24hourcampfire.com
24hourcampfire.com
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 4 of 45 1 2 3 4 5 6 44 45
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 13,206
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 13,206
Crappy Hamper is ignoring my question. Inquiring minds want to know.

Is Billy Graham in hell for eternity or will he be let out on parole at some point?

Congratulations on your two Beaver Awards Crappy!


Let's Go Brandon! FJB
BP-B2

Joined: May 2011
Posts: 5,785
M
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
M
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 5,785
Originally Posted by Happy_Camper
Originally Posted by LBP
Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by Happy_Camper
Wrong DBT.
"Reward "would be earning your acceptance with God due to YOUR good works. The only thing God owes you or can reward you with is punishment for your sins.
Since His Son was nearly beaten to death in extreme torture, then nailed with spikes to suffer the torments of everyone's sins, He was rewarded with the death we deserve.
He offers not only a full pardon, but forgiveness.
Free for the asking.
Only a fool would turn that down.


Pascals Wager is flawed for a number of reasons. Morally, Ethically, what it says about the character of God, etc...

What if someone is fallable, incapable of good works, exploitative, selfish, greedy, yet has great faith in Jesus?

Or someone who has no 'faith in Jesus' yet is a great humanitarian, engaged in helping those in need and is doing their best to build a better society?

The former is saved while the latter burns in hell?


Exactly right. Works don’t save anyone, only believing in Jesus Christ sacrifice for your sins and resurrection will save you.



I'm glad that you understand God's grace LBP!
Who led you to the Lord? Sunday school teacher?



Sounds like a green light for those pedophile preachers out there.


Originally Posted by mauserand9mm
Originally Posted by mauserand9mm
Originally Posted by Raspy
Whatever you said...everyone knows you are a lying jerk.

That's a bold assertion. Point out where you think I lied.

Well?
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 15,986
G
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
G
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 15,986
Originally Posted by LBP
Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by Happy_Camper
Wrong DBT.
"Reward "would be earning your acceptance with God due to YOUR good works. The only thing God owes you or can reward you with is punishment for your sins.
Since His Son was nearly beaten to death in extreme torture, then nailed with spikes to suffer the torments of everyone's sins, He was rewarded with the death we deserve.
He offers not only a full pardon, but forgiveness.
Free for the asking.
Only a fool would turn that down.


Pascals Wager is flawed for a number of reasons. Morally, Ethically, what it says about the character of God, etc...

What if someone is fallable, incapable of good works, exploitative, selfish, greedy, yet has great faith in Jesus?

Or someone who has no 'faith in Jesus' yet is a great humanitarian, engaged in helping those in need and is doing their best to build a better society?

The former is saved while the latter burns in hell?


Exactly right. Works don’t save anyone, only believing in Jesus Christ sacrifice for your sins and resurrection will save you.

That’s how it works.

Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 28,769
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 28,769
"Are the Majority of People Saved?"

Jesus says,

Matthew 7:13-14 “'Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it.'"


"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
Everyday Hunter
Joined: Apr 2019
Posts: 5,950
T
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
T
Joined: Apr 2019
Posts: 5,950
Originally Posted by DBT
How moral is a blood sacrifice as a condition for forgiveness? How moral is a conditional salvation based on faith, expecting a conviction in the absence of evidence?



An atheist pontificating about what is moral. That's rich! crazy

Last edited by Tarquin; 01/02/22.

Tarquin
IC B2

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 6,530
DBT Offline
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 6,530
Originally Posted by Happy_Camper
Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by LBP
Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by Happy_Camper
Wrong DBT.
"Reward "would be earning your acceptance with God due to YOUR good works. The only thing God owes you or can reward you with is punishment for your sins.
Since His Son was nearly beaten to death in extreme torture, then nailed with spikes to suffer the torments of everyone's sins, He was rewarded with the death we deserve.
He offers not only a full pardon, but forgiveness.
Free for the asking.
Only a fool would turn that down.


Pascals Wager is flawed for a number of reasons. Morally, Ethically, what it says about the character of God, etc...

What if someone is fallable, incapable of good works, exploitative, selfish, greedy, yet has great faith in Jesus?

Or someone who has no 'faith in Jesus' yet is a great humanitarian, engaged in helping those in need and is doing their best to build a better society?

The former is saved while the latter burns in hell?


Exactly right. Works don’t save anyone, only believing in Jesus Christ sacrifice for your sins and resurrection will save you.


