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Good judgment, good results.


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The good guy was really slow on the uptake. This is not a good example of what to do. It is not close to perfect. How any "expert" could characterize that as perfect is beyond me. Luck is not a strategy. BTW, I thought I heard two shots off camera, but Correia did not mention it.


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Thief had a jack handle in his hand, that was the right time to put him out of commission and end his criminal career.


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Originally Posted by gonehuntin
Thief had a jack handle in his hand, that was the right time to put him out of commission and end his criminal career.

Agreed.

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Originally Posted by Cheyenne
The good guy was really slow on the uptake. This is not a good example of what to do. It is not close to perfect. How any "expert" could characterize that as perfect is beyond me. Luck is not a strategy. BTW, I thought I heard two shots off camera, but Correia did not mention it.
I don't see that he really did anything wrong. While he was approaching its clear he was still evaluating the situation. The good guy is in good physical shape, and he knew he had a lot of maneuvering room. As soon as he realized the other guy was hostile, his hand went into his pocket, and he started putting distance between him and the perp. Then he did everything in his power to avoid having to shoot the perp...again, very smart. Once you pull the trigger, your life changes. Better make sure you really have to. I'd say the good guy did a pretty good job. In the real world, it's never perfect.

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Originally Posted by Cheyenne
The good guy was really slow on the uptake. This is not a good example of what to do. It is not close to perfect. How any "expert" could characterize that as perfect is beyond me. Luck is not a strategy. BTW, I thought I heard two shots off camera, but Correia did not mention it.


Yep. Lucky for his ass the Perp was not a little faster in advancing on him with the Pipe. He liked to have gotten his head stoved in.

He was very “lucky” in this situation.

Might not work out so well for him the next time.


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Originally Posted by GunGeek
Originally Posted by Cheyenne
The good guy was really slow on the uptake. This is not a good example of what to do. It is not close to perfect. How any "expert" could characterize that as perfect is beyond me. Luck is not a strategy. BTW, I thought I heard two shots off camera, but Correia did not mention it.
I don't see that he really did anything wrong. While he was approaching its clear he was still evaluating the situation. The good guy is in good physical shape, and he knew he had a lot of maneuvering room. As soon as he realized the other guy was hostile, his hand went into his pocket, and he started putting distance between him and the perp. Then he did everything in his power to avoid having to shoot the perp...again, very smart. Once you pull the trigger, your life changes. Better make sure you really have to. I'd say the good guy did a pretty good job. In the real world, it's never perfect.


OMG, really? Here is my breakdown. The good guy (GG) is walking up to his vehicle and the rear door is open and there is a guy’s (BG) head bobbing up and down inside the vehicle. That seems like something that should set off alarm bells, right? GG walks into the frame with his gun hand out of his pocket. GG walks toward BG at a disadvantageous angle on camera rather than moving to his left off camera and coming up from behind the bad guy. He then walks in toward BG with his hand out of his pocket like he is walking up to ask any guy on the street a question. While GG is still a few yards away from BG, BG turns and clearly has a tire iron. GG still keeps walking toward BG and still has his hand out of his right pocket and continues to carry his bag in his left hand even when faced with a deadly weapon. BG even lifts the tire iron twice and GG is still closing, hand still out of pocket, and still holding his bag in his left hand. After that, his brain goes “duh, maybe I should put my hand on my gun and start backing up." He starts backing up, tentatively, 19 seconds into the video while reaching for his pocket with his right hand. By this point, predator BG knows that this guy is an idiot and decides to spook him by trying to scare GG away with the tire iron. You can see how BG stops toward the right of the frame, thinking he chased GG away. GG doesn’t even decide that he needs to drop his bag until 8 seconds after he starts backing up. (Bonus points would have been awarded to GG for using it as a distraction device at some point.)

Had BG wanted, he could have bashed GG’s head in before GG could have done anything. BG got complacent and allowed GG to FINALLY get his act together and get the drop on BG.



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Nice summary Cheyene, that's a wrap folks!


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Originally Posted by Cheyenne
Originally Posted by GunGeek
Originally Posted by Cheyenne
The good guy was really slow on the uptake. This is not a good example of what to do. It is not close to perfect. How any "expert" could characterize that as perfect is beyond me. Luck is not a strategy. BTW, I thought I heard two shots off camera, but Correia did not mention it.
I don't see that he really did anything wrong. While he was approaching its clear he was still evaluating the situation. The good guy is in good physical shape, and he knew he had a lot of maneuvering room. As soon as he realized the other guy was hostile, his hand went into his pocket, and he started putting distance between him and the perp. Then he did everything in his power to avoid having to shoot the perp...again, very smart. Once you pull the trigger, your life changes. Better make sure you really have to. I'd say the good guy did a pretty good job. In the real world, it's never perfect.


