understand.

Looks like a few things have changed in the "Code of Conduct" if memory serves me right. Looking at "V" in particular.
The pay has for sure changed over the years. When I went in, the E-1 was making $209.00 a month, didn't know anything about additional allowances for living off base, since we couldn't have dependents with us, I guess they could have lived in the jungle for free though. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> I think the Marine Corps is looking hard at developing a total "single Marine" Marine Corps. No married soldiers what so ever. Time has a way of changing things for sure!

They have my support! Good pay or not, good benefits or not, nothing can compensate these Men and Women for the job they do!

Strider,

As a military member myself, I question some of the quotes you printed, though I know exactly where they came from.

1.If you have a family, you can look forward to and additional $447.60 for housing and $242.81

The $242.81 for BAS is a give me, but the $447.60 for housing, well that depends on where you live. Could be more depending on economy.

2. Next thing, is one thing I find is one thing a friend that has done research found out to be false. And where you got it at I haven't a clue
How about an AA/AS degree to be eligible for re-enlistment; won't likely make it past E-6 without a BA/BS.
In the Air Force, 13.4% of the enlisted have a AA/AS degree, and only 4.7% have a BA/BS, and like .13% a MA/MS degree. Where do you get you must have a AA/AS degree to re-enlist that's new to me, considering I re-enlisted two years ago with out one. I do have one now, as well as a BA. To make E-6 a BA/BS degree. No where in the testing system of the AF is it required to make E-6. Also I've seen the statistics of E-9's with a BA/BS, and it is low. Don't take this as a slam, as in no way is it, but I'd like to know where you got that info at.

Oh, and also with the Food Stamps, that depends on the state. Heck my wife and I don't even qualify for WIC after our son is due and my wife is out of work without pay. Why, they claim I make too much as an E-5.

Hudge

If I remember correctly I used to begin "I am an American fighting Man. I serve in the forces that guard our country..." Perhaps a nod to the women in service was deemed necessary.

Howdy,

Don't blame your questions. I figured after I had posted such a topic I deserved to get my share of ribbings. I had read a few of the other posts, guess I got my nickers in a twist. Anyway it made me feel better :-) I've certainly read enough of of them to know they generate little of value. But I considered that with the general integrity of the forum members here it might make some interesting discussion, and so I owe some answers.

I'll hit the ones I remember...

Yes, the code of conduct has changed a number of times over the years. The code of conduct was created by a Presidential Directive in 1955. The Korean War had left a desire to improve the conduct of our troops in the event they became a Prisoner of War. Probably due to a lack of training, 21 of them decided to stay in Korea after the war. PoW's performance improved greatly in Vietnam. Adjustments were made with the lessons learned during that war. Some of the requirements were "softened" or clarified after the Vietnam war. Changing the words "Bound" to "Required". In 88 President Reagan made the Code gender-nuetral.

The numbers for pay came right off the military pay scale. It's on the internet. I know there is a housing adjustment for cost of living in some areas, but I personally have never collected it. I've been in since 86. The adjustment is designed to off-set the additional cost so the member can afford equivalent housing in different areas. So that isn't an increase in life style.

Food stamps are highly encouraged by family services on this base. I have three E-4's in my shop that use them. One of my E-5's told me his family (2 kids) no longer qualified after the January pay raise. Thanks President Bush! I expect you are right in that it varys from state to state.

As for the degree's - I can see where my statements were misleading - let me clarify. I doubt it's much of a factor in the other Branches of Service, but I can offer some insight about the Air Force. The AA/AS degree issue is a MAJCOM requirement (AETC), not all servicemen are subject to this rule. Instructors are required to have one, in no more than 5 years. It's waiverable by commander (if they are close). The BA/BS issue is being pushed in PME. I set with a board of 12 CMSgts a few years ago, including the CMSgt Air Force and a Command Chief. One of the main topics was that we need to push a degree with the upcoming generation or they would not be competitive for promotion, and that it was only a matter of time before it was a requirement. It's not a requirement in all AFSC's, but it's an impossibility to make a Senior or Chief Board in my AFSC without one. Our last Chief promotion had a MS.

I think history and a few countries today would argue with you that freedom is not free. But I understand your point. We're fortunate enough in this country to be born free - as free as our system of government allows. Our fore-fathers earned it for us, our military maintains it. It's fortunate we have an established military, and it's fortunate that those who would not serve have the freedom to allow there taxes to pay someone else to do it. If you think that some other country wouldn't march right on in and take, us then you have more faith in humanity than I do.

No malice intended. I'm greatful to serve, and appreciate all the benefits and raises we have received in the past couple years. I just don't appreciate all the bashing that is given to the dedicated few willing to die for those that wouldn't do it at any price.