So you see this as being moral and just? Saving an arse*hole because he has 'faith in Jesus' is preferable to saving a humanist who strives towards a higher standard of morality?

"All have sinned and come short of the glory of God."
That starts with me. None of us are worthy of God's kindness.

I was directed to this O.T. Proverb. 20
"Most men will proclaim every one his own goodness: but a faithful man who can find?" And...
"Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?"

We can compare ourselves to others who appear morally inferior just as we could search and find others who seem to have holiness. However, the proverbs still apply. God doesn't grade on a curve. It's pass or fail. He said to a "holy" man,

"He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."


That says nothing about the morality of salvation based on a belief held without sufficient evidence: faith... that saving an arse*hole is preferable over a decent human being because the latter has an inquiring mind that questions, not simply believes. So, I guess that the god of the NT values compliancy over both reason and justice.

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 6,530
DBT Offline
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 6,530
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Originally Posted by DBT
How moral is a blood sacrifice as a condition for forgiveness? How moral is a conditional salvation based on faith, expecting a conviction in the absence of evidence?



An atheist pontificating about what is moral. That's rich! crazy



No need to pontificate. The bible itself describes what is moral, even while describing its God transgressing these very same principles.....

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 5,152
J
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
J
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 5,152
Given that there are nearly 8 billion people are on the planet, I’m going to say 4 billion of them aren’t honest Christians, or any one particular religion. Therefore, whoever has the religion thing figured out, the answer is no.

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 30,598
A
Campfire 'Bwana
Online Content
Campfire 'Bwana
A
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 30,598
Originally Posted by Jeffrey
Given that there are nearly 8 billion people are on the planet, I’m going to say 4 billion of them aren’t honest Christians, or any one particular religion. Therefore, whoever has the religion thing figured out, the answer is no.





You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.

You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
Joined: Apr 2019
Posts: 5,950
T
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
T
Joined: Apr 2019
Posts: 5,950
Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Originally Posted by DBT
How moral is a blood sacrifice as a condition for forgiveness? How moral is a conditional salvation based on faith, expecting a conviction in the absence of evidence?



An atheist pontificating about what is moral. That's rich! crazy



No need to pontificate. The bible itself describes what is moral, even while describing its God transgressing these very same principles.....


No need...but you do it anyway and as a relativist no less! laugh crazy


Tarquin
IC B3

Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 14,166
H
Campfire Outfitter
Online Content
Campfire Outfitter
H
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 14,166
Originally Posted by Happy_Camper
Wrong DBT.
"Reward "would be earning your acceptance with God due to YOUR good works.
Only a fool would turn that down.

Now I know you are not a Christian.You have no idea what being a Christian entails.Don`t continue to show what a liar you are.


Its all right to be white!!
Stupidity left unattended will run rampant
Don't argue with stupid people, They will drag you down to their level and then win by experience
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 30,598
A
Campfire 'Bwana
Online Content
Campfire 'Bwana
A
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 30,598
Originally Posted by Tarquin
An atheist pontificating about what is moral. That's rich! crazy

As opposed to who, Catholic Priests?


You didn't use logic or reason to get into this opinion, I cannot use logic or reason to get you out of it.

You cannot over estimate the unimportance of nearly everything. John Maxwell
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 9,450
Campfire Outfitter
OP Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 9,450
Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by Happy_Camper
Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by LBP
Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by Happy_Camper
Wrong DBT.
"Reward "would be earning your acceptance with God due to YOUR good works. The only thing God owes you or can reward you with is punishment for your sins.
Since His Son was nearly beaten to death in extreme torture, then nailed with spikes to suffer the torments of everyone's sins, He was rewarded with the death we deserve.
He offers not only a full pardon, but forgiveness.
Free for the asking.
Only a fool would turn that down.


Pascals Wager is flawed for a number of reasons. Morally, Ethically, what it says about the character of God, etc...

What if someone is fallable, incapable of good works, exploitative, selfish, greedy, yet has great faith in Jesus?

Or someone who has no 'faith in Jesus' yet is a great humanitarian, engaged in helping those in need and is doing their best to build a better society?

The former is saved while the latter burns in hell?


Exactly right. Works don’t save anyone, only believing in Jesus Christ sacrifice for your sins and resurrection will save you.


So you see this as being moral and just? Saving an arse*hole because he has 'faith in Jesus' is preferable to saving a humanist who strives towards a higher standard of morality?

"All have sinned and come short of the glory of God."
That starts with me. None of us are worthy of God's kindness.

