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A lot of that came from the RCC. Science was severely restricted for a thousand years. Men who refuted the RCC's unchristian doctrine were treated as criminals and many were executed in very unchristian ways.

Addressing both of these quotes...

First, the quote from DBT - indeed, the Bible states clearly it is God's Word. From Genesis 3:4, it was that "mythical" Devil that first called God a Liar to Eve - and she bought the Big Lie. God wrote the account of our origins through Moses, a man He had a person-to-person, a "speak-in-person-in-real-time" relationship with - something few today could dare claim and tell the truth. This same Moses penned the very first words of the Holy Writ: "In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth". Gen. 1:1.

A person reading those words now has a decision - you either believe God is telling the truth here, or you believe fallen man's science and wisdom is telling the truth by calling God a Liar. If you believe the latter, then you have no business going any further into the Word of God. It is just a collection of words for you.

If, though, you choose to believe God is telling the truth here, then you're going to have to allow God the freedom to tell the creation story from His perspective, not from the perspective you want to believe it in.

Genesis 1:2-31 is God telling how He created what we call the universe, right down to the order He did this.

Day 1, He created the Earth, Heavens, and Light (Genesis 1:1 is a segue into verses 2-5; verse 2 simply describes the state of each, and verses 3-5 describe God's remedy to the darkness). There are NO stars or planets here - just heaven and earth.
Day 2, He created the firmament between the waters above and the waters below - strictly an action on earth. in effect, God creates an atmosphere between a layer of water above, and the ball of water below. Note: there is absolutely NO parallel in ANY "scientific" account of our origins which accounts for this.
Day 3, God creates dry land by calling it up from within the ball of water. Again, man's science does not grasp this. Man's science claims the reverse is true - that this world was a giant molten rock in space, until enough water condensed on its surface to for the seas. He then populates the earth with plant life - aquatic AND terrestrial.

This ends the first stage of Creation. Man's evolutionary ideas do not conform to this sequence of events; instead, man is demanding God to accept man's own version of a Big Bang, then billions of years, all because man cannot wrap his head around the scientific processes God used to pull this off the way He said He did.

I have found God to be rather direct in His approach to human understanding. Man tries to cloud and cloak everything of God with sophistries and mysticisms. God, in truth, simply lays it on the line here.

The next 3 days of Creation, God populates the Spheres He has created.

Day 4, He populates the cosmos with all the astronomical bodies we find there - stars, planets, sun and moon - and sets them in their designed course. Note that the Earth has now had 3 days of Light which had NO astronomic source, until Day 4, when the Sun takes over. Utterly impossible, according to Man's understanding. Yet, is God telling the truth here? Or is He lying?
Day 5, God populates the atmosphere and the hydrosphere by creating ALL avian and aquatic life forms. That, also, does not match any evolutionary paradigm I have come to know.
Day 6, God populates the dry land with all living animals, then Creates Man in two steps.

It is utterly impossible to overlay ANY evolutionary paradigm currently accepted to Man's science today. No, you can't mince time over the what a "day" constitutes to God.

Evolution is man trying to make sense of his origins after rejecting God and His Word. I applaud the atheist trying to do this; after all, we all need to have some sense of where we came from, so that we know why we are here today, and where we are going in the future.

Creation is God's telling us His perspective of how He brings things into existence: Creating real entities where they never existed before. All by His Word. I will also venture to say that God authored all of what we call Laws - Scientific, Engineering, Business, Justice, etc. If Man can discern there is a Law, God wrote it. Man just re-discovers it.

Any Christian does themselves a disservice by trying to overlay the Creation account with Man's evolutionary paradigms. However, from my perspective, it simply cannot be done without calling God a Liar.

I prefer to declare God is telling the truth here, and it is Man's Science that has not progressed to the point of understanding the processes God used. Believe it or not, we are NOT at the pinnacle of science and understanding and wisdom. In fact, I will dare to say that because we have rejected moving forward on science based on God's Word, we have plateaued, and are slipping back into a "reason-based" superstitious pseudo-religion, where PhD's are the new Temple Priests and gatekeepers of knowledge.

