Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Alaska Minimum caliber for Coastal Brown Bear...

Why's that? Did the 250 Partitions perform poorly on the moose? Curious, I've never owned a 338, but would have figured the 338 with 250 gr Partitions ought to be a good combo.

Thanks, Guy

I would think so as well. I buddy of mine poleaxed a charging 8.5ish boar at 7 yards with a .338 and nosler 250s. No problems aside from the excitement of the moment.

I'm curious too. Back when I used the .338 a LOT put quite a few 250 Partitions into various big game animals. They ranged in size from mule deer bucks to an eland pushing 1500 pounds, and the only 250 that didn't exit was the first shot on the eland. It hit a tiny thorn-branch just in front of the eland. The bullet still landed where I'd aimed, just behind the shoulder, but the twig did turn the bullet sideways, so it punched a perfect Partition silhouette through the hide. The eland took off behind brush, where we found it in a clearing a couple minutes later, standing with its head lowered. A second 250 through the chest, from the other side (which landed point-on), dropped the bull--and exited. Also shot 250s endwise through a mule deer buck and a blue wildebeest bull, about the size of a mature bull elk, both exiting.

In fact the only .338 Partition of any weight I recovered while using that rifle was a 225 from a huge musk ox bull, the size of an average cow bison, which I shot twice. The first shot broke the near shoulder as the bull quartered toward me at around 175 yards, and exited the ribs on the other side. The bull spun around a couple of times, ending up broadside, whereupon I put another one behind the shoulder--which tipped the bull over. It ended up under the hide on the far side, retaining 85% of its weight.

Didn't use the 210 much, especially after finding out how wellthe 200 Ballistic Tip worked, but they all exited too. Though a friend had one stopped by a rear-angling shot on a mature whitetail buck.

I've shot a few moose back in the 80's in Alaska and never saw a 338 250 partition exit a moose
Killed them well but none exited

It is always amazing to me how different people get different results when using the same equipment in similar situations. This thread is a prime example of that.

I've been ridiculed several times on this board and basically been called full of shït because what I relayed as my experience, didn't match what someone else had found. I am not seeing that attitude on this thread quite yet but I sense it coming.

Carry on, I guess.

.300 H&H and 200 grain old style grand slams at the ready here...but luckily this brown bear didn't care one bit about us, as he had a nose full of the carcass.

Thanks for the info, JWP. Do you recall how much weight those retained?

I didn't start using the .338 until around 1990, and during the 1990s Nosler started moving the partition forward on most of the heavier, larger-caliber Partitions, so they'd retain more weight than the typical 65-70%. Exactly how much depends on the bullet.

Have mentioned this before, but the first one of that generation I used on big game was the 300-grain .375. Have only recovered two, but they retained 88% and 89% of their weight.

As noted, the only .338 Partition I've recovered was the 225 from a musk ox, which retained 85% of its weight.

The only two 9.3mm Partitions I've recovered (from a northern British Columbia moose and a blue wildebeest bull) averaged 82% retention.

The only two 400-grain .416s recovered (from water and Cape buffalo) retained an average of 89%.

John

Don't recall the weight retention, but on all 4 moose they were found under the hide on the offside.
These were large Alaskan moose and the bullets all looked just like the Nosler adds at the time

Great picture!

I used NPs for a long time in a lot of different calibers and weights. At one time I thought the perfect mushroom just under the far-side-hide was ideal. I no longer believe that. But my experience mirrors yours. I have a bunch of recovered bullets and a large percentage of them are NPs. I still have not seen an exit wound from an Accubond.

Thanks for the info guys...
Just saw it as as I posted...

Don't live there. Don't hunt there. But it's hard to Imagine a model 70 30-06 with a stout bullet and 6 shots ready to rock and roll as anything but up to the task.

Curious, never heard of the man and his exploits. Lever gun, pump, semi?

The book is a good read. Especially his "hell" on Kodiak. But he tipped over some eleven foot bears.

"Judge George W Folta may have been grudgingly called “the hanging judge” by annoyed criminal defense lawyers who observed vicious convicted killers dangling from Juneau’s public gallows, but most Alaskans affectionately called him “Alaska’s bear hunting judge” because he personally bagged some 300 bears during his half century of Alaska hunting. Judge Folta grew up in an era when young boys were taught to emulate Daniel Boone and Davy Crockett, and developed into manhood after the example of Theodore Roosevelt. Coming to Alaska in 1912, young Folta wasted no time in beginning his lifelong pursuit of Ursus Arctus, venturing onto Kodiak Island the very next spring. Indeed, he future judge returned to Kodiak the next year as well, and packed deep into the heart of that island where he shot three tremendously large Brown Bears with a little model 1906 .35 Remington autoloader. Folta continued bagging four to six large bruins annually until his untimely death while bear hunting in 1955. But Folta was far ore than just a hunter of bears; he was one of the most respected Alaska jurists of his day. Without any formal law school education, young Folta began his legal career working as a territorial court clerk. He later passed the bar, and worked as a territorial solicitor, prosecutor, and practicing attorney before being appointed by Franklin D. Roosevelt to serve as the US District Court judge at Juneau in 1947. This volume, written by his son Richard D. Folta, contains the very essence of Alaska’s bear hunting judge, as can be related only by one who accompanied his famous father on many hunts. Action-packed with scores of exciting bear tales from the judge’s own notes and records, this book also contains personal maps describing “private” trails and hunting preserves known only to Judge Folta and those closest to him." (from back cover)