I was directed to this O.T. Proverb. 20
"Most men will proclaim every one his own goodness: but a faithful man who can find?" And...
"Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?"

We can compare ourselves to others who appear morally inferior just as we could search and find others who seem to have holiness. However, the proverbs still apply. God doesn't grade on a curve. It's pass or fail. He said to a "holy" man,

"He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."


That says nothing about the morality of salvation based on a belief held without sufficient evidence: faith... that saving an arse*hole is preferable over a decent human being because the latter has an inquiring mind that questions, not simply believes. So, I guess that the god of the NT values compliancy over both reason and justice.

God's justice was satisfied when His Son said,
Tetelestai, "It is finished!"
That was the perfect justice of God completed.
The will of the Father was stated by His Son in John 6.
The will of the Father is for you to believe on His Son. He made it free of any effort, since Jesus took care of the hard part.

Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 9,450
Campfire Outfitter
OP Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 9,450
Originally Posted by Huntz
Originally Posted by Happy_Camper
Wrong DBT.
"Reward "would be earning your acceptance with God due to YOUR good works.
Only a fool would turn that down.

Now I know you are not a Christian.You have no idea what being a Christian entails.Don`t continue to show what a liar you are.

I've only demonstrated that the Lord deserves ALL of the credit and glory for every salvation.

What is your disagreement?

Last edited by Happy_Camper; 01/02/22.
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 5,785
M
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
M
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 5,785
Originally Posted by Ringman
"Are the Majority of People Saved?"

Jesus says,

Matthew 7:13-14 “'Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it.'"


If the small gate is for those morally and ethically corrupt sinners that accept Jesus as their saviour, it's hardly surprising anyone would what to go through it. Why mix with murderers and pedophiles?

Couldn't they have come up with a better advertisement?


Originally Posted by mauserand9mm
Originally Posted by mauserand9mm
Originally Posted by Raspy
Whatever you said...everyone knows you are a lying jerk.

That's a bold assertion. Point out where you think I lied.

Well?
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 2,839
K
Campfire Regular
Online Content
Campfire Regular
K
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 2,839
And it came to pass that St. Victor was taken from this place to another place, where he was lain upon pillows of silk and made to rest himself among sheets of muslin and velvet. And there, strokèd was he by maidens of the Orient. For sixteen days and nights strokèd they him, yea verily, and caressèd him.
His hair rufflèd they, and their fingers rubbèd they in oil of olives, and runnèd them across all parts of his body for as much as to soothe him. And the soles of his feet lickèd they, and the upper parts of his thigh did they anoint with a balm of forbidden trees. And with the teeth of their mouths nibblèd they the pointy bits at the top of his ears. Yea, verily, and did their tongues thereof make themselves acquainted with his most secret places.

For fifteen days and nights did Victor withstand these maidens. But on the sixteenth day, he cried out, saying:
"This is fantastic! Oh, this is terrific!"

And the Lord did hear the cry of Victor. And verily, came he down and slew the maidens, and caused their cotton-wool buds to blow away, and their Kleenex to be laid waste utterly.
And Victor, in his anguish, cried out that the Lord was a rotten bastard.
And the Lord sent an angel to comfort Victor for the weekend, and entered they together the jacuzzi.

Joined: Sep 2021
Posts: 11
G
New Member
Offline
New Member
G
Joined: Sep 2021
Posts: 11

I'm not claiming to be an authority but I have died and faced judgement and I can say with certainty your choices matter. What I can't say is who determines what is moral. Either there is a universal morality or you are judged on how well you follow the morality you were taught. I suspect it is a combo of those.

Originally Posted by RockyRaab
Do all the millions of races of space aliens
have the same God? Same Bible? Did Jay Zus go to all of them? Do they all have their own heaven or does every being have to share just one?


According to the born again guy I talked to in college 30 years ago he died for them as well. It's an old thought and boring. If aliens ever come here I think it'll make news for a week and then we'll all yawn, unless they come to destroy us, then we're screwed.

Joined: May 2011
Posts: 5,785
M
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
M
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 5,785
Originally Posted by kolofardos
And it came to pass that St. Victor was taken from this place to another place, where he was lain upon pillows of silk and made to rest himself among sheets of muslin and velvet. And there, strokèd was he by maidens of the Orient. For sixteen days and nights strokèd they him, yea verily, and caressèd him.
His hair rufflèd they, and their fingers rubbèd they in oil of olives, and runnèd them across all parts of his body for as much as to soothe him. And the soles of his feet lickèd they, and the upper parts of his thigh did they anoint with a balm of forbidden trees. And with the teeth of their mouths nibblèd they the pointy bits at the top of his ears. Yea, verily, and did their tongues thereof make themselves acquainted with his most secret places.