To address Hasting's comment - Our Creator God did not Create a new section of an existence attached to and older one. God says He created it all at once. That necessarily means God exists outside all of the dimensions of existences known to Man's understanding (and all that are beyond our understanding at this point). Time, as a dimension, has no meaning to God, nor is He confined to it. Space-Time, and its derivatives, is simply a cloak God can wrap around Himself as He chooses, so there is no real place we can definitively call, "God's Home". His Word declares the Heavens are His throne to sit upon, and the earth is His footstool.

Mind-boggling stuff.

Yet, it is told in a matter-of-fact manner that can be easily grasped and trusted. Do you believe God is telling the truth, or a fabricated story?

Here's the clincher for the Christian: If you do not believe God is telling the truth about the Creation story - how can you trust Him concerning your Redemption? From my understanding of the Bible...Redemption is Creation 2.0, and powered by the same process: God creating something within the human heart a capacity that did not exist before His Word come to the believer. King David in Psalm 51 did not cry out to God, "Evolve in me a clean heart!". No, David cried out, "CREATE in me a clean heart, O Lord!" - that same word God had used in Genesis 1:1.

We can believe God is telling the truth about our origins and salvation, or we can believe He's not telling the truth. God doesn't give us wiggle-room to declare we can overlay our understandings upon His statements. That's a form of idolatry, from my understanding - making an image of God that isn't true.

For the record...I graduated from college with a BS in Geophysics, retired from a career in Analytical Chemistry due to oil industry getting gutted in the 80's, and have been a devotee of the scientific process since childhood.

I see Faith and Reason working together like Hand in Glove. I utterly reject the musings of Kant and Nietzsche that declare a man of Reason must be divorced from Faith, and a man of Faith has no Reason. Atheists can indulge in those musings if that is their wish.

TLDR; God's record of our origins is true and complete; Neither of Man's intellectual pursuits nor prowess have progressed in science and reason to the point to understand God's performance of His own Science and Engineering Laws to comprehend the basics as yet.

Oh, and PS in edit - God didn't created a Flat Earth, either.

Splended post!

More eisegesis….you do indeed read your own bias into what the text says….. you interpret the text based on what you want it to mean.

For example…..it seems you want to believe that the “circle” of the earth reference means that the writer believed that the earth was flat….. not at all…..no where in the Bible does it teach that the earth is flat…. BUT, you want to believe that so you search and apply your own twisted interpretation…..if we follow your logic, one could claim that God is like a bird and has feathers.

I wonder if the Hebrew word for “circle” could also mean sphere even “round?”

Meh….just more nonsense from you.

btw, you don’t seem to understand hyperbole….or poetry … when you read it. You are blinded by your anti Jesus bias.

Your mistake is in assuming that myths promulgated by illiterates in the Bronze Age or New Stone Age have anything to do with anything God did or does.

And it takes a lot of hubris for YOU to assume YOU know what God did or intended, just because YOU can type the myths.

Much of Genesis has been discredited by actual discoveries. Everyone knows that including God. After all, the Bible contradicts itself in many places.

If one’s faith depends upon the universe not being 13.8 billion years old, and the earth not being 4.5 billion years old, then the grasp they have on their religious beliefs is pretty tenuous and pretty shaky, it seems to me.

All things are possible with God.

Typical arguments. Re-check your Biblical archaeology - Genesis has been established all the way back to the Flood, by actual discoveries. As for the comment about the Bible "contradicting itself" in several places, try being a little more truthful: Man forges contradictions in God's words that aren't there when God's Word is taken out of the clutches of such things like Higher Criticism.

In truth, I find it the hubris of man to assume God cannot do anything without man's approval. I also find it the hubris of man to assume we are more intelligent than the people living 3000-4000 years ago.
I find it the hubris of man, that man can tell God how old His Creation is. I find it the hubris of man to say God doesn't communicate with or move within people, simply because they themselves don't get it.