This has been my experience as well, not just with the NP, but even monolithic bullets. Had a hunter two years ago shoot a big bull moose with a 338 at less than 10 yards and the bullet didnt exit. That one was a Barnes X. Had a guy shoot one at about 60-yards this fall with a 300 winchester and again the bullet didnt exit. He was shooting 200 grain NP. Moose are big animals and it takes a lot to get an exit wound. The most reliable way to do it that Ive seen is with a 444/45/70 with hard cast bullets. They will almost always exit.

Had two hunters that year. 308 win and 168 ttsx. 338 Win mag and 250 partitions. I figured heavy for caliber we were fine in 338. Figured the 308 would be ok also.

The 308 hunter shot was about 120 yards. 2 rounds to the lungs, no bones, last round through base of neck broke neck. All 3 exited.

228 hunter the shot was around 100 yards give or take. 2 shots. Both to lungs, no bones IE ribs only. Both bullets made the first lung and into the 2nd and were somewhere in the off side lung having never made the ribs on the off side. That is another case of yep it died. But man a bone shot with similar results would be scary or in my mind I'd not trust it.

Sooner or later I'll catch a TTSX. And run 225 ttsx in the 338 Win mag and its worked fine. Exits so far. 210 TTSX in the 338-06. No exit on a shoulder/neck shot exiting through shoulder, but the hide caught it as it didn't' quite cut the hole in the off side hide quite enough to get out. 100ish yard shot also.

I've just not been pleased with lack of penetration to exit consistently with partitions, Have to be more careful than I'd have expected. Of course I've used too light for caliber ones, like 180 partitions in 300 wtby and they wouldn't exit a whitetail about 150 pounds. John you told me go heavier. I did. 200 partitions were much more reliable.

Thats what I expected from the big 338 ones.

Granted its only sample of 2. But when ribs and lungs stop em its scary as heck to me.

Why these bullets did that is beyond me. You would think 250 grains of almost anything would go through.

Boils down at this point in time about the only thing I really trust is barnes on big stuff.

Factory or handload on the 338?

Minimum i'd use would be my '06 hand loaded with 220gr Partitions at 2550 fps.

Sorry If I missed, Was this Bear or Moose?

I'm not calling you a liar by any means, but my difference in experiences using partitions with the 250gr .338's two big sisters, the 286gr 9.3 and the 300gr .375 is strangely different with stuff I've killed:

57" bull moose at about 75yds, first 300gr .375 was broadside and exited. Second was at about 30 yards as he jumped up, suddenly alive and was shot at a hard quartering away angle. Bullet entered just forward of the hip, traversed chest at an angle, and was found lodged against a neck vertebrae, total penetration about 5' chopping meat and bone as it went. Velocity 2550.

7.75' Brown bear, charging at 12 yards, first 300gr .375 entered front of chest just under the chin. Bear flipped backwards and began trying to get away, I commenced further raking to prevent tracking, bear collapsed at first follow-up shot but then got shot some more just because I was in the mood, four rounds total. Three of the four exited. One, likely the first rear to front shot, was found perfectly expanded and lodged against the back of the skull, which it had cracked. Once again about 5' of penetration, chopping stuff the whole way including the pelvis. Velocity 2550.

8' Brown bear, about 75 yards, first 286gr 9.3 broke the near shoulder and exited behind the off shoulder. Bear fell down and roared, got back up and made for the woods. I swung through and shot again as the crosshairs passed his nose. At the second shot he reared up, pawed the air and collapsed for pictures. Second round entered lower jaw, traversed the neck and chest, and was found lodged in the skin just forward of the hip. Velocity 2400.

I've got various similar experiences, but those are a few that spring to mind immediately. Perhaps the .338s starting velocity of 2700ish makes a difference, but based on my experiences with the sisters I'd happily use a nasty-kicking, no account, unrefined, questionable pedigree .338 and 250s if (gasp!) that's what I found myself with.

Factory. Very few of our clients reload. Had it been reload I'd have been more suspicious.