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And I think that when commonsense local ordinances ruled, people were more or less OK with things.

When states like New Jersey, and Illinois made relatively minor violations into felonies it created a backlash.


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Gun owners were not happy with Howards '96 laws. There were protest marches by gun owners, lobbying, etc.

Sadly, many in the general public supported the new laws because they felt it would make for a safer society.

Safety concern, it seems, is a major factor for the average voter.

Not being gun owners, the perceived threat of 'guns in the community' tends to be blown out of proportion.

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Originally Posted by DBT
Gun owners were not happy with Howards '96 laws. There were protest marches by gun owners, lobbying, etc.

Sadly, many in the general public supported the new laws because they felt it would make for a safer society.

Safety concern, it seems, is a major factor for the average voter.

Not being gun owners, the perceived threat of 'guns in the community' tends to be blown out of proportion.



True, and the populous being mainly city dwellers means no rural roots or association. I walked those protests back then and know how many people were there but typically, the legislation was pre written and shelved until a time considered appropriate or winnable.

Howard knew he was [bleep] on Australians that's why he wore a bullet proof vest, something never seen in Australian culture before or since.
Australian politics revolves around getting your 2 elections behind you to qualify for a parliamentary pension. That's always been the motivation. The voter is just to tool to achieve that retirement plan.


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Exactly.

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Wasting your time here fellas...those that know understand...those clowns that have no understanding will never know.


These are my opinions, feel free to disagree.
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Originally Posted by AussieGunWriter
One could write a book on the differences between Australia and the US as nations. It is wide apart culturally as countries, especially in business, but the people have more similarities than differences.

Americans that have never traveled are generally poor listeners, aided by the inability to ask relevant questions so I, like most Aussies, get pretty tired to the same off regurgitated "You gave up your guns" BS.

I never met or knew a single person in Oz that owned an AR and I don't recall seeing many or any at the public ranges I frequented 2-3 dozen times a year for over 25 years there. Let me qualify that statement..........

Most have seen the picture on the Net of the "purchased" firearms being piled up for crushing during the buy back. The fat guy in the pic overseeing it was my father in law. The company doing the crushing was Metal Recycler's in Chipping Norton in Sydney. You will note from that pic that there are "NO" AR's in that pic, not a single one.

My FIL told me that even though the buy back included all semi auto's and pump's, there wasn't a quality gun in the lot. They were all pilfered long before arrival and all Aussies know that Browning's were a hot item in Oz. None, Zip. Maybe they weren't sold off, who knows?

Handguns, were never common and were removed from common access after WW1 (I recall 1926) but the point is, the handgun culture never existed there nor a market for them. Also, there is no "Bill of Rights" the equal of what the US has in place.

Now here is the big one. There is a sleeze element in the US that is absent in Australia. Sure, there is a scum element like anywhere else, but it is few in populous and low in profile compared to in particular, the US as a %.

Most Australians not only have never been robbed, assaulted, had a car stolen, a house broken into or even know anyone else who has. In the US it is at levels that are so high and so frequent it doesn't make it as newsworthy. The level of sleeze though existing everywhere, is much higher in the US which is why Americans feel a need to carry and claim the right to as justification. I do too.

I used to take American visitors down the Rocks under the Harbour Bridge at night in Sydney. Never had a single one who wasn't fearful just looking into the dark. Made hilarious entertainment and a point of fun over a drink later on. Sure you can get mugged, but you'd have to go out of your way to very specific streets decades known, for bad behaviour and therefore easily avoided and excluded from your life.

One of the biggest differences between the 2 countries is that America developed its travel routes. Many towns are 7 or 8 miles apart as that's is where the stage coach stops were. I used to live near one in the Rockies, an old log cabin pub where there was still an employment poster on the wall asking for mail riders, preferably orphaned and over 17 years of age. That's America and its foundation. The country is the same size as Australia so this landscape assisted crime in that people could commit acts and move on so easily and "Scott free". Americans have evolved watching their backs in their own country. Aussies, not so much.

Australia is a far more arid nation by comparison, so expansion was restricted by constant drought, poor soil and no people to toil over the land. Hence properties are in acres per animals and not animals per acre as in the US.

The one value an Australian has that and American may never have is the vote.