OMG, really? Here is my breakdown. The good guy (GG) is walking up to his vehicle and the rear door is open and there is a guy’s (BG) head bobbing up and down inside the vehicle. That seems like something that should set off alarm bells, right? GG walks into the frame with his gun hand out of his pocket. GG walks toward BG at a disadvantageous angle on camera rather than moving to his left off camera and coming up from behind the bad guy. He then walks in toward BG with his hand out of his pocket like he is walking up to ask any guy on the street a question. While GG is still a few yards away from BG, BG turns and clearly has a tire iron. GG still keeps walking toward BG and still has his hand out of his right pocket and continues to carry his bag in his left hand even when faced with a deadly weapon. BG even lifts the tire iron twice and GG is still closing, hand still out of pocket, and still holding his bag in his left hand. After that, his brain goes “duh, maybe I should put my hand on my gun and start backing up. He starts backing up, tentatively, 19 seconds into the video while reaching for his pocket with his right hand. By this point, predator BG knows that this guy is an idiot and decides to spook him by trying to scare GG away with the tire iron. You can see how BG stops toward the right of the frame, thinking he chased GG away. GG doesn’t even decide that he needs to drop his bag until 8 seconds after he starts backing up. (Bonus points would have been awarded to GG for using it as a distraction device at some point.)

Had BG wanted, he could have bashed GG’s head in before GG could have done anything. BG got complacent and allowed GG to FINALLY get his act together and get the drop on BG.



PREZACTLY!
Like I said, the Good Guy was damn lucky the Perp didn’t bash his head in with the pipe. He had plenty of opportunity’s to do so, had he chosen to keep coming towards Mr Oh Schitt, I might need to get my gun ready.

Last edited by chlinstructor; 09/17/21.

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Originally Posted by chlinstructor
Originally Posted by Cheyenne
Originally Posted by GunGeek
Originally Posted by Cheyenne
The good guy was really slow on the uptake. This is not a good example of what to do. It is not close to perfect. How any "expert" could characterize that as perfect is beyond me. Luck is not a strategy. BTW, I thought I heard two shots off camera, but Correia did not mention it.
I don't see that he really did anything wrong. While he was approaching its clear he was still evaluating the situation. The good guy is in good physical shape, and he knew he had a lot of maneuvering room. As soon as he realized the other guy was hostile, his hand went into his pocket, and he started putting distance between him and the perp. Then he did everything in his power to avoid having to shoot the perp...again, very smart. Once you pull the trigger, your life changes. Better make sure you really have to. I'd say the good guy did a pretty good job. In the real world, it's never perfect.


OMG, really? Here is my breakdown. The good guy (GG) is walking up to his vehicle and the rear door is open and there is a guy’s (BG) head bobbing up and down inside the vehicle. That seems like something that should set off alarm bells, right? GG walks into the frame with his gun hand out of his pocket. GG walks toward BG at a disadvantageous angle on camera rather than moving to his left off camera and coming up from behind the bad guy. He then walks in toward BG with his hand out of his pocket like he is walking up to ask any guy on the street a question. While GG is still a few yards away from BG, BG turns and clearly has a tire iron. GG still keeps walking toward BG and still has his hand out of his right pocket and continues to carry his bag in his left hand even when faced with a deadly weapon. BG even lifts the tire iron twice and GG is still closing, hand still out of pocket, and still holding his bag in his left hand. After that, his brain goes “duh, maybe I should put my hand on my gun and start backing up. He starts backing up, tentatively, 19 seconds into the video while reaching for his pocket with his right hand. By this point, predator BG knows that this guy is an idiot and decides to spook him by trying to scare GG away with the tire iron. You can see how BG stops toward the right of the frame, thinking he chased GG away. GG doesn’t even decide that he needs to drop his bag until 8 seconds after he starts backing up. (Bonus points would have been awarded to GG for using it as a distraction device at some point.)

Had BG wanted, he could have bashed GG’s head in before GG could have done anything. BG got complacent and allowed GG to FINALLY get his act together and get the drop on BG.



PREZACTLY!
Like I said, the Good Guy was damn lucky the Perp didn’t bash his head in with the pipe. He had plenty of opportunity’s to do so, had he chosen to keep coming towards Mr Oh Schitt, I might need to get my gun ready.


If he'd have stumbled walking backwards... which is why I don't.


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Originally Posted by SargeMO
Originally Posted by chlinstructor
Originally Posted by Cheyenne
Originally Posted by GunGeek
Originally Posted by Cheyenne
The good guy was really slow on the uptake. This is not a good example of what to do. It is not close to perfect. How any "expert" could characterize that as perfect is beyond me. Luck is not a strategy. BTW, I thought I heard two shots off camera, but Correia did not mention it.
I don't see that he really did anything wrong. While he was approaching its clear he was still evaluating the situation. The good guy is in good physical shape, and he knew he had a lot of maneuvering room. As soon as he realized the other guy was hostile, his hand went into his pocket, and he started putting distance between him and the perp. Then he did everything in his power to avoid having to shoot the perp...again, very smart. Once you pull the trigger, your life changes. Better make sure you really have to. I'd say the good guy did a pretty good job. In the real world, it's never perfect.


