Home Forums Birds & Dogs Upland Game "Universal" upland bird loads? ..... What would you recommend?

Great post, Kimberman. If I was going to limit myself to just-two sizes of shot, I could easily see myself doing what you're doing. Also I totally agree about using quality magnum [hard] shot in all shooting applications.

Just go out and get some winchester super X Hi-vel.

7 1/2 shot 3 and 3/4 drams equiv. ..

FAST kills just about everyhing including turkeys if you shoot for the head.

Spot

Interesting you should say that, Sharpshooter. (I like splitting hairs by reloading, however! )

Many, many, maaaanny yeeears ago I read an article by Bob Brister or Don Zutz on what might be the single best, do-everything-shotgun load for everything in the USA, certainly in CONUS.

The author said he'd choose a load of 7 1/2's, even for turkeys and geese - if it was ever necessary to ..... Head and neck shots was partly how he justified his choice.

I would take 1 3/8 ounce of nickel plated 5's if I could only have one load I could do just fine on all upland game birds and have with 5's they wouldn't be ideal for woodcocks and grouse but I have shot botht these birds with this load. Fiocchi makes a good one.

I believe Peter Capstick made this recommendation many years ago in one of his articles. I believe this article can be found on my bookshelf somewhere but haven't the time to look it up right now. Jim

The most balanced load for 12 Ga. is what is commonly referred to as a Pigeon Load it is 3 1/4 drams 1 1/4 oz. 7.5 shot 1220 fps . It is the one used in Europe and the U.S. for live pigeon shooting both box and hand thrown birds where side bets can be over 50,000 dls. Shells can be expensive but it is one of the lowest components on a hunting trip after gas and lodging . Get the best it can be a little light for wild Pheasants then go up to Fiocchi Nickel Plated 1 3/8 oz. of # 5 's

Winchester used to make this load with hard, copper-plated #6 shot, which was a marvelous load. It didn't kick much even in a relatively light double, and patterned so beautifully that it worked on about anything from doves to turkeys.

Of course nowadays the trend is to VELOCITY in shotshell loads, which killed this load. It is pretty easy to duplicate in a handload, however.

JB

MuleDeer, do you think there's much difference between nickel versus copper-plated shot? Which one should be preferred over the other? (regardless of cost).

I've heard of the classic 1 1/4oz - 1220fps 'pigeon load', and at different times have seen Remington and Federal offer it, but usually with 7 1/2's.

When killing birds, especially pheasants, grouse and waterfowl,

the single most important factor (IMO) I've noticed in an effective shotshell

is consistent [minimum] multiple-hits!

- usually due to a balanced well-choked load more than "velocity" or extra-large pellets.

Nickle plated shot is harder than copper plated shot so in theory it should pattern better.

Actually, either copper or nickle-pleated shot needs to be made of high-antimony lead alloy in the first place, otherwise the plating does no real good. The plating is very thin, so doesn't do an awful lot for the overall hardness of the shot. In fact, it is mostly there to "lube" the shot and make it flow better through the forcing cone and choke.

I learned some of this the hard way when I bought a box of highly-recommended ammo loaded with nickel-plated 5's on a pheasant hunt some years ago. It didn't seem to kill nearly as well as some of the Winchester #6 pigeon loads I'd been using, and I found out why when we processed the dead birds. The nickel-plated shot deformed easily, and so didn't penetrate nearly as well as the HARD copper-plated shot in the Winchester loads.

In fact, hard uncoated shot is better than a lot of the cheap plated shot you'll find.

JB

I tend to match shot size with choke. Pattern density is a function of both. 1 1/4 ounces of #9 shot through a full choke won't leave much of the quail for eating. Though it will be tenderized. That same load from a skeet or IC choke will make you look like the best wing shot in the county.

I use 1 1/8 oz loads of 7's in Remington hulls and 1250 velocity for the 12 ga. I'd load 7/8 oz of 7's for the 20 ga.

I used to shoot 7 1/2's and 6's all the time. The 7's work great on everything including pheseants. I normally shoot IC and occasionaly Modified choke.

7 1/2 shot winchester super-x. vel is 1450

remember if you shooting at ruffed grouse in the North east the shot needs to reach them before you pull the trigger. you've got about .8 to 2.1 seconds to nail them before they fly through a tree.

That's how I got my login - spot shooter!

When I lived in Florida and hunted doves, some shooters sought out the 1 1/4oz #9 loads! The range they could kill doves was often extreme.

For my first 15 years of bird hunting, I used my Model 42 Winchester (bored "modified") in the early days when it was my only shotgun. I used 3" factory-loaded shells with #6's for pheasant & rabbits... and #7�'s for everything else.

For the majority of my 60+ years of bird-hunting, I mostly used my own 12 gauge reloads in a Belguim-made Browning Superpose (bored improved cylinder & modified)... a trap/skeet load consisting of 1-1/8th ounce, 3-dram equivalent of Red Dot powder together with #6's for pheasants (copper-plated #6's in Nebraska on annual pheasant hunts) or the same shot weight/dram equivalent of #7 (yes "7's", not 7�'s) for grouse, chukars and partridge. For quail, I used 1-1/8th ounce & a 3 dram equivalent of either 7�'s or 8's in a 12 gauge. The 3 dram equivalent of powder probably yielded a muzzle velocity about 1250 fps (I never chronographed it).

I occasionally used my 28 gauge reloads in my Charles Daly over/under 28 gauge skeet gun (bored "skeet & skeet") with Herco powder and a variety of shot-weights... 3/4 oz skeet reloads... or factory loads of 7/8's or 1 ounce of shot... #6's for pheasants and usually #7� for chukars & partridge... and #8's for quail.

I never hunted the 28 gauge skeet gun without a good dog due to the very limited range (20 to 25 yards at most) of the skeet chokes.

The advantage we reloaders have is that we can choose any combination of shot size, shot weight and powder choice plus the amount of powder used to give us the most effective shotshell load possible for the game hunted and the expected type of cover.

I've always preferred AA hulls, but there's a lot of good hulls these days. For the 12 gauge, I'd recommend the 1-1/8th ounce load which I've always found gave excellent patterns. Since I never owned a 20 gauge gun, I can't suggest a load for it.


Strength & Honor...

Ron T.