For fifteen days and nights did Victor withstand these maidens. But on the sixteenth day, he cried out, saying:
"This is fantastic! Oh, this is terrific!"

And the Lord did hear the cry of Victor. And verily, came he down and slew the maidens, and caused their cotton-wool buds to blow away, and their Kleenex to be laid waste utterly.
And Victor, in his anguish, cried out that the Lord was a rotten bastard.
And the Lord sent an angel to comfort Victor for the weekend, and entered they together the jacuzzi.


God didn't treat women all that well did he, ever since the Lilith incident


Originally Posted by mauserand9mm
Originally Posted by mauserand9mm
Originally Posted by Raspy
Whatever you said...everyone knows you are a lying jerk.

That's a bold assertion. Point out where you think I lied.

Well?
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 8,592
L
LBP Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
L
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 8,592
Originally Posted by Happy_Camper
Originally Posted by LBP
Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by Happy_Camper
Wrong DBT.
"Reward "would be earning your acceptance with God due to YOUR good works. The only thing God owes you or can reward you with is punishment for your sins.
Since His Son was nearly beaten to death in extreme torture, then nailed with spikes to suffer the torments of everyone's sins, He was rewarded with the death we deserve.
He offers not only a full pardon, but forgiveness.
Free for the asking.
Only a fool would turn that down.


Pascals Wager is flawed for a number of reasons. Morally, Ethically, what it says about the character of God, etc...

What if someone is fallable, incapable of good works, exploitative, selfish, greedy, yet has great faith in Jesus?

Or someone who has no 'faith in Jesus' yet is a great humanitarian, engaged in helping those in need and is doing their best to build a better society?

The former is saved while the latter burns in hell?


Exactly right. Works don’t save anyone, only believing in Jesus Christ sacrifice for your sins and resurrection will save you.



I'm glad that you understand God's grace LBP!
Who led you to the Lord? Sunday school teacher?


My mom the Sunday school teacher. 😉


Will Munny: It's a hell of a thing, killing a man. Take away all he's got and all he's ever gonna have.

The Schofield Kid: Yeah, well, I guess they had it coming.

Will Munny: We all got it coming, kid.
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 9,450
Campfire Outfitter
OP Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 9,450
Originally Posted by LBP
Originally Posted by Happy_Camper
Originally Posted by LBP
Originally Posted by DBT
Originally Posted by Happy_Camper
Wrong DBT.
"Reward "would be earning your acceptance with God due to YOUR good works. The only thing God owes you or can reward you with is punishment for your sins.
Since His Son was nearly beaten to death in extreme torture, then nailed with spikes to suffer the torments of everyone's sins, He was rewarded with the death we deserve.
He offers not only a full pardon, but forgiveness.
Free for the asking.
Only a fool would turn that down.


Pascals Wager is flawed for a number of reasons. Morally, Ethically, what it says about the character of God, etc...

What if someone is fallable, incapable of good works, exploitative, selfish, greedy, yet has great faith in Jesus?

Or someone who has no 'faith in Jesus' yet is a great humanitarian, engaged in helping those in need and is doing their best to build a better society?

The former is saved while the latter burns in hell?


Exactly right. Works don’t save anyone, only believing in Jesus Christ sacrifice for your sins and resurrection will save you.



I'm glad that you understand God's grace LBP!
Who led you to the Lord? Sunday school teacher?


My mom the Sunday school teacher. 😉

That's extra awesome when it's your own parent who has that honor.

Page 4 of 45 1 2 3 4 5 6 44 45

Moderated by  RickBin 

Link Copied to Clipboard
YB23

Who's Online Now
640 members (007FJ, 257Bob, 01Foreman400, 222ND, 160user, 1234, 69 invisible), 2,836 guests, and 1,427 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums81
Topics1,187,655
Posts18,399,259
Members73,817
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023


 







Fish & Game Departments | Solunar Tables | Mission Statement | Privacy Policy | Contact Us | DMCA
Hunting | Fishing | Camping | Backpacking | Reloading | Campfire Forums | Gear Shop
Copyright © 2000-2024 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.3.33 Page Time: 0.091s Queries: 15 (0.005s) Memory: 0.9296 MB (Peak: 1.1122 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2024-03-28 19:06:56 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS