Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Winchester Collectors 1954 Pre 64 30-06 Followed me home

Found it a local gun show. Was really disappointed nothing but pistols and AR stuff at the show except for one booth had some interesting stuff. Picked it up looked it over couldn’t bring myself to buy it. Thought didn’t last long had to go back and look again and it could not be denied.

Has original butt plate and correct length, no extra holes, matching serial numbers and great bluing. Also had an old weaver I thought would need to be replaced but I really like it so far. Has a fine reticle with a dot pretty cool old scope.

I could only find one issue which looked at first like a crack in the stock on top coming out of the widows peak. After looking at it closer it may be slip of a screwdriver or scratch? See what y’all think.

I may need to remove the butt plate to know for sure.

I had to take several pictures to get the light just right for it to show up.

Crack?

Rifle Pic

Another

It looks like a crack, but I hope you got a good enough deal you didn't get hurt if it was.

Looks to be in great shape otherwise.

I'd remove the butt plate and have a better look at it.

In the picture I had to get it just right to show up and it looks worse in the picture. In real life it looks almost identical to the scratch on the side. I will take off butt plate tonight and take a look.

I got it for $900 cash not great but not bad figured it was worth the risk. It really is beautiful otherwise

If it's just a scratch, you did fair in the deal. The nice thing about your rifle is it's all original. That is a huge plus. I'm hoping that is just a scratch and not a crack. One thing I can comment on is it looks like it may have been packed around by a kid or someone that didn't care too much about smacking it around through the brush, but not shot a lot. There's not a lot of carry signs though: Wear on the floor plate and surrounding area of stock. They took care of the metal though, so that is important. How's the crown? I'll bet is shoots lights out if the crown isn't dinged up. Do you have any 165 Hornady SP interlocks to try in it? All of my 30-06 rifles love that bullet.

It hasn’t been carried a lot and the crown is perfect and bore is amazing. It looks like some finish wear on the barrel in one of my pictures but it is just my fingerprints.

I will look for some 165’s Hornady I don’t think I have any.

That isn't a bad old gal at all. If that is a crack, that is a rather unusual place for one isn't it. I have seen them chip way more that one straight crack.

I wish I had some, I'd send you some. I haven't shot my 30-06 rifles on a regular basis for a long time. Looking at the rifle, I figured the bore would be pristine. I'll bet it shoots better than you would think. Keep us posted.

Nice rifle and that looks like a scratch to me - best I can tell on the iPhone. Think you did real good - don’t find many in that shape anymore!

PennDog

I was told it was purchased from the back room of a pawn shop when owner died. Took it in but set it aside and never put it out front so damage could just handling/storage.

Plus it has just enough damage I don’t feel bad about using it.

Yes, that makes a lot of sense. I can see that as a possibility. The scratch could have came from storing it with a bunch of rifles too. Moving them around or them banging into one another leaves bruises and scratches. That rifle needs to be used and loved again..

I’d have been all over it for 900, I am looking for just that kinda rifle!

It does’nt look like a crack in the photo, but if it is a scratch from a screwdriver, I would stop calling them idiot scratches on1911’s, to Model 70 idiot scratches.

That made me laugh.

I'll keep my eye out. I know where a sweetheart 264 fwt is. Did you have your buddy go and check that rifle out?

To me, one of the greatest features of your deal, the 'hands-on' pre-purchase evaluation opportunity, as happening. Ability to evaluate & 'know what you're buying'. Versus a few fuzzy photos and exaggerated - as to be expected - seller hype; remote purchase! 'Comfort factor' at best! 'Disaster avoided' consequence at worst. Nice deal on a truly great rifle achieved! Congrats for sure!

Momentary war story pause, 'word association' conjuring term: "butt-crack" problems... 'Repurposing' aircraft jump-seats to accommodate NSA "airborne mobile surveillance platform" techs! NSA heralded computer crunching power with complaints re "Ergonomics" remaining as "UTUO". "Unknown Term of Undefined Origins." Net, net... Flight Surgeon with: "How does this keep recurring?" Plausible deniability retort: "Err... Diaper rash?"
Best!
John

Looks like a scratch. As you move away from the butt plate, the little hook at the end of the scratch starts to cut across the grain. A crack typically follows the grain of the wood. Also a crack tends to widen as it moves toward the less constricted portion of the wood, as in around the action cutout, or the sawn end of the end of the stock. The mark on your rifle appears to be of uniform depth and width throughout its length. Its a scratch

No, he's out of town for a bit longer. Snowbird, heads south in the winter...

I vote scratch.

