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Foolishly I let my dads plain jane model 12 30 inch 12 gauge to my nephew when we broke up my dads guns. I think he traded it off because my brother never claims to know where it went...
I did the same with my uncles model 25 in a similar configuration.
Now I want one just to occasionally shoot and to remember by....
Well I have a lead on an estate sale that has several 12's and a 25.
Didnt the model 25 make improvements over the 12?
Which would you get and why?
Other than that, How was the show Mrs. Lincoln?
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I've owned several M12s, all 16 ga, have one left at this time. Excellent hunting guns in 16. As far as I know the M25 was not a takedown, I've only seen them in12 ga and not worth near as much as a M12. Others will chime in with more facts, but I believe a M12 is where its at.
Last edited by Kurt52; 05/04/21.
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I'd go for a Model 12 myself (or a nice Remington Model).
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I'd go for a Model 12 myself (or a nice Remington Model). 31l
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OP
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Other than that, How was the show Mrs. Lincoln?
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Model 25 was Winchester’s attempt at a budget Model 12
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Winchester's Model 25 was a non-takedown version of their popular Model 12 shotgun that was offered from 1949 to 1954. About 88,000 Model 25s were manufactured in this period. Get the Model 12.
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Many people with Model 25’s wished they had a Model 12 but I doubt there was anybody with a Model 12 that wished they had a 25!
Deadlines and commitments, what to leave in, what to leave out...
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To say I am a model 12 fan is a huge understatement. I have several books and many articles about the amazing model 12. They are just stunning. I can understand weakness whether perceived or real. I have always perceived the takedown of the model 12 as a weakness though I have never seen one fail. I just don't feel comfortable with any takedown guns. Just about all takedown rifles have wiggles. I would much prefer a solid frame shotgun to a takedown. Also the magazine tube to barrel attachment I felt was iffy and have seen many that are loose and cant be tightened any more. Having never owned a model 25 it addresses these issue of mine. I would like to purchase a model 25 to take apart and study but they don't show up often in my neck of the woods. For me anyhow I feel the 25 could be the equal of the 12 since they have identical parts made on the same assembly line. The drawback for me anyhow was the lack of any options. Twelve gauge only, no rib, plan wood just a black and white generic gun. If you think I am bashing the great model 12 you will have to visit someday and see my safe full of them.
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Back when we hunted with smooth bores and slugs, the solid frame 25 was among the most accurate slug guns and well worth scoping.
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The Model 25 is in the dustbin of history, while the Model 12 keeps its stature. Model 12s are about the best value for dollar in today’s market, especially nice in 16 gauge.
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Model 12s are cheap these days. A 16 is as heavy as a 12. 20s are nice but still a lot more to cart than an Ithaca Featherlite.
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I would go Model 12. The Model 25s I've handled have slightly heavier barrels and weigh a little more. Plus I believe all 25s had the dogleg operating rod, which had a reputation of breaking. Some of the M12s had this operating rod but most did not. Model 12s are cheap these days. A 16 is as heavy as a 12. 20s are nice but still a lot more to cart than an Ithaca Featherlite. Incorrect. The 16 gauge Model 12 is the same weight as a 20 gauge Model 12. A 16 gauge flat forend gun with 28" plain barrel will run about 6 5/8 pounds where as a 12 gauge will go somewhere around 7 5/8 pounds. Haven't yet picked up an Ithaca so don't know how those compare.
Last edited by DesertMuleDeer; 05/09/21.
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My 16ga Featherlight 37 is 6#, and my 20ga Remington 17 is 5 3/4#.
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Model 12s are cheap these days. A 16 is as heavy as a 12. 20s are nice but still a lot more to cart than an Ithaca Featherlite. Way off base. The 12 gauge Model 12 is much heavier than its 16 gauge sister, as there are only two frames for Model 12s (excluding 3” magnum 12s). The 16s were built on the 20 gauge frames which preceded the other gauges. My 1958 vintage 16 gauge field gun, with 28” modified barrel, weighs 6 1/2# on the nose. A similar 12 weighs about 3/4# more.
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Ok, Ithaca is still FAR lighter, ejects out bottom and will run forever.
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Glad to see Desert Mule Deer and GF1 set the record straight on 16 ga M12's vs NYNY's incorrect comments.
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I wonder if he trashes the 37 on the Ithaca Collectors page. Oh wait...there isn’t one.
Deadlines and commitments, what to leave in, what to leave out...
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Ok, Ithaca is still FAR lighter, ejects out bottom and will run forever. Well, yea it does. And Remington wised up after the Model 17, made the 31 and then 870 side ejects. I’d pay extra not to have bottom eject. As to lighter, you are right there too. Except I am among the no doubt challenged crowd whose shooting goes to hell as gun weight approaches six pounds. The 16 gauge Model 12 is nigh into perfect in that and most other regards.
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"The 16 gauge Model 12 is nigh into perfect in that and most other regards".