American voting is voluntary so only a relatively small percentage of population decides who rules. That is why the process can be controlled and manipulated.
By comparison, Australian voting is compulsory, in person, on paper, and counted in front of opposition observers. The other value is that Aussies generally disrespect politicians almost as a culture, to the point of sacking them whenever the "Hip pocket nerve" is affected. It is political suicide to piss off a voter in Oz. In the US, they always miraculously find a van full of incomplete or pre-printed votes from several cemetery residents to get across the line.

SUMMARY
1. American's do not know anything about Australian Gun Laws or their history.
2. Aussie's have a history of blowing their stack if pushed too hard and that time appears to be coming.



I enjoyed this. Thanks for taking the time to put that together.

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Originally Posted by AussieGunWriter
One could write a book on the differences between Australia and the US as nations. It is wide apart culturally as countries, especially in business, but the people have more similarities than differences.

Americans that have never traveled are generally poor listeners, aided by the inability to ask relevant questions so I, like most Aussies, get pretty tired to the same off regurgitated "You gave up your guns" BS.

I never met or knew a single person in Oz that owned an AR and I don't recall seeing many or any at the public ranges I frequented 2-3 dozen times a year for over 25 years there. Let me qualify that statement..........

Most have seen the picture on the Net of the "purchased" firearms being piled up for crushing during the buy back. The fat guy in the pic overseeing it was my father in law. The company doing the crushing was Metal Recycler's in Chipping Norton in Sydney. You will note from that pic that there are "NO" AR's in that pic, not a single one.

My FIL told me that even though the buy back included all semi auto's and pump's, there wasn't a quality gun in the lot. They were all pilfered long before arrival and all Aussies know that Browning's were a hot item in Oz. None, Zip. Maybe they weren't sold off, who knows?

Handguns, were never common and were removed from common access after WW1 (I recall 1926) but the point is, the handgun culture never existed there nor a market for them. Also, there is no "Bill of Rights" the equal of what the US has in place.

Now here is the big one. There is a sleeze element in the US that is absent in Australia. Sure, there is a scum element like anywhere else, but it is few in populous and low in profile compared to in particular, the US as a %.

Most Australians not only have never been robbed, assaulted, had a car stolen, a house broken into or even know anyone else who has. In the US it is at levels that are so high and so frequent it doesn't make it as newsworthy. The level of sleeze though existing everywhere, is much higher in the US which is why Americans feel a need to carry and claim the right to as justification. I do too.

I used to take American visitors down the Rocks under the Harbour Bridge at night in Sydney. Never had a single one who wasn't fearful just looking into the dark. Made hilarious entertainment and a point of fun over a drink later on. Sure you can get mugged, but you'd have to go out of your way to very specific streets decades known, for bad behaviour and therefore easily avoided and excluded from your life.

One of the biggest differences between the 2 countries is that America developed its travel routes. Many towns are 7 or 8 miles apart as that's is where the stage coach stops were. I used to live near one in the Rockies, an old log cabin pub where there was still an employment poster on the wall asking for mail riders, preferably orphaned and over 17 years of age. That's America and its foundation. The country is the same size as Australia so this landscape assisted crime in that people could commit acts and move on so easily and "Scott free". Americans have evolved watching their backs in their own country. Aussies, not so much.

Australia is a far more arid nation by comparison, so expansion was restricted by constant drought, poor soil and no people to toil over the land. Hence properties are in acres per animals and not animals per acre as in the US.

The one value an Australian has that and American may never have is the vote.

American voting is voluntary so only a relatively small percentage of population decides who rules. That is why the process can be controlled and manipulated.
By comparison, Australian voting is compulsory, in person, on paper, and counted in front of opposition observers. The other value is that Aussies generally disrespect politicians almost as a culture, to the point of sacking them whenever the "Hip pocket nerve" is affected. It is political suicide to piss off a voter in Oz. In the US, they always miraculously find a van full of incomplete or pre-printed votes from several cemetery residents to get across the line.

SUMMARY
1. American's do not know anything about Australian Gun Laws or their history.
2. Aussie's have a history of blowing their stack if pushed too hard and that time appears to be coming.


