I had to swap to a new powder and want a load at or around minimum powder charge. Shots are typically close and am using those ProHunters everyone know explode on contact.so.....
For some reason loads listed for the 260Rem with H4350 seems really odd to me . Quite the drop from 120 to 130's. Unusual. Powder Bullet weight Min Max H4350 120 43.5 46.5c H4350 130 38.5 41.9 H4350 140 39 42
Hoping to get lucky I tried a load just under minimum for the 120 grain since it seemed high to start with.
I loaded 43 grains at three different seating depths .04" apart 3 each.
I have been very pleased using this method in the past with charges I had arrived at with charge ladder testing.
Will let you know how it goes. Flame away if you like
Last edited by kenjs1; 09/20/21.
When a country is well governed, poverty and a mean condition are something to be ashamed of. When a country is ill governed, riches and honors are something to be ashamed of . Confucius
I have not run H4350 in my 260's but have used H414. I found the max powder charge for my rifle and then played with the seating depths. After doing that and seeing the results, I am a firm believer in seating depth "tuning" and have done it with several rifles since.
I may not be smart but I can lift heavy objects
I have a shotgun so I have no need for a 30-06.....
As a side note: I load 50 rounds with my desired charge to the same max length and take a RCBS Partner Press to the range with me along with a seating die and calipers. I start with shooting 2 shots groups. If they are an inch apart, nothing you are going to do will turn that into a .5 group. I then bump my seating depth on two more and try again, and continue until I get something that looks promising, then I bump another one or 2 to that depth and see if they group as well. I might try .003 deeper and see what that does and keep bumping it until it starts to open up. I find the sweet spot and come back another day and make sure the repeat. If so, I have my load, and I seat what remains of the 50 rounds to that length and I am good to go.
Last edited by pullit; 09/21/21.
I may not be smart but I can lift heavy objects
I have a shotgun so I have no need for a 30-06.....
As a side note: I load 50 rounds with my desired charge to the same max length and take a RCBS Partner Press to the range with me along with a seating die and calipers. I start with shooting 2 shots groups. If they are an inch apart, nothing you are going to do will turn that into a .5 group. I then bump my seating depth on two more and try again, and continue until I get something that looks promising, then I bump another one or 2 to that depth and see if they group as well. I might try .003 deeper and see what that does and keep bumping it until it starts to open up. I find the sweet spot and come back another day and make sure the repeat. If so, I have my load, and I seat what remains of the 50 rounds to that length and I am good to go.
I do something very much like this. Having a micrometer seating die makes things go a lot more smoothly.
Okie John
Originally Posted by Brad
If Montana had a standing army, a 270 Win with Federal Blue Box 130's would be the standard issue.
If I get lucky I will have results Thursday morning for this 3 tier ladder test at min charge.
So have either of you heard the rule of using .04" increments? I read it here - think it was reposted from somewhere else. A few others said they used it t0o. I felt it quite a find. I would love to be able to load at the range as you do but alas... Dream is my own range with a shop a few yard from the bench.
Hey Okie John- I looked at the micro- seater dies- which one do you like- and how much $$$. I have standard CBS seater with the nut on top which is sort of a pain in the turret. I also have a the free spinning Lee. If I can find the right depth using the Lee. which is easier, I will set up the RCBS which seems more permanent. For me what helps having is the Hornady cam-lock bullet puller for when I over dial a depth. Super handy tool.
I made some dumb changes from believing the internet over my lying eyes. Would love to find some of my fav bullets again but as things are - working with what I got.
Last edited by kenjs1; 09/21/21.
When a country is well governed, poverty and a mean condition are something to be ashamed of. When a country is ill governed, riches and honors are something to be ashamed of . Confucius
Two world class shooters on seating depth adjustments. Erik Cortina uses .003" adjustments and Jack Neary likes .001" - .002" adjustments. Some very good info here on reading groups.
Use a Sharpie to make a stripe on the top of the Lee seater cap. It makes eyeballing reasonably even increments a lot easier.
Great minds think alike. I am ahead of you on this one MAthman.. I get it dialed in with the Lee I may adjust the RCBS seater and tighten the nut down. Having the turret allows me to a have a choice of two seating dies because I don't use it for dumping powder on rifle loads. I only dump for pistols. .