OMG, really? Here is my breakdown. The good guy (GG) is walking up to his vehicle and the rear door is open and there is a guy’s (BG) head bobbing up and down inside the vehicle. That seems like something that should set off alarm bells, right? GG walks into the frame with his gun hand out of his pocket. GG walks toward BG at a disadvantageous angle on camera rather than moving to his left off camera and coming up from behind the bad guy. He then walks in toward BG with his hand out of his pocket like he is walking up to ask any guy on the street a question. While GG is still a few yards away from BG, BG turns and clearly has a tire iron. GG still keeps walking toward BG and still has his hand out of his right pocket and continues to carry his bag in his left hand even when faced with a deadly weapon. BG even lifts the tire iron twice and GG is still closing, hand still out of pocket, and still holding his bag in his left hand. After that, his brain goes “duh, maybe I should put my hand on my gun and start backing up. He starts backing up, tentatively, 19 seconds into the video while reaching for his pocket with his right hand. By this point, predator BG knows that this guy is an idiot and decides to spook him by trying to scare GG away with the tire iron. You can see how BG stops toward the right of the frame, thinking he chased GG away. GG doesn’t even decide that he needs to drop his bag until 8 seconds after he starts backing up. (Bonus points would have been awarded to GG for using it as a distraction device at some point.)

Had BG wanted, he could have bashed GG’s head in before GG could have done anything. BG got complacent and allowed GG to FINALLY get his act together and get the drop on BG.



PREZACTLY!
Like I said, the Good Guy was damn lucky the Perp didn’t bash his head in with the pipe. He had plenty of opportunity’s to do so, had he chosen to keep coming towards Mr Oh Schitt, I might need to get my gun ready.


If he'd have stumbled walking backwards... which is why I don't.


Yep.


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Originally Posted by SargeMO

If he'd have stumbled walking backwards... which is why I don't.


Good point. In this case, that guy never showed any outward indication of "fight" being on his list of potential responses until way after he could have been dead. But, I don't know the law of the locale, which may have influenced his decision to "retire" from the situation. If retreat was legally required or highly recommended, he never should have closed that much in the first place.


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Originally Posted by Cheyenne
Originally Posted by SargeMO

If he'd have stumbled walking backwards... which is why I don't.


Good point. In this case, that guy never showed any outward indication of "fight" being on his list of potential responses until way after he could have been dead. But, I don't know the law of the locale, which may have influenced his decision to "retire" from the situation. If retreat was legally required or highly recommended, he never should have closed that much in the first place.


Do they have to retreat if possible before using Deadly Force in Montana.
We don’t have to here. Only have to do what a “reasonable” person would do, if you believe Deadly Force is Necessary to prevent the others use of Deadly Force.

I’m too old and slow to “retreat” any more. 😜

Last edited by chlinstructor; 09/17/21.

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He did very good job. I use very small handgun, but it is chambered for very respectable 9mm Luger cartridge. One of the great advantages of this cartridge is that it can be used in very small handguns.

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Originally Posted by sparkyv
Good judgment, good results.


Poor judgement. Lucky results.


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It seemed the good guy didn't have a good level of situational awareness....maybe distracted by a smart phone???

A perp in his vehicle, and a getaway/driver sitting right there.....serious red flags. I would have had my weapon out immediately.

It looked to me like lug-wrench kid, wanted dude's backpack, when he advanced on dude, but then changed his mind and ran when he saw the pistol come out.

Getaway driver was a secondary threat that dude seemed to ignore, or be oblivious to.

Sometimes it's better to be lucky that good.

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Originally Posted by Slavek
He did very good job. I use very small handgun, but it is chambered for very respectable 9mm Luger cartridge. One of the great advantages of this cartridge is that it can be used in very small handguns.

Why do you pretend not to know proper English grammar?

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Originally Posted by MontanaMarine
It seemed the good guy didn't have a good level of situational awareness....maybe distracted by a smart phone???

A perp in his vehicle, and a getaway/driver sitting right there.....serious red flags. I would have had my weapon out immediately.

It looked to me like lug-wrench kid, wanted dude's backpack, when he advanced on dude, but then changed his mind and ran when he saw the pistol come out.

Getaway driver was a secondary threat that dude seemed to ignore, or be oblivious to.

Sometimes it's better to be lucky that good.

I doubt he knew that other person was even there, let alone connected to the primary bad guy.

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He doesn't know very much at all.

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