Home Forums Hunting & Shooting AR and Tactical Rifles Home Defense AR Question

It is illegal to murder somebody.

Self defense is justifiable homicide, so long as you can show a reasonable man would be in fear for their life.

Even in Oregon.

Even in Western Oregon.

Look it up.

And there you have it, a golf club and a stern voice is all you need to defend yourself.

So what ya going to do if they don't agree to be held at gunpoint? miles

There is a highly reworked and massaged HD Mossberg 930 18.5" w/ choke tubes installed by Steve Rose and 4rd Nordic mag extensions hanging in bed hooks on both sides of the bed, they put all 9 pellets of the 00 load into a smaller paper plate at 30 feet, that will ruin anyone's day that tries to enter unannounced, also takes care of rattlesnakes and the occasional feral dog, coons, foxes and coyotes trying to get in the chicken coop. Best part is, when the bed is made they are not noticeable.


But, there is a Aero/Tromix 16" 375 Socom with a Bushnell Tac Ops holographic red dot behind the chest a drawers hidden away from the doorway with 2 mags filled with 11 200gr rounds each taped together for bigger emergencies

Edit after reading a previous reply:


We are on 475 acres, it's 1.1 mile from the paved road to the house, if you show up unannounced, rattle a door knob, or check out the equipment barn, shop or chicken coop, you gonna get ventilated, maybe a couple times

What style of hunting have you done with shotguns, and how much?

The pussification of the American male continues....

I agree with Dan. A shotgun is very lethal, and a home invasion would be one where distance is very close. A scattergun with the right loads would put any pos to rest.. Even birdshot or 7 1/2 shot intended for clay pigeons would prove deadly as fugg.. Blue doesn't know half of what he pretends to..

Dumbass.

There are plenty of places where there is no legal duty to retreat from a confrontation. My home state being one of them.

Pot meet kettle statement of the century.

Proficiency > tools

Training > tech

You don't need the "best" tool if you're really good with the tool(s) you have.

A 10.5-12.5" AR loaded with Gold Dots and wearing a can and an Aimpoint is my preference. But, if I trained a lot with my 590a1, I doubt that there would be a difference in most social use situations.

That's for those who have developed great proficiency. Many of these fellows would have to practice with a shotgun to hit a rabbit whereas others could shoot you in the face without even thinking about it.

Pointing is faster than aiming. Which Are you faster with? Maybe it is a pistol for one fellow and not another.

An interesting addition to the debate is those not a sbs shotguns. Having killed a considerable number of deer and more rabbits, shot from the hip, they make me wonder. Slower or faster than a short shotgun? Hafta to try to know.

Dunno what some of you fellas know or don't know about scatterguns, but I'll pass this along FWIW and you are free to use whatever you want to defend your castle.

- In general terms rifles/pistols are aimed with sights whereas shotguns are aimed instinctively. Moving targets compound the matter a bit and presumably some residential engagements will involve poor light and close quarters. In such circumstances instinctive shooting has an advantage.

- The primary objective in self defense actions is to disable your attacker, first and foremost. Inside the typical residential dwelling 30-40' is a "long" shot. Shotgun patterns at this range will hover in the 6-12" range depending on many variables. This provides a higher probability of a hit than a single projectile. A hit anywhere on a perp with a load of birdshot will cause, at the very least, a major distraction for the invader. In the gut, torso, head or extremities you will be rewarded with a conversion to wailing little girl mode, or perhaps just the sound of silence. At those distances a torso/facial hit will prove totally debilitating in the least. It is a desirable outcome unencumbered by the need for sights, lights or other BS.

- It is possible that one may have family residing in the residence and I must ask if anyone thinks that shot will carry thru drywall/studs as vigorously as a rifled projectile? Do you know for certain where your kids are once this begins to unfold? I know some kids are brats and often a nuisance, but it is doubtful you want them dead. Likewise, perhaps you have neighbors. Want to shoot thru your frame home wall(s) and theirs for a double? I doubt it.

- If the battle moves to the great outdoors you will find that heavy birdshot still leaves a serious mark out to as far as 40-60 yards, depending on a number of variables such as shot size/choke. Center a pattern on a bad guy's belly button and he won't be much of a bother after the fact, even at longer distance.

- Riddle me this: While providing support for infantry units n 'Nam I saw a large percentage of patrol point men using Win. Model 12s stuffed with buckshot. They could have carried M16s but chose otherwise. Why do you think they did that? A similar thought arises re: hog hunting in the USA. My Ithaca 37 20 ga whacked three hogs with one load of #3 buck....3 times and I'm not talking about shoats. In every case the shot passed thru the target and snuffed hogs in the background. If one chose buck for home defense they might want to keep that in mind. No tracking was required. Round shot penetrates better than most might imagine.

- If one has no real experience with shotguns they likely will fare better with a pistol or rifle of some sort, but my observation is that most folks have little understanding of the lethality of shotguns. 00 Buck is over rated by most based on emotions rather than reality and smaller shot offers many advantages, not the least of which is a favorable outcome, be it for hunting or self defense. Oh, one last thing. Up close and personal, a shotgun will put the most awesome hole in the bad guy. Hollywood almost has that figured out properly.

Just wait until BSA gets his benchrest set up...

Dan certainly made his point.

This is my 20 Gauge, No. 3 Buck, “personal home greeter” for hostile man or beast:



Contrary to myth, a shotgun pattern does not spread sufficiently to allow for careless aim, even from a “sawed-off.”

Go away, Buffalo Chip.

My shotgun is my go to for home defense. The likelihood that I would be awakened from a sound sleep or at least in a drowsy state and then the need to jump into full self defense mode (at my age -I'm 70+) and expect great accuracy with my handgun or even an AR seems like a moot point. Grab the shottie, reactively point and shoot is the conclusion to which I have arrived. The idea of an SBR'd AR however is appealing - either a BO or even my 10.5" (suppressed) 5.56. Hopefully, I will never have to find out. I suspect that within a minute or two of any shots being fired most perps will head for the hills or a hospital ER. Except for the most determined of thieves or those on drugs, the average confrontational gun fight is over rather quickly. My German shepherd and my Malinois might have something to add to an intruders discomfort before I can make my point!!

If you're going to give up the speed advantage of pointing, you'll gain some back with less recoil. A .223 can be set up to shoot nearly flat.

A shotgun will certainly stop the threat if the situation is favorable to a trained shooter. Few folks could move effectively through a structure w/ multiple doorways and T intersections w/ out training and practice. Adding a long gun to the problem increases the degree of difficulty. Only the lightest of shotgun pellets will not penetrate 1 or more walls. Can you make a headshot on a scrote holding a hostage in front of them at 15 yards w/ your choice of loads. For many people weapon retention in in an entangled engagement is more probable w/ a handgun.

Move your fight to the outdoors and learn the difficulty of running that shotgun from the prone and the joy of 5-7 rounds in your gun w/ slow reloads. Aimed fire vs. point shooting is no longer even a subject of rational debate. Much has been learned since 9/11 and the the average civilian can take a well run FoF class and prove for themselves what works for them.

No tool replaces a determined mindset which leads to focused training and deliberate, constant practice.

YMMV


mike r

Thanks, I was in need of a good laugh this morning.
You were joking, right?