Well took the butt plate off and went both directions of scratch or crack and now back to not sure. Keep in mind I can’t much with the naked eye just trying to take good pictures and blow them up to determine.

Took good picture before removing butt plate. Convinced not a crack based on this photo. Uniform, doesn’t taper off or follow grain.

Pic 1

Took off but plate! Oh crap it is a crack! Further inspection line doesn’t continue to side edge of stock and seems to continue to top of stock in a fairly straight line. So now not sure. I will say it is undetectable with a fingernail but can be detected with a sharp blade.

Pic 2

Final photo there is no evidence of the two connecting to each other and would think crack would extend to weakest portion at screw hole if dropped? So now thinking I am right where I started as not sure.

Pic 3

However I think I am confident in saying it doesn’t seem to be a structural issue or weak point so I should just leave it alone and do nothing and enjoy it. Something my wife or daughter can debate with someone after I am gone.

Idg397: Good find on your part.
Never miss a chance to go to a gunshow - never know what you will find.
In fact back in 1969 I attended a gunshow where I found and bought a Winchester pre-64 Model 70 Standard Rifle in 30/06 caliber.
The serial number dates it to May 3rd of 1954 production.
It has been a sweetheart for me since day one.
I have only tried ONE bullet in this Rifle and I suggest it to you - the wonderful, accurate and reliable Nosler 165 grain Partition!
Over the next 3 1/2 decades I harvested all manner of Big Game with it including Mt. Goat, Elk, Antelope, 3 species of Deer and Black Bear with this Rifle ammo combo.
Back in about 2,006 - 2,007 I "retired" this Rifle and am still letting it enjoy its well deserved time off.
I hope YOU will be as happy with your gunshow find as I have been with mine.
By the way I originally mounted a Leupold 3x9 variable scope on it - later I "up-graded" to a Leupold 3.5x10 variable.
Again good for you - and if you intend to Hunt with it be sure to try that Nosler Partition.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Ldg397, if you are worried about it, check out Dan Early wine @ Stewmac.com. He fixes a lot of older guitars with cracks and such using a very thin type of super glue . It is available through them.
It is in a fine tipped syringe and is invisible.

FTR , No way I could have walked out of that shop without that rifle. Nice find,good on ya!

Were it mine, and I wish it were as we’re the same age, I’d do some fixing myself. I’d not want it to grow larger, and it can be done invisibly.

I would chisel a small canal along the crack under the buttplate. I would then drill a hole, about 1/8” in diameter, at the very end of the crack, about an inch or even a bit longer. I’d do the same at the top or tip under the buttplate, as well as several along the crack. I would then use AcraGlas Gel, colored to match the wood, and work the epoxy into all those holes with toothpicks, then spread it like peanut butter in the little canal. I would use a straight edge of some kind to get rid of excess epoxy. Coat the buttplate with release agent (or wax, PAM, etc.), then screw it on normally. You should not have excess that squishes out, but if you do, just wipe it off.

In the top of the stock which shows in the photos, I would use Super Glue. This will seal the crack from the outside. Wipe off excess immediately. You may want to do this a couple times.

This sounds more complex than it is, and I only suggest AcraGlas as it’s easily available from Brownell’s and I have had much success with it. Many other epoxies would work well also.

The big idea is to hog enough wood from the crack to allow the epoxy to bind and hold strongly. The Super Glue trick was passed to me by David Trevallion.

Personally, I'd probably just use the superglue trick, or even some tru oil. If only to seal that area. It really doesn't appear to be a crack, like someone else mentioned about the area toward the front where it goes against the grain. Appears to be a scratch, as if it were a crack it would not do that. It would continue to follow the grain of the wood. Also, I went out and found a gem of a 30-06 fwt today. Not entirely original though, with its Mcmillan and $400.00 Leupold on top with Conetrol rings and bases. Other than that it is entirely original. Good thing I know where that primo fwt stock is hiding out at an old gunsmith's shop. Should be a great addition to the collection. It will make a great hunter, just the way it is. I may even leave the old VariX III 3.5-10x40 on top as the whole rifle is set up just right for hunting.

Nice looking classic,
hopefully it's just a scratch, otherwise glue it up and go enjoy it just the same.

Well done. The last thing I need is another 30-06 but for $900 I would have grabbed that one in a heartbeat.


Okie John

Really nice!

I bought a Pre-64 30/06 Featherweight that had 13 rds. through it for $1000.00. I have the original box and paperwork. This was several years ago.

Took it out of the stock yesterday to change out the swivels yesterday. I don’t think it has ever been out of the stock it was covered in a layer of grime under the stock. About 5 minutes with some clp and a rag it wiped right off looks brand new under there. My new swivel wouldn’t thread into the existing so I took it as a sign it needs to stay I will buy a different sling to work.