I disagree. I've traveled a bit and lived in 10 different countries than the USA. Granted I only lived in Australia for a year. My friend who lived in Australia most of his life had very high-end rifles which he was required to register and then had them bought out by the Australian government for less than 5% of what he had in them. Your generalizations show that you do not know near as much as you pretend.


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Originally Posted by Bugger
Originally Posted by AussieGunWriter
One could write a book on the differences between Australia and the US as nations. It is wide apart culturally as countries, especially in business, but the people have more similarities than differences.

Americans that have never traveled are generally poor listeners, aided by the inability to ask relevant questions so I, like most Aussies, get pretty tired to the same off regurgitated "You gave up your guns" BS.

I never met or knew a single person in Oz that owned an AR and I don't recall seeing many or any at the public ranges I frequented 2-3 dozen times a year for over 25 years there. Let me qualify that statement..........

Most have seen the picture on the Net of the "purchased" firearms being piled up for crushing during the buy back. The fat guy in the pic overseeing it was my father in law. The company doing the crushing was Metal Recycler's in Chipping Norton in Sydney. You will note from that pic that there are "NO" AR's in that pic, not a single one.

My FIL told me that even though the buy back included all semi auto's and pump's, there wasn't a quality gun in the lot. They were all pilfered long before arrival and all Aussies know that Browning's were a hot item in Oz. None, Zip. Maybe they weren't sold off, who knows?

Handguns, were never common and were removed from common access after WW1 (I recall 1926) but the point is, the handgun culture never existed there nor a market for them. Also, there is no "Bill of Rights" the equal of what the US has in place.

Now here is the big one. There is a sleeze element in the US that is absent in Australia. Sure, there is a scum element like anywhere else, but it is few in populous and low in profile compared to in particular, the US as a %.

Most Australians not only have never been robbed, assaulted, had a car stolen, a house broken into or even know anyone else who has. In the US it is at levels that are so high and so frequent it doesn't make it as newsworthy. The level of sleeze though existing everywhere, is much higher in the US which is why Americans feel a need to carry and claim the right to as justification. I do too.

I used to take American visitors down the Rocks under the Harbour Bridge at night in Sydney. Never had a single one who wasn't fearful just looking into the dark. Made hilarious entertainment and a point of fun over a drink later on. Sure you can get mugged, but you'd have to go out of your way to very specific streets decades known, for bad behaviour and therefore easily avoided and excluded from your life.

One of the biggest differences between the 2 countries is that America developed its travel routes. Many towns are 7 or 8 miles apart as that's is where the stage coach stops were. I used to live near one in the Rockies, an old log cabin pub where there was still an employment poster on the wall asking for mail riders, preferably orphaned and over 17 years of age. That's America and its foundation. The country is the same size as Australia so this landscape assisted crime in that people could commit acts and move on so easily and "Scott free". Americans have evolved watching their backs in their own country. Aussies, not so much.

Australia is a far more arid nation by comparison, so expansion was restricted by constant drought, poor soil and no people to toil over the land. Hence properties are in acres per animals and not animals per acre as in the US.

The one value an Australian has that and American may never have is the vote.

American voting is voluntary so only a relatively small percentage of population decides who rules. That is why the process can be controlled and manipulated.
By comparison, Australian voting is compulsory, in person, on paper, and counted in front of opposition observers. The other value is that Aussies generally disrespect politicians almost as a culture, to the point of sacking them whenever the "Hip pocket nerve" is affected. It is political suicide to piss off a voter in Oz. In the US, they always miraculously find a van full of incomplete or pre-printed votes from several cemetery residents to get across the line.

SUMMARY
1. American's do not know anything about Australian Gun Laws or their history.
2. Aussie's have a history of blowing their stack if pushed too hard and that time appears to be coming.


I disagree. I've traveled a bit and lived in 10 different countries than the USA. Granted I only lived in Australia for a year. My friend who lived in Australia most of his life had very high-end rifles which he was required to register and then had them bought out by the Australian government for less than 5% of what he had in them. Your generalizations show that you do not know near as much as you pretend.


What "high end" rifles do you mean? And when was this? Gun registration came with Howard's laws in '96.

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Originally Posted by Bugger
Originally Posted by AussieGunWriter
One could write a book on the differences between Australia and the US as nations. It is wide apart culturally as countries, especially in business, but the people have more similarities than differences.