Maybe I will try that .003 as a fine tuner after getting this ,04 test done.
Wish I could find thee original post here suggesting that.
Last edited by kenjs1; 09/23/21.
When a country is well governed, poverty and a mean condition are something to be ashamed of. When a country is ill governed, riches and honors are something to be ashamed of . Confucius
Maybe I will try that .003 as a fine tuner after getting this ,04 test done.
Wish I could find thee original post here suggesting that.
The 0.040" seating depth increment comes from Berger Bullets. I've used it with others, particularly the TTSX. Complete waste of time and components doing 0.003" increments in a hunting rifle.
Tune your powder charge first (find optimum charge weight [OCW]) first, then fine tune the load with seating depth.
The 0.040" seating depth increment comes from Berger Bullets. I've used it with others, particularly the TTSX. Complete waste of time and components doing 0.003" increments in a hunting rifle.
Sort of like applying the latest Formula 1 tuning tricks to the old '72 Town and Country wagon.
Maybe I will try that .003 as a fine tuner after getting this ,04 test done.
Wish I could find thee original post here suggesting that.
The 0.040" seating depth increment comes from Berger Bullets. I've used it with others, particularly the TTSX. Complete waste of time and components doing 0.003" increments in a hunting rifle.
Tune your powder charge first (find optimum charge weight [OCW]) first, then fine tune the load with seating depth.
I do seating depth test similar to Berger’s method but use .025” increments rather than .040” because .025” is a full turn of my seating stem, and that’s easy. As Berger states, one of the increments will generally shoot significantly better than the others. Works well enough that I don’t usually even worry with the fine tuning. Also, very often, my best precision comes from loads WELL off the lands.
The group shown below is a 10 shot group from my hunting weight rifle about .110” off the lands. The COAL shown is actually the BTO including the Sinclair hex nut comparator, so subtract 1” for the true BTO.
This group is 5 shots at 900 yards from my heavy rifle with its preferred seating depth for this bullet .100” off the lands.
John
Last edited by Hondo64d; 09/23/21.
If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and I will forgive their sin and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
Hey Okie John- I looked at the micro- seater dies- which one do you like- and how much $$$. I have standard CBS seater with the nut on top which is sort of a pain in the turret.
Maybe I will try that .003 as a fine tuner after getting this ,04 test done.
Wish I could find thee original post here suggesting that.
The 0.040" seating depth increment comes from Berger Bullets. I've used it with others, particularly the TTSX. Complete waste of time and components doing 0.003" increments in a hunting rifle.
Tune your powder charge first (find optimum charge weight [OCW]) first, then fine tune the load with seating depth.
I do seating depth test similar to Berger’s method but use .025” increments rather than .040” because .025” is a full turn of my seating stem, and that’s easy. As Berger states, one of the increments will generally shoot significantly better than the others. Works well enough that I don’t usually even worry with the fine tuning. Also, very often, my best precision comes from loads WELL off the lands.
The group shown below is a 10 shot group from my hunting weight rifle about .110” off the lands. The COAL shown is actually the BTO including the Sinclair hex nut comparator, so subtract 1” for the true BTO.
This group is 5 shots at 900 yards from my heavy rifle with its preferred seating depth for this bullet .100” off the lands.
John
Good shooting John. As per usual. I generally don't putz around with seating depth, but focus more on OCW and finding the right node. I can see its usefulness with bullets that are picky about seating depth though. Those bullets like Barnes or Bergers or even the Nosler Accubond. I'm going to be messing with seating depth on the TTSX bullet I loaded up yesterday for my 7mm08. I'm not getting the accuracy I want with that pill, so on to seating depth experimentation.. We will see how that goes. I'm hoping for something promising..
Originally Posted by raybass
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style.
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole.
Maybe I will try that .003 as a fine tuner after getting this ,04 test done.
Wish I could find thee original post here suggesting that.
The 0.040" seating depth increment comes from Berger Bullets. I've used it with others, particularly the TTSX. Complete waste of time and components doing 0.003" increments in a hunting rifle.
Tune your powder charge first (find optimum charge weight [OCW]) first, then fine tune the load with seating depth.
