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Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: 10gaugemag] #16403030 09/03/21
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Originally Posted by 10gaugemag

Don't forget the autonomic plexus. Works very fine too.



Yeah, my lexus is automatic.
Got tired of clutching. grin

Jerry


jwall- *** 3100 guy***

A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap

Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
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Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: goalie] #16403062 09/03/21
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Originally Posted by goalie
Originally Posted by dogcatcher223
Blood trails are for bad hits or arrows...


I disagree, but it's conditional.

I shoot behind the shoulder, double lung and heart most of the time. I have the land, neighbors, and luxury of not losing a deer that runs a little. 45/70 placed like that = Stevie wonder can track it. And you lose zero meat.

That said, anything needing to go down NOW gets hit on bone. But you often lose a lot of the front quarter(s).

So, to the OP's question: I have noticed a little difference between .308 and 6.5CM with similar shots at similar distances. Not enough to matter tracking, but enough to notice. That said, I've only shot two with my 6.5, so not a big sample.

Hornady Whitetail Hunter factory ammo in the 6.5 and 180g hand loaded with the .308


What are the advantages of blood trailing ?

Jerry


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A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap

Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: Igloo] #16403218 09/04/21
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The potential for better blood is with a bigger hole.


You ain't about that life.
Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: jwall] #16403337 09/04/21
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Originally Posted by jwall
Originally Posted by dogcatcher223
Blood trails are for bad hits or arrows...


Guys, I promise I’m not being smart.

I have many pix to illustrate I’m telling the truth.

IF you hit them in a FEW spots (1shot only), they DROP right where they are and
the only blood is ON the ground right there.

Below ear, Center neck, HI shoulder (spine) OR Spinal cord farther back.
I have pix of each of those—-no trailing.

You must know your trajectory intimately. It’s been a long time since I blood trailed a WT.

Good Luck

Jerry


Jerry, where I hunt you don’t often get the chance to ponder shot placement, as usually the deer are walking, sometimes at a good clip (I don’t take running shots). Usually they’re pretty close, but still the safest shot is tight on the shoulder no more than 1/3 of the way up. The shots you mention are just not offered with enough time (for me) to pull off with certainty. Even with heart and lungs shattered, deer can go a ways, and in heavy cover I need all the blood trail I can get. With two holes, you’ll get blood and hair at or near where the deer was standing at the shot which helps evaluate the hit, and you also get blood on trees and leaves, spray if you’re lucky. Blood drops on the ground can be hard to see on the forest floor with all the other colors, but red on grass, low branches, and tree trunks is easy.

I’ve told this before, but ten years ago in a pouring rain, I hit a buck with a .270 at about 40 yards, halfway up his chest. He swapped ends and ran off. There wasn’t a drop of blood anywhere. I went back to my spot, hoping for another opportunity, convinced I’d missed. A couple hours later, my son came through on his way out, and we look again at the spot the deer was standing at. Maybe twenty feet back, I found a clump of hair on the ground. Knowing I had made a hit, I took up the trail in the leaves. No blood, just disturbed leaves. After more than 100 yards, I saw him lying in about a foot and a half of water in a pool formed in the gully by all the runoff. When I opened him up, his lungs were mush, but the bullet, a 130gr IL, hadn’t made it through. All the blood had collected in the chest below the entrance wound. Now I try very hard to hit them well below the curve of the chest so the blood starts leaking quickly, and hopefully the heart gets hit too, or sometimes even cut free. I also use bullets that make two holes reliably.


What fresh Hell is this?
Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: Pappy348] #16403475 09/04/21
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Pappy

I have been in those same circumstances and your 10 year example, almost identical circumstances

ONLY I shot him with a 7 RM while it was raining. There was blood on the ground in some water ---- THAT'S all
and NO blood trail. I had to crawl thru underbrush until I 'accidently' stumbled upon him.

Where I've been hunting since 2012 it is family property and I am the ONLY 1 with permission to hunt it. I hunt
every day I possibly can till AFTER Christmas but I can't put pressure on the deer so they are going about their natural
business.

The reason I began shooting CNS is too often I'm close to a property fence and I can't hunt the other side SO I need
stop the death run.

I have 1 pic that illustrates that perfectly. The doe was within feet of the fence DOA.
UNfortunately that along with other pix are KIDNAPPED by Photopukeit for ransom. I can upload to my
computer ONE AT A TIME so I just don't do it.
I AIN'T paying them.

I really like CNS shots for multiple reasons.