As I said, you can accept what God says as true, or not.

I've never understood the rationale why people not accepting God, have such a visceral reaction to the concepts of faith. If God isn't real don't bother with Him. If it is all superstition, pay it no mind.

But people not of faith cannot resist tearing into those of faith. Genesis 3:15 does provide the answer.

Have a good day.

Is the bible hubris then?

Some believe that Genesis is a literal creation of the world. If it is taken as mythology or metaphor, there is no issue. However, even as mythology or metaphor, the wording specifies mornings and evenings of each day of Creation, which only relates to Earth standard time.

It's not about me or how I read or interpret the text. Genesis itself specifies mornings and evenings of each day of Creation.

What is written is objective reality. Anyone can see and read Genesis describing mornings and evenings of each day of Creation.

You focus on me as a means of avoiding the fact of what the text describes.

DBT,

No, it is about how you read and interpret text. You interpret incorrectly….

Edit to add: what is your interpretation of Psalm 91:4….? …. Read with Objective reality ….and report back.

Ok, I’ll bite……… you accuse me of making a mistake…..so… what do YOU think God did or intended?

Help me out here please because I don't know and am doubting anyone can know how long the process of creation took or how it was accomplished. As I read Genesis the sun and therefore day and night as we know wasn't in place until the 4th day. I assure you I believe there is a supernatural force at work and I believe Jesus (Yeshua) was truthful about who he was. I have a hard time believing in a young earth and the evidence abounds that there was life on this planet and lots of variety long before humankind showed up. God is capable of doing things His way and taking his time doing it. I wonder about things such as the Cain and Abel story actually being a battle between groups of herders and farmers with the farmers prevailing. That has been pretty a common reason for fighting even down to the present day. Cattle and sheep eat crops.

I'm not interpreting anything. I am pointing to what the words and text say and mean.

For example, the following verses are quotes, they are not my interpretation;



Quote:

''5 God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.''

''8 God called the vault “sky.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the second day.''

''And God saw that it was good. 13 And there was evening, and there was morning—the third day.''

''9 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day.''

And so on.

You get the picture; each and every day is defined by a morning and an evening. Which cannot refer to eons or some special God time/rate.

The text specifically designates mornings and evenings of individual days.

This is not my interpretation, it is there for anyone to see and read.

Genesis tell you how many days in terms of mornings and evenings; six days of creation and one of rest. Light source and other contradictions is another issue.

It is there …. You read…. You interpret but you do not understand. …here is what you said after reading..”…the text specifically designates mornings and evenings of individual days”. …… That could be, but some believe that the biblical word for “day” could simply mean an “era”….,Or a very long time…..some have said the phrases “morning” and “evening” could refer to the beginning and ending of some long period of time.

Phrases like “the dawn of time”…… he “saw the light” may be need to be pondered.

You could read up on the word “yom” …. But you won’t…..

You, like many, try to presume that the Bible is a science book. It may contain some science insight, but it is really the revealing of God to Man.

The Book of Genesis is tells us this….”God created….” It is more important know THAT He did it….rather than HOW He did it.

God created…. and simple men don’t understand how, so simple men use their lack of understanding as an “excuse.”

Excuses won’t work ….


Btw…. I doubt you read Psalm 91:4….. otherwise, the way you interpret the Bible, you would be telling us that the Bible teaches that God has feathers.

A perfectly innocent humor/satire thread kidnapped by a bunch of people with wild eyes and flecks of foam on their lips.

DBT: Whatever, but the earth has been around a very long time. The evidence is clear. Humans were added late in the game. Genesis is the short version with a lot of time glossed over. When Methuselah lived 900+ years they weren't using a 365 day year. In the OT the reign of a forty year king could be distilled down to a short chapter. Jesus was here for 3 years and we got his message and truth but a lot got left out. A seven day creation doesn't fit the evidence. Make a trip to Fossil Butte and Wyoming and check that out.

Can we get back on topic, many of us are trying not to fall off the edge of the earth!!!