Americans that have never traveled are generally poor listeners, aided by the inability to ask relevant questions so I, like most Aussies, get pretty tired to the same off regurgitated "You gave up your guns" BS.

I never met or knew a single person in Oz that owned an AR and I don't recall seeing many or any at the public ranges I frequented 2-3 dozen times a year for over 25 years there. Let me qualify that statement..........

Most have seen the picture on the Net of the "purchased" firearms being piled up for crushing during the buy back. The fat guy in the pic overseeing it was my father in law. The company doing the crushing was Metal Recycler's in Chipping Norton in Sydney. You will note from that pic that there are "NO" AR's in that pic, not a single one.

My FIL told me that even though the buy back included all semi auto's and pump's, there wasn't a quality gun in the lot. They were all pilfered long before arrival and all Aussies know that Browning's were a hot item in Oz. None, Zip. Maybe they weren't sold off, who knows?

Handguns, were never common and were removed from common access after WW1 (I recall 1926) but the point is, the handgun culture never existed there nor a market for them. Also, there is no "Bill of Rights" the equal of what the US has in place.

Now here is the big one. There is a sleeze element in the US that is absent in Australia. Sure, there is a scum element like anywhere else, but it is few in populous and low in profile compared to in particular, the US as a %.

Most Australians not only have never been robbed, assaulted, had a car stolen, a house broken into or even know anyone else who has. In the US it is at levels that are so high and so frequent it doesn't make it as newsworthy. The level of sleeze though existing everywhere, is much higher in the US which is why Americans feel a need to carry and claim the right to as justification. I do too.

I used to take American visitors down the Rocks under the Harbour Bridge at night in Sydney. Never had a single one who wasn't fearful just looking into the dark. Made hilarious entertainment and a point of fun over a drink later on. Sure you can get mugged, but you'd have to go out of your way to very specific streets decades known, for bad behaviour and therefore easily avoided and excluded from your life.

One of the biggest differences between the 2 countries is that America developed its travel routes. Many towns are 7 or 8 miles apart as that's is where the stage coach stops were. I used to live near one in the Rockies, an old log cabin pub where there was still an employment poster on the wall asking for mail riders, preferably orphaned and over 17 years of age. That's America and its foundation. The country is the same size as Australia so this landscape assisted crime in that people could commit acts and move on so easily and "Scott free". Americans have evolved watching their backs in their own country. Aussies, not so much.

Australia is a far more arid nation by comparison, so expansion was restricted by constant drought, poor soil and no people to toil over the land. Hence properties are in acres per animals and not animals per acre as in the US.

The one value an Australian has that and American may never have is the vote.

American voting is voluntary so only a relatively small percentage of population decides who rules. That is why the process can be controlled and manipulated.
By comparison, Australian voting is compulsory, in person, on paper, and counted in front of opposition observers. The other value is that Aussies generally disrespect politicians almost as a culture, to the point of sacking them whenever the "Hip pocket nerve" is affected. It is political suicide to piss off a voter in Oz. In the US, they always miraculously find a van full of incomplete or pre-printed votes from several cemetery residents to get across the line.

SUMMARY
1. American's do not know anything about Australian Gun Laws or their history.
2. Aussie's have a history of blowing their stack if pushed too hard and that time appears to be coming.


I disagree. I've traveled a bit and lived in 10 different countries than the USA. Granted I only lived in Australia for a year. My friend who lived in Australia most of his life had very high-end rifles which he was required to register and then had them bought out by the Australian government for less than 5% of what he had in them. Your generalizations show that you do not know near as much as you pretend.


Bugger,
Please quote my generalizations?
I spoke of what I know to be true first hand, after living there 49 years not being a damn tourist quoting second hand info at best.
Your fallacy of a 5% return under the buy back program is as genuine as your first hand knowledge. Full of soup.
I know more about that program than you will ever know because I was there and went through it, so I very sincerely and in the best of Australian vernacular request that you bugger off, as you bring nothing of value to this discussion and only generate unnecessary friction.
John Woods


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Originally Posted by Bugger
Originally Posted by AussieGunWriter
One could write a book on the differences between Australia and the US as nations. It is wide apart culturally as countries, especially in business, but the people have more similarities than differences.