Here are a few examples -- look for either blood or bullet holes.

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

The bullet almost exited the hide -- on back line. 30-06 165 HBTSP
The blood at his mouth is ALL the blood trail .

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

No comment necessary

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Notice BULGED eyeballs. He was walking straight away and my ONLY shot was back of the neck. The bullet ranged
upward, cracked his skull and knocked his L antler loose. It's against the gate cable to hold it up.

Last pic now.

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

That's bullet ENTRY, he collapsed. 30-06, 165 BTSP.

I do like Model Sixes and WOOD stocks too. wink

Jerry

Last edited by jwall; 09/04/21.

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Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: Igloo] #16403478 09/04/21
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With everything else being equal, Simple physics dictates a bigger hole will leave more blood.

Will a bigger or smaller pipe allow more water flow?

I have shot critters with 22 to 50 caliber, bigger holes bleed more.


Arcus Venator
Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: Igloo] #16403531 09/04/21
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This what I was thinking ^^^ Fluid Dynamics. grin



Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: Igloo] #16403565 09/04/21
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You don't need a blood trail until the day you need one. On that day it's better to have one. No experience with 6.5s. Know beyond doubt the .22 and .24 CFs do not reliably produce blood trails. Good killers? Yes.

Context is important. Guy shooting in open cover able to pick plexus shots or, at least, watch a death sprint over just the first 50-100 yds is not in the same galaxy with a guy sitting on a stump within a dense Maine cedar swamp....most likely having a 1/3 chance at a deer bounding past during an four week season. Yes, those are the numbers and yes, there's a reason dogs find many each year. Have that t-shirt and DVD.

Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: Pappy348] #16403630 09/04/21
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Originally Posted by Pappy348
Originally Posted by jwall
Originally Posted by dogcatcher223
Blood trails are for bad hits or arrows...


Guys, I promise I’m not being smart.

I have many pix to illustrate I’m telling the truth.

IF you hit them in a FEW spots (1shot only), they DROP right where they are and
the only blood is ON the ground right there.

Below ear, Center neck, HI shoulder (spine) OR Spinal cord farther back.
I have pix of each of those—-no trailing.

You must know your trajectory intimately. It’s been a long time since I blood trailed a WT.

Good Luck

Jerry


Jerry, where I hunt you don’t often get the chance to ponder shot placement, as usually the deer are walking, sometimes at a good clip (I don’t take running shots). Usually they’re pretty close, but still the safest shot is tight on the shoulder no more than 1/3 of the way up. The shots you mention are just not offered with enough time (for me) to pull off with certainty. Even with heart and lungs shattered, deer can go a ways, and in heavy cover I need all the blood trail I can get. With two holes, you’ll get blood and hair at or near where the deer was standing at the shot which helps evaluate the hit, and you also get blood on trees and leaves, spray if you’re lucky. Blood drops on the ground can be hard to see on the forest floor with all the other colors, but red on grass, low branches, and tree trunks is easy.

I’ve told this before, but ten years ago in a pouring rain, I hit a buck with a .270 at about 40 yards, halfway up his chest. He swapped ends and ran off. There wasn’t a drop of blood anywhere. I went back to my spot, hoping for another opportunity, convinced I’d missed. A couple hours later, my son came through on his way out, and we look again at the spot the deer was standing at. Maybe twenty feet back, I found a clump of hair on the ground. Knowing I had made a hit, I took up the trail in the leaves. No blood, just disturbed leaves. After more than 100 yards, I saw him lying in about a foot and a half of water in a pool formed in the gully by all the runoff. When I opened him up, his lungs were mush, but the bullet, a 130gr IL, hadn’t made it through. All the blood had collected in the chest below the entrance wound. Now I try very hard to hit them well below the curve of the chest so the blood starts leaking quickly, and hopefully the heart gets hit too, or sometimes even cut free. I also use bullets that make two holes reliably.



Paddy, this is pretty much exactly why I was asking, spot on.

Jerry, that has a lot of merit! When its the case, like if I am shooting from a blind/stand with a decent rest (I usually cut a forked sapling to the proper height) I'll be happy to try a high shoulder/neck shot and we'll see how it goes....but it may well come down to the kind of shooting Pappy mentions and I ain't the best at putting a round through a neck/high shoulder from offhand unsupported under all field conditions....but will if I can wink

Those are some wonderful deer you have taken there! Great hunting.