If freedom must be earned, then it's not a God-given right.

If it's a God-given right, then it doesn't have to be earned.

" ... We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness...."
(from the Declaration of Independence, that great foundation without which there would be no Constitution of the United States)

Robert Frost wrote with simple elegance of a similarly God-given right, in his poem "The Death of the Hired Man," where he said that home is where, when you go there, they have to take you in, and you don't have to have earned it. Freedom is like that: you don't have to have earned it -- any more than you have to earn the right to life.

Life, Liberty (freedom), and that marvelous catch-all category, the pursuit of happiness -- endowed (given) by our Creator, not earned or bought or bartered.

Inevitably endangered, yes. Necessarily defended, yes. To be preserved at whatever cost, yes. But not necessarily earned. Who deserves to live? Who deserves to be free? The instant when merit becomes a requirement, both life and freedom are subject to somebody else's judgement, decision, and whim.

Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness became mine by God-given right the instant I was born on 19 January 1931, without any requirement that I earn any of them, and each remains mine to this day when I'm old and physically unable either to earn it, or to defend it by any means other than verbal.

Let's not allow legitimately high-minded, high-zeal patriotism or a patriotic sense of responsibility for protecting and defending our rights to mislead us into the erroneous and erosive notion that we have to earn, merit, or deserve any of them. That idea cheapens and demeans the great purity of our rights.

[Howell, Kenneth E, U S Navy 417-24-10, 1949-1953]

WELL SAID! Dr. Howell, that is why we respect you Sir, your fine, simple elegance of prose. Me anyway.

Strider,

I was actually going to call you on the BAH, but since I've been deployed since Jan. I've yet to see a LES. Fortunatly the BAH did do up in our area, by almost $200 a month. Wow, that's finally enough to pay for 90% of the average rent in the area, not to include utilites. Also, with the AF being geared towards education, it still kills me on how many people do not take classes, especially since tuition assistance went to 100% now. I understand some places with the current ops tempo so high, college classes are out the door. I just got to a base that would allow me to continue my education. I should have said I'm finishing a BA as well as a BS, and I will be putting in for an instructor slot come Dec. Now you are right for those slots you need an AA/AS degree, but it is waiverable. I know this wonders from the original subject, but also I've met amny troops, that thought they could do better in the military than on the outside, only to claim they lost money by joining. Joining the military is some thing you do out of desire to defend your country, and love for your contry, not to gt rich by any means.

Hudge

Thanks, T Lee, but the only two things that "fine, simple elegance of prose" requires are simple logic and a few plain words. And, I guess, a stubborn reluctance to fall too readily into step with whatever "thinking" others express in our presence.

Precisely Sir, I am no fan of "fashion". I prefer the tried and true.

Thanks Ken, I was trying to get this same thing across to another member a month or so ago, I know he will read and respond so hang in there maybe you will succeed. With your writing skills I believe he may understand what you and I are saying. Thanks again! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Well said. Your reply puts everything back into perspective.

Mac

When I was a "new troop" there was a spree of flag burning in Oregan. A number of us boys were a bit irate and there was a lot of talk about taking leave or even going AWOL to drive over and kick some butt.

At the time we had a wing commander that had spent over seven years in Vietnam as a PoW. You can imagine that he had a great deal of respect among the troops. He told us that those people had a right to protest; it was their right to protest that we were here to protect and defend. He told us that we should not get so emotional about a piece of cloth, that it was the ideas behind that cloth that were important. It was those ideas that gave them the freedom to express themselves - in this case, burning the flag.

He had our attention, but the words were pretty hard to accept.

He continued the topic by showing a series of photos and short films from various events around the world. A lot of statistics were involved. All with the same general theme, people dying for their political and religious views. The number of people that were killed protesting communism in China alone were in the 10's of thousands. Estimated world totals from about WWI to present were in the 10's of millions.

His program ended with his captivity story from Vietnam. He was tortured and beaten for protecting the ideas he believed in. One of the common tactics of the Vietnam exploiters was to try and break their resolve by showing them propoganda films with protestors from America. They didn't have to create the footage, there was plenty of the real thing in the news. It was his belief in their right to make those protests that kept him from breaking. What a forgiving and understanding man he was! Aside from some sniffling, he had a very silent audience. I never heard another conversation about a trip to Oregan. To this day, I still can't perform Reville or Retreat without getting tears in my eyes.

The question has brought forth some interesting thoughts. The lesson is, or I hope it is, that we can and do have the rights to express our freedoms. But they don't come (or maybe I should say, aren't challenged) without a cost.

If you want to protest the war or the politics behind it, that is your right as an American Citizen. But if you don't support the individual that's willing to lay his life on the line to defend that right, you're missing the point.

Thanks,
Strider