I do seating depth test similar to Berger’s method but use .025” increments rather than .040” because .025” is a full turn of my seating stem, and that’s easy. As Berger states, one of the increments will generally shoot significantly better than the others. Works well enough that I don’t usually even worry with the fine tuning. Also, very often, my best precision comes from loads WELL off the lands.
The group shown below is a 10 shot group from my hunting weight rifle about .110” off the lands. The COAL shown is actually the BTO including the Sinclair hex nut comparator, so subtract 1” for the true BTO.
This group is 5 shots at 900 yards from my heavy rifle with its preferred seating depth for this bullet .100” off the lands.
John
Good shooting John. As per usual. I generally don't putz around with seating depth, but focus more on OCW and finding the right node. I can see its usefulness with bullets that are picky about seating depth though. Those bullets like Barnes or Bergers or even the Nosler Accubond. I'm going to be messing with seating depth on the TTSX bullet I loaded up yesterday for my 7mm08. I'm not getting the accuracy I want with that pill, so on to seating depth experimentation.. We will see how that goes. I'm hoping for something promising..
Seating depth is something that, until recently, I had not given enough credit to. These last couple of load development sessions I actually used 10 shot groups per charge, .4gr apart. I took the best charge from that, and then loaded up 10 round groups with seating depth .025” apart. Just as Berger states, one of them was significantly better than the others and until I got to that depth, all the groups looked pretty much the same. The best depth gave the groups in the pics above.
I know it sounds like a lot of ammo to develop a load, but I’ve found that doing it this way gives me very consistent, reliable loads that I don’t have to go back and chase improvement with.
John
Last edited by Hondo64d; 09/24/21.
If my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and I will forgive their sin and will heal their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
I agree .003 is not feasible for me. Hondo- your post reads like my experience and I normally test by weight first. Will be interesting to see if perhaps this is assumptive. .
I have had long COAL come back to bite me after discovering they are beyond magazine length. My 6mm Rem and 260 are both short on the magazine side. I found some accuracy return after shortening to differing lengths. And thanks to who it was that sent me the link to the mic dies. Trying to accurately figure out what 1/4 or 1/2 turn of my current seating die relates is so trial and error .
I didn't get to shoot yesterday and am lamenting not being able to go today as it is crazy weather right now.
If one of those 3 lengths gets me close with my stab-in-the-dark charge weight I may go then visit.025 on either side of that weight. I know this is a bit of a longshot but when it is impossible to find powder this could turn out to be a good way to go.
Good news is no one telling me I am nuts.....yet.
Last edited by kenjs1; 09/24/21.
When a country is well governed, poverty and a mean condition are something to be ashamed of. When a country is ill governed, riches and honors are something to be ashamed of . Confucius
Not saying all dies have the bullet seating thread pitch of 32 threads per inch, but if they/yours does, it is easy to figure how much you are moving the seating without a micrometer adjustment. 32 threads per inch equals .03125 thousandths per one full turn of the adjustment. A half turn of the adjustment would be .01563 thousandths of an inch and a quarter turn of the adjustment would be .0078. You could always make your adjustments in about 1/3 turns and end up with close to .010 inch bumps in seating depths.
Most may already know that but maybe that will help for those that don't.
I may not be smart but I can lift heavy objects
I have a shotgun so I have no need for a 30-06.....
Pullit- man.....seems so obvious now- thanks my man! Course now folks will see me counting out loud as I flip my fingers one by one with that cross eyed stare at the ceiling every quarter turn.
Que Jethro Bodine - 8 gazinta 10....... . Pharmseller- encouraging....course I only loaded three depths. Over optimistic perhaps. Counting down till the range opens
Last edited by kenjs1; 09/25/21.
When a country is well governed, poverty and a mean condition are something to be ashamed of. When a country is ill governed, riches and honors are something to be ashamed of . Confucius
![[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]](https://i.postimg.cc/g0MXkLvN/75F49E30-FE26-4FCD-A867-83C0EE4CFFF6.jpg)
![[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]](https://i.postimg.cc/Kzt45HJ6/79-C1573-B-8551-4197-A932-C83-EB116-DEAB.jpg)