But I'm a broken man on a Halifax pier,
The last of Barrett's Privateers
Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: Igloo] #16403883 09/04/21
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Thnx Igloo


Jerry


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Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
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Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: roundoak] #16403928 09/04/21
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Originally Posted by roundoak
Create a good hole so you don't need a tracking dog. wink
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]


Yeah....but you should test your theory on big deer.... ...grin....

Very nice roundoak.

On the 30 vs 6.5, I've shot a lot of deer with 150 grain ballistic tip .308's (out of a .308 win, .226 sectional density) and the 129 accubond long range (.264 sectional density) out of a 6.5 CM. Many are from treestands and often double lung shots...which seem to bleed well with the lower exit wound. At any rate, the sectional densities and velocities are fairly close, both usually pass through. I really can't tell a difference in distance traveled. It has seemed that the .308's leave a bit more of a blood trail....it seems to be noticeably more.

Nothing scientific, just the way it has seemed to me.

Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: Pappy348] #16403938 09/04/21
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Originally Posted by Pappy348
Originally Posted by jwall
Originally Posted by dogcatcher223
Blood trails are for bad hits or arrows...


Guys, I promise I’m not being smart.

I have many pix to illustrate I’m telling the truth.

IF you hit them in a FEW spots (1shot only), they DROP right where they are and
the only blood is ON the ground right there.

Below ear, Center neck, HI shoulder (spine) OR Spinal cord farther back.
I have pix of each of those—-no trailing.

You must know your trajectory intimately. It’s been a long time since I blood trailed a WT.

Good Luck

Jerry


Jerry, where I hunt you don’t often get the chance to ponder shot placement, as usually the deer are walking, sometimes at a good clip (I don’t take running shots). Usually they’re pretty close, but still the safest shot is tight on the shoulder no more than 1/3 of the way up. The shots you mention are just not offered with enough time (for me) to pull off with certainty. Even with heart and lungs shattered, deer can go a ways, and in heavy cover I need all the blood trail I can get. With two holes, you’ll get blood and hair at or near where the deer was standing at the shot which helps evaluate the hit, and you also get blood on trees and leaves, spray if you’re lucky. Blood drops on the ground can be hard to see on the forest floor with all the other colors, but red on grass, low branches, and tree trunks is easy.

I’ve told this before, but ten years ago in a pouring rain, I hit a buck with a .270 at about 40 yards, halfway up his chest. He swapped ends and ran off. There wasn’t a drop of blood anywhere. I went back to my spot, hoping for another opportunity, convinced I’d missed. A couple hours later, my son came through on his way out, and we look again at the spot the deer was standing at. Maybe twenty feet back, I found a clump of hair on the ground. Knowing I had made a hit, I took up the trail in the leaves. No blood, just disturbed leaves. After more than 100 yards, I saw him lying in about a foot and a half of water in a pool formed in the gully by all the runoff. When I opened him up, his lungs were mush, but the bullet, a 130gr IL, hadn’t made it through. All the blood had collected in the chest below the entrance wound. Now I try very hard to hit them well below the curve of the chest so the blood starts leaking quickly, and hopefully the heart gets hit too, or sometimes even cut free. I also use bullets that make two holes reliably.

Go heavy or go home.




GR

Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: Garandimal] #16403964 09/04/21
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Originally Posted by Garandimal
Originally Posted by Pappy348
Originally Posted by jwall
Originally Posted by dogcatcher223
Blood trails are for bad hits or arrows...


Guys, I promise I’m not being smart.

I have many pix to illustrate I’m telling the truth.

IF you hit them in a FEW spots (1shot only), they DROP right where they are and
the only blood is ON the ground right there.

Below ear, Center neck, HI shoulder (spine) OR Spinal cord farther back.
I have pix of each of those—-no trailing.

You must know your trajectory intimately. It’s been a long time since I blood trailed a WT.

Good Luck

Jerry


Jerry, where I hunt you don’t often get the chance to ponder shot placement, as usually the deer are walking, sometimes at a good clip (I don’t take running shots). Usually they’re pretty close, but still the safest shot is tight on the shoulder no more than 1/3 of the way up. The shots you mention are just not offered with enough time (for me) to pull off with certainty. Even with heart and lungs shattered, deer can go a ways, and in heavy cover I need all the blood trail I can get. With two holes, you’ll get blood and hair at or near where the deer was standing at the shot which helps evaluate the hit, and you also get blood on trees and leaves, spray if you’re lucky. Blood drops on the ground can be hard to see on the forest floor with all the other colors, but red on grass, low branches, and tree trunks is easy.

I’ve told this before, but ten years ago in a pouring rain, I hit a buck with a .270 at about 40 yards, halfway up his chest. He swapped ends and ran off. There wasn’t a drop of blood anywhere. I went back to my spot, hoping for another opportunity, convinced I’d missed. A couple hours later, my son came through on his way out, and we look again at the spot the deer was standing at. Maybe twenty feet back, I found a clump of hair on the ground. Knowing I had made a hit, I took up the trail in the leaves. No blood, just disturbed leaves. After more than 100 yards, I saw him lying in about a foot and a half of water in a pool formed in the gully by all the runoff. When I opened him up, his lungs were mush, but the bullet, a 130gr IL, hadn’t made it through. All the blood had collected in the chest below the entrance wound. Now I try very hard to hit them well below the curve of the chest so the blood starts leaking quickly, and hopefully the heart gets hit too, or sometimes even cut free. I also use bullets that make two holes reliably.

Go heavy or go home.




GR

Shoot for bone or go home!


The horned toad says we should go to Mexico!
Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: jwall] #16404012 09/04/21
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Originally Posted by jwall
Originally Posted by goalie
Originally Posted by dogcatcher223
Blood trails are for bad hits or arrows...


I disagree, but it's conditional.

I shoot behind the shoulder, double lung and heart most of the time. I have the land, neighbors, and luxury of not losing a deer that runs a little. 45/70 placed like that = Stevie wonder can track it. And you lose zero meat.

That said, anything needing to go down NOW gets hit on bone. But you often lose a lot of the front quarter(s).

So, to the OP's question: I have noticed a little difference between .308 and 6.5CM with similar shots at similar distances. Not enough to matter tracking, but enough to notice. That said, I've only shot two with my 6.5, so not a big sample.

Hornady Whitetail Hunter factory ammo in the 6.5 and 180g hand loaded with the .308


What are the advantages of blood trailing ?

Jerry


No wasted meat shooting behind the shoulder.

Other than that, there ain't any.

And, like I said, when it's big, bone is going bye-bye, and the deer isn't going 10 yards.

But, seriously, I understand many people don't have the luxury of location and friendly, non hunting neighbors that are fine with it if a deer runs a little and ends up on their property.

Give, it some time, follow the trail, get the deer. And I'm not screwing up some other guys hunt doing it.

Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: goalie] #16404022 09/04/21
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goalie

I have not lost enuff meat to 'matter'. ?Maybe? a handful ?

I'd trade that small amount of meat for NOT trailing.....dragging.

You have to try it to see.


Jerry


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A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap

Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: jwall] #16404047 09/04/21
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When I hunt east Texas or on one of my Oklahoma properties a lot of time all you get is a few seconds to make the shot on a moving deer. I like blood trails, if they drop on the spot with the perfect hit great but if they go 100 yards in the thick I want a leaky blood trail. As for dragging I will usually quarter and remove the backstraps to be put in my pack and carried out. Too old to be doing much dragging. Not everybody hunts open country or over feeders.

Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: 10gaugemag] #16404089 09/04/21
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Originally Posted by 10gaugemag
Originally Posted by Garandimal
Originally Posted by Pappy348
Originally Posted by jwall
Originally Posted by dogcatcher223
Blood trails are for bad hits or arrows...


Guys, I promise I’m not being smart.

I have many pix to illustrate I’m telling the truth.

IF you hit them in a FEW spots (1shot only), they DROP right where they are and
the only blood is ON the ground right there.

Below ear, Center neck, HI shoulder (spine) OR Spinal cord farther back.
I have pix of each of those—-no trailing.

You must know your trajectory intimately. It’s been a long time since I blood trailed a WT.

Good Luck

Jerry


Jerry, where I hunt you don’t often get the chance to ponder shot placement, as usually the deer are walking, sometimes at a good clip (I don’t take running shots). Usually they’re pretty close, but still the safest shot is tight on the shoulder no more than 1/3 of the way up. The shots you mention are just not offered with enough time (for me) to pull off with certainty. Even with heart and lungs shattered, deer can go a ways, and in heavy cover I need all the blood trail I can get. With two holes, you’ll get blood and hair at or near where the deer was standing at the shot which helps evaluate the hit, and you also get blood on trees and leaves, spray if you’re lucky. Blood drops on the ground can be hard to see on the forest floor with all the other colors, but red on grass, low branches, and tree trunks is easy.