Americans that have never traveled are generally poor listeners, aided by the inability to ask relevant questions so I, like most Aussies, get pretty tired to the same off regurgitated "You gave up your guns" BS.

I never met or knew a single person in Oz that owned an AR and I don't recall seeing many or any at the public ranges I frequented 2-3 dozen times a year for over 25 years there. Let me qualify that statement..........

Most have seen the picture on the Net of the "purchased" firearms being piled up for crushing during the buy back. The fat guy in the pic overseeing it was my father in law. The company doing the crushing was Metal Recycler's in Chipping Norton in Sydney. You will note from that pic that there are "NO" AR's in that pic, not a single one.

My FIL told me that even though the buy back included all semi auto's and pump's, there wasn't a quality gun in the lot. They were all pilfered long before arrival and all Aussies know that Browning's were a hot item in Oz. None, Zip. Maybe they weren't sold off, who knows?

Handguns, were never common and were removed from common access after WW1 (I recall 1926) but the point is, the handgun culture never existed there nor a market for them. Also, there is no "Bill of Rights" the equal of what the US has in place.

Now here is the big one. There is a sleeze element in the US that is absent in Australia. Sure, there is a scum element like anywhere else, but it is few in populous and low in profile compared to in particular, the US as a %.

Most Australians not only have never been robbed, assaulted, had a car stolen, a house broken into or even know anyone else who has. In the US it is at levels that are so high and so frequent it doesn't make it as newsworthy. The level of sleeze though existing everywhere, is much higher in the US which is why Americans feel a need to carry and claim the right to as justification. I do too.

I used to take American visitors down the Rocks under the Harbour Bridge at night in Sydney. Never had a single one who wasn't fearful just looking into the dark. Made hilarious entertainment and a point of fun over a drink later on. Sure you can get mugged, but you'd have to go out of your way to very specific streets decades known, for bad behaviour and therefore easily avoided and excluded from your life.

One of the biggest differences between the 2 countries is that America developed its travel routes. Many towns are 7 or 8 miles apart as that's is where the stage coach stops were. I used to live near one in the Rockies, an old log cabin pub where there was still an employment poster on the wall asking for mail riders, preferably orphaned and over 17 years of age. That's America and its foundation. The country is the same size as Australia so this landscape assisted crime in that people could commit acts and move on so easily and "Scott free". Americans have evolved watching their backs in their own country. Aussies, not so much.

Australia is a far more arid nation by comparison, so expansion was restricted by constant drought, poor soil and no people to toil over the land. Hence properties are in acres per animals and not animals per acre as in the US.

The one value an Australian has that and American may never have is the vote.

American voting is voluntary so only a relatively small percentage of population decides who rules. That is why the process can be controlled and manipulated.
By comparison, Australian voting is compulsory, in person, on paper, and counted in front of opposition observers. The other value is that Aussies generally disrespect politicians almost as a culture, to the point of sacking them whenever the "Hip pocket nerve" is affected. It is political suicide to piss off a voter in Oz. In the US, they always miraculously find a van full of incomplete or pre-printed votes from several cemetery residents to get across the line.

SUMMARY
1. American's do not know anything about Australian Gun Laws or their history.
2. Aussie's have a history of blowing their stack if pushed too hard and that time appears to be coming.


I disagree. I've traveled a bit and lived in 10 different countries than the USA. Granted I only lived in Australia for a year. My friend who lived in Australia most of his life had very high-end rifles which he was required to register and then had them bought out by the Australian government for less than 5% of what he had in them. Your generalizations show that you do not know near as much as you pretend.


Fugger, you type utter bullshit. You know 0% of what you say you do.


Originally Posted by mauserand9mm
Originally Posted by mauserand9mm
Originally Posted by Raspy
Whatever you said...everyone knows you are a lying jerk.

That's a bold assertion. Point out where you think I lied.

Well?
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He hasn't got a clue.

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None of them do they're trolling.

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Says he spent a year here, so he knows more about it than those who live here and experienced what happened.

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We're not Australians, but we did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. 😏

It's a shame so much bashing/trolling happens on the non-US boards. Gun/hunting culture abroad interests me a lot, but most of the boards are dead, aside from trolling.