Considering upgrading to a gloss leupold for hunting use. Looks like the most common are the vari x iii 3.5x10x40 and the vari x IIc 3x9x40. I also see a lot of m8 6x. What do you guys have on yours? Looks the first two maybe a little longer giving me more mounting options.

If you can find an older 2.5x8 they seem to have some decent tube length on them as well. The M8 6x is a nice one as well. They garner a lot of money used for what they are, but if that’s what completes the package I’m sure you’ll forget about the price soon enough.

I’d use a M8 4X.

Been looking for a gloss vxiii 3.5x10x40 and the prices are nuts. Found a mint matte vx3 I couldn’t pass up. Will see how it works if i really like it may send away to get the cerakote gloss coating.

Good luck with the Leupy. I just sold my 3.5-10x40.

I shouldn’t have any problem I usually set it and forget it. I am not much of a dialer prefer to hold.

Resist the urge to modify it or "make it better".

If its "all original", that is great advice. If not, its fair game. The rifle I just bought, someone made it "better". I sold the leupold that was on it and am in the process of selling the bases and rings. When that happens, I'll have $300.00 into the rifle and its still worth $1,000.00+. Its all in how you see things.. I just bought a Tikka yesterday and someone did a lot of things to "make it better". I added up the cost of the stock, mountain tactical bottom metal, picatinny rail, and new bolt handle and the sum of parts were as much as I paid for the rifle. Ha ha.. Doesn't get much better than that.. plus the shop owner threw in a new set of Leupold 30mm rings. When I got there, he asked the typical question: "hi, what you looking for". I said a great deal, my typical response, you have any of those? He said, "pick any rifle and I'll make you a great deal". As for making said rifle "better". He can do that without hurting the originality and value of the rifle. A Mcmillan is a great example of that. Just keep the original stock stored safely so he can return it back to original if he ever wants. That's the beauty in these rifles. I wouldn't cut an original stock to put a recoil pad on it. If original, I probably wouldn't glass bed it either. He did good on the deal and can always make his money back. Cool deal as far as I'm concerned. Now I want to see how it shoots and looks when he gets it topped with that Leupold.

Plan is to not change anything but the optics and go kill stuff. Maybe put a sealer of some kind under the steel butt plate but that is about it.

way better than a post-64 1954...

Found an really nice original 1953 m70 in 30-06. I'd post a pic but can't downsize them with this phone

Post em up. This kind of thread makes me want to go and search for more of these old rifles. As if I wasn't bad enough as it was..

This is a super grade 220 Swift that a LGS had on the rack for a really decent price. I thought I might flip it, but it really shoots well…

Shrap- Better keep that one. It would pile up a bunch of Norks in your bean field if we ever go Red Dawn under Brandon.

Nothing says Rifle Looney like sending hollow points with a rifle that looks good and shoots accurately as well.

Nice!

Need some more advice. I had some time this afternoon started pulling off the old scope and mounts getting ready to mount the matte leupold vx3. I was cleaning up the old k4 with goo gone and 000 steel wool and the ring marks came right off and this dang thing is starting to look like brand new and is crystal clear shocking how little difference it is between vx3. Granted it is broad daylight but was thinking this isn’t going to be a rainy day crawl up a mountain rifle. It looks way better on the rifle than the VX3. How much am I really giving up with the K4.

Next question if I keep it would like to use a classic good looking mount. Suggestions? I usually lean toward S&k but not sure they are right for this one.

Keep it simple man. Use the Weaver..

If you use the Weaver to look period correct, it will either mount nicely in vintage Weaver bases and rings, or if there is not enough fore and aft you should use vintage Redfield one piece base and rings.

I'd do as BSA suggested, use the Weaver setup, looks good the way it came.

Yep, the 270 I used to have came with a nice Weaver K4 and I used it for a while:


I had it mounted in DD's though.. I think your weaver mounts and rings look more fitting though..

Was getting to remount after I cleaned everything up. I noticed the weaver bases were 35 and 37. Everything I find online says to use 46 and 47. I bought a pair of 46 and 47 should I use those or is there a reason to use the 35 and 37? Biggest difference seems to be rear base the new one is quite a bit thicker than the old one.

Weird, I've always used 46/47. I have a bunch of those because of that. I wonder if Redneck or any of the other gunsmiths may know off the top of their head why the 35 and 37 was used on your rifle? Someone posted a link to weaver mounts about 4 months ago. Maybe that thread or link would be helpful??