I’ve told this before, but ten years ago in a pouring rain, I hit a buck with a .270 at about 40 yards, halfway up his chest. He swapped ends and ran off. There wasn’t a drop of blood anywhere. I went back to my spot, hoping for another opportunity, convinced I’d missed. A couple hours later, my son came through on his way out, and we look again at the spot the deer was standing at. Maybe twenty feet back, I found a clump of hair on the ground. Knowing I had made a hit, I took up the trail in the leaves. No blood, just disturbed leaves. After more than 100 yards, I saw him lying in about a foot and a half of water in a pool formed in the gully by all the runoff. When I opened him up, his lungs were mush, but the bullet, a 130gr IL, hadn’t made it through. All the blood had collected in the chest below the entrance wound. Now I try very hard to hit them well below the curve of the chest so the blood starts leaking quickly, and hopefully the heart gets hit too, or sometimes even cut free. I also use bullets that make two holes reliably.

Go heavy or go home.




GR

Shoot for bone or go home!

Goin' heavy will allow you to do either.

Through the ribs or Off-side shoulder.




GR

Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: rickt300] #16404125 09/04/21
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Careful in your generalizations.

I can send pix
Farm land. Thickets
NO feeders period.


jwall- *** 3100 guy***

A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap

Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: Igloo] #16404129 09/04/21
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I use 6.5X55 a lot, also .308 (and other .30's) and .223. They all leave some blood, but, depending on the hit location, you might have to look hard to find it. No matter, I usually go for the high shoulder shot. Sometimes I take the tight-behind-the-shoulder shot with those calibers and count on following up to 100 yards or so....it all depends on the terrain where I'm hunting. I often use a hot rodded .45-70 (Marlin GG) shooting 400 grain Speer flat nose bullets. It seems no matter where they're hit with that they leave a lot of blood on the ground.



Mathew 22: 37-39

Happy escapee from NY

Re: 6.5 vs 30 cal blood trails? [Re: Garandimal] #16404270 09/04/21
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Originally Posted by Garandimal
Originally Posted by 10gaugemag
Originally Posted by Garandimal
Originally Posted by Pappy348
Originally Posted by jwall
Originally Posted by dogcatcher223
Blood trails are for bad hits or arrows...


Guys, I promise I’m not being smart.

I have many pix to illustrate I’m telling the truth.

IF you hit them in a FEW spots (1shot only), they DROP right where they are and
the only blood is ON the ground right there.

Below ear, Center neck, HI shoulder (spine) OR Spinal cord farther back.
I have pix of each of those—-no trailing.

You must know your trajectory intimately. It’s been a long time since I blood trailed a WT.

Good Luck

Jerry


Jerry, where I hunt you don’t often get the chance to ponder shot placement, as usually the deer are walking, sometimes at a good clip (I don’t take running shots). Usually they’re pretty close, but still the safest shot is tight on the shoulder no more than 1/3 of the way up. The shots you mention are just not offered with enough time (for me) to pull off with certainty. Even with heart and lungs shattered, deer can go a ways, and in heavy cover I need all the blood trail I can get. With two holes, you’ll get blood and hair at or near where the deer was standing at the shot which helps evaluate the hit, and you also get blood on trees and leaves, spray if you’re lucky. Blood drops on the ground can be hard to see on the forest floor with all the other colors, but red on grass, low branches, and tree trunks is easy.

I’ve told this before, but ten years ago in a pouring rain, I hit a buck with a .270 at about 40 yards, halfway up his chest. He swapped ends and ran off. There wasn’t a drop of blood anywhere. I went back to my spot, hoping for another opportunity, convinced I’d missed. A couple hours later, my son came through on his way out, and we look again at the spot the deer was standing at. Maybe twenty feet back, I found a clump of hair on the ground. Knowing I had made a hit, I took up the trail in the leaves. No blood, just disturbed leaves. After more than 100 yards, I saw him lying in about a foot and a half of water in a pool formed in the gully by all the runoff. When I opened him up, his lungs were mush, but the bullet, a 130gr IL, hadn’t made it through. All the blood had collected in the chest below the entrance wound. Now I try very hard to hit them well below the curve of the chest so the blood starts leaking quickly, and hopefully the heart gets hit too, or sometimes even cut free. I also use bullets that make two holes reliably.

Go heavy or go home.




GR

Shoot for bone or go home!

Goin' heavy will allow you to do either.

Through the ribs or Off-side shoulder.




GR


So does going light with a mono.


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The last of Barrett's Privateers
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