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Australia is a very isolated country not on usual travel or vacation routes, so foreigners have to go out of their way specifically to venture there.
This means that most information foreigners have is second hand at best, embellished either way to hell and back and then modded to suit their argument.
Because I live in the US now, I obviously know a lot of decent Americans who are very similar in attitude and decorum to the average Aussie but a dickhead is a dickhead and always was, no matter the flavour of the dirt under their feet. You will always know them on sight.

The only way to beat these idiots is to totally ignore them and let their thread or comment die right there. Hard to do, as Aussies are notorious for liking a scrap, but really is the best option.

Spend time talking or commenting with those that are like minded or helpful.
Cheers lads,
John


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I'm not particularly well traveled myself, Canada is the only place outside the US I've been to. I would have liked to travel more, but life happens. My wife won't get on a plane, and I'm not terribly fond of flying myself. Call me crazy, but if I ever did go to Australia, I'd want it to be in the winter to see the snowy mountains or Tasmanian highlands. I'm very much a winter guy, and it would be a getaway from northern hemisphere summer. 🤷‍♂️

Sort of related to the topic at hand though, I was curious if rifles chambered in handgun cartridges are as strongly restricted as handguns there, or is it the firearm type, not the cartridge that matters?

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Originally Posted by zcm82
Sort of related to the topic at hand though, I was curious if rifles chambered in handgun cartridges are as strongly restricted as handguns there, or is it the firearm type, not the cartridge that matters?


Type of firearm rather than cartridge eg I have a 9mm carbine that I can take out hunting but a 9mm pistol that I can't.


Originally Posted by mauserand9mm
Originally Posted by mauserand9mm
Originally Posted by Raspy
Whatever you said...everyone knows you are a lying jerk.

That's a bold assertion. Point out where you think I lied.

Well?
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Originally Posted by zcm82
I'm not particularly well traveled myself, Canada is the only place outside the US I've been to. I would have liked to travel more, but life happens. My wife won't get on a plane, and I'm not terribly fond of flying myself. Call me crazy, but if I ever did go to Australia, I'd want it to be in the winter to see the snowy mountains or Tasmanian highlands. I'm very much a winter guy, and it would be a getaway from northern hemisphere summer. 🤷‍♂️

Sort of related to the topic at hand though, I was curious if rifles chambered in handgun cartridges are as strongly restricted as handguns there, or is it the firearm type, not the cartridge that matters?


Handgun cartridges generally don't offer any advantages for hunting under Aussie conditions so these rifles will only ever exist if at all, in small quantity. Ranges are mostly open compared to the US hunting conditions particularly in the east whereby the farm lands most Aussies hunt on have open areas which provide shots out to longish ranges. It depends on the hunter more than anything. Some guys like to hunt timber but open country adjacent to timber is more common there, so an open sighted lever rifle will loose a lot of opportunity. If the cartridge were any pistol option really, it would not offer anything to brag about.

Even when hunting the thick gullies in the mountain ranges after sambar, most hunters are scouring the opposite slopes so again, even though it is technically timber hunting, longer shots become available.


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Originally Posted by zcm82
Sort of related to the topic at hand though, I was curious if rifles chambered in handgun cartridges are as strongly restricted as handguns there, or is it the firearm type, not the cartridge that matters?

With excessive game numbers, there is also no special season for bow/muzzle loader/pistol and high seat (treestand) hunting is less likely due to size of properties and different tree types.
In most states it is pretty much open season all year around, no tags, no bag limits (on deer), no requirement to recover anything.

Pistol cartridge carbines are fun guns for pigging in swamps, not for hunting on most places.

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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 5,785
Originally Posted by Adamjp
Pistol cartridge carbines are fun guns for pigging in swamps, not for hunting on most places.


A 9mm carbine has to be a sub-machine gun to come close to being useful, but not anyway that I know for sure. I've used 357mag out of a rifle on kangaroos and it's totally effective out to at least 70m, as far as I've shot them anyway. I was amazed it worked as well as it did. Hornady XTPs are brilliant.


Originally Posted by mauserand9mm
Originally Posted by mauserand9mm
Originally Posted by Raspy
Whatever you said...everyone knows you are a lying jerk.

That's a bold assertion. Point out where you think I lied.

Well?
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