Obviously GF1 has a 16 ga M12 and understands how fine a hunting shotgun they are for himself and a lot of the rest of us!
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I'll take my M37R 16 ga Ithaca over the model 12 16 ga. Anytime. Or my Belgian Sweet 16 ga over either. Mb
" Cheapest velocity in the world comes from a long barrel and I sure do like them. MB "
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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I’d rather have a Ithaca Model 37.
"Allways speak the truth and you will never have to remember what you said before..." Sam Houston
Texans, "We say Grace, We Say Mam, If You Don't Like it, We Don't Give a Damn!"
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
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All you guys who like Ithaca's and prefer them over the model 12's, make me happy because that makes more model 12's for me. I have a few early 37's but never shoot them, preferring to go Winchester. But there are always those Chevy lovers when they know Ford's are better.
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I'd rather have a David McKay Brown, but the question was 12 or 25....
12
laissez les bons temps rouler
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All you guys who like Ithaca's and prefer them over the model 12's, make me happy because that makes more model 12's for me. I have a few early 37's but never shoot them, preferring to go Winchester. But there are always those Chevy lovers when they know Ford's are better. I hope you end up with every m12 you want including the ones I've had where some previous owner took them down and proceeded to enlarge the chamber in the barrel to a point it is larger than the chamber ring extension so that when high brass loads are fired they have sticky extraction issues. I'll stick with one piece chambers myself. Good luck . Mb
" Cheapest velocity in the world comes from a long barrel and I sure do like them. MB "
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Proves the point, some have the ability to break most anything if they try. However, that fails to be reason to condemn the object.
Like 37’s more than a little, but never found any compelling reason to prefer bottom eject. In fact, twice I have had 37’s start dumping live rounds from the magazine. However, an easy fix..
laissez les bons temps rouler
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I had a M/25 that I sent o E.R. Shaw for one of their rifled barrels, I mounted a Weaver V4.5 and it was for many years my slug gun. It shot very accurately and accounted for many whitetails.
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Model 12 vs 25. Ive got both and like others said nobody has a model 12 that wishes they had a 25. But if you want pump shotgun perfection a 16 gauge model 12 is just about as good as it gets . Just be sure to get one after the mid 20s 1925 or 27 so its chambered in 2 3/4" vs the earlier 2 9/16"
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To say I am a model 12 fan is a huge understatement. I have several books and many articles about the amazing model 12. They are just stunning. I can understand weakness whether perceived or real. I have always perceived the takedown of the model 12 as a weakness though I have never seen one fail. I just don't feel comfortable with any takedown guns. Just about all takedown rifles have wiggles. I would much prefer a solid frame shotgun to a takedown. Also the magazine tube to barrel attachment I felt was iffy and have seen many that are loose and cant be tightened any more. Having never owned a model 25 it addresses these issue of mine. I would like to purchase a model 25 to take apart and study but they don't show up often in my neck of the woods. For me anyhow I feel the 25 could be the equal of the 12 since they have identical parts made on the same assembly line. The drawback for me anyhow was the lack of any options. Twelve gauge only, no rib, plan wood just a black and white generic gun. If you think I am bashing the great model 12 you will have to visit someday and see my safe full of them. The weakness on a mdl 25 was the "dog leg" action bar where it attached to the forend, I've saw several that broke and had to welded/brazed back together. They are not the equal to the mdl 12. As far as take down looseness. Don't do it often. . And looseness can be fixed by adjusting the barrel collar or replacing it with a larger one(they came in different sizes).
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I have a first year 1912 in 16 gauge and a 1917 built 12 gauge . I use the short shells in both and see no loss of performance for the hunting I do with them . Unless you feel the need for a high condition gun to hunt with m 1912 and m12 guns can usually be found for a very reasonable price . The only reason I can see to buy a m25 is to fill a hole if you collect Winchester shotguns . They are good enough guns but they are not equal to the 12's .
Grumpy old man with a gun.....Do not touch .
Better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.
Don't bother my monument and I'll leave yours alone.
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OP here again...
I saw a model 12 restored heavy duck no rib barrel 3 inch magnum that had retrofit inside the barrel choke tubes. They look thin.
Gun is very nice, but the $699 price tag still seems high.
All I would do with it is clay shoot or an occasional grouse hunt.
Is that a fair deal?
HD
Other than that, How was the show Mrs. Lincoln?
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That’s a pretty steep price for what it is.
Deadlines and commitments, what to leave in, what to leave out...
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I heard once that the 37 Ithaca was a good gun. But as a young lad I was given a 16 gauge model 12 from my father and I had no reason to ever find out anything more about other guns. I agree with all statements made regarding model 12 and model 25’s. Nothing at all wrong with the 25 but I’d rather have a 12. If you’re shopping for a 12 gauge they seem to be moving a lot slower than small bore model 12s and you could likely find a good buy either a 12 or even less for a 25.
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