Don't have specs on the #37 but this may, or may not help!

W.R. Weaver Company Mount Base Specifications
DETACHABLE MOUNT BASES
No. of Base Length Hole Spacing Diameter Thickness
11 .812 .504 1.290 .147
12 .812 .504 .925 .155
13 .812 .504 .730 .238
14 .812 .504 Tapered for Savage 99 only
15 .812 .504 .946 .195
16 .812 .504 .840 .205
17 .812 .504 .770 .219
18 .812 .504 1.050 .182
19 .812 .504 1.160 .125
20A 1.168 .860 1.360 .127
21 .812 .504 .710 .273
22 .812 .504 .700 .201
24 .812 .504 .900 .271
25 .812 .504 1.125 .248
27 .812 .504 .930 Tapered .161/.185
28 .812 .504 Flat .239
29 .812 .504 Flat .292
30 .812 .504 .845 Tapered .205/.230
31 .812 .504 Octag. .182
32 .812 .504 Octag. .357
35 1.168 .860 1.290 .147
36 1.401 .604 3.900 .272
39 .812 .504 Flat .165
40A 1.840 .860 1.290 .147
42 .812 .504 .730 .298
43 .812 .504 .840 .265
44 .812 .504 .770 .279
45 .812 .504 1.050 .396
46 1.168 .860 1.290 .222
47 1.168 .860 2.692 .368
48 .812 .504 1.290 .395
49A 1.058 Win. 70 in 375 H&H, 300 H&H only .368
50 4.500 .504 Flat-Tapered .200/.232
53 4.983 Win. 88, 100 1.290 .222
54 .812 .504 1.290 .222
55 .812 .504 1.050 .310
57 2.340 .960 1.220 .250
58 4.624 3.275 Flat .283
59 .812 One hole only Notched .366
60 4.500 Browning .22 Auto, H&R "Topper" .361
61 1.168 .860 Flat .360
62 4.430 Rem. 740, 760 1.290 .222
63A 6.125 Marlin 336 Flat .283
63B 5.450 Marlin 336 Flat .370
65 2.000 None Spec. * .322
66 2.650 None Spec. * .322
67 1.650 None Spec. * .332
68 .812 .504 .916 .399
70 5.900 Rem 600 1.290 .275
71 1.168 .748 1.180 .215
72 .812 .504 2.590 .376
74 5.723 Savage 24V 1.125 .275
75 1.168 .860 1.050 .310
76 .812 One hole only 1.050 .310
77 .812 .504 .700 Tapered .248/.267
78 .812 .504 .880 Tapered .171/.198
79 .912 .604 3.900 .272
80 6.125 .500 1.892 .147
81 6.000 H&R 360, 361 .946 Tapered .237/.252
82 6.000 H&R Topper 158C 1.050 .396
83 .812 .504 1.252 .250
84 1.168 .860 1.252 .250
85 1.168 .860 1.124 .275
86 .862 .555 .925 Tapered .366/.396
87 5.000 H&R 700 1.050 .400
88 5.900 Mossberg 500AS 1.500 .496
89 .862 .560 1.062 .347Fr/.301Rr
90 5.000 Marlin 39A .300Fr/.428Rr
91 1.400 .504 .946 .280
92 4.500 Thompson Contender Hand Gun .361
93 4.430 Rem 4/6/7400/7600 1.290 .222
94 .812 .500 1.124 .170
95 1.168 .860 1.124 .170
TO-9 4.750 Ruger 10/22 2.000 Tapered .155/.170
TO-10 5.00 Grooved for most 22's Spec. * .175

Simple math tells us the #37 probably has a thickness of .293". I believe I have some out in the shop. Those would be lower mounts than the 46/47 combo..

I just have to say that my most recent model purchase was a 1954 model 70 standard and it had Weaver 35 and 37 bases on it as well. It now wears 46 and 47. It had an old Weaver V-9 on it.

Mike, why did you change out the mounts? Seems they would be good for a lower scope mount.

It looks like to me the 47 is quite a bit thicker than the 37. The 35 and the 46 seem to be the same. I don’t think it would be lower it would be angled. I think the 47 more closely matches the difference in the bridge heights and would provide a better mount I would think the 35, 37 would give you problems on your elevation limits.

The 35,37 seems to mount scope pointing more away from the barrel and 46,47 is at a minimum level of that makes since.

I changed them out because I knew they were wrong and figured the previous owner made due with what he had.

Ah, I see. I don't have the specs on the 37. If it is not the thickness I said in an earlier post, I would not use it. It would be incorrect. A simple ring alignment tool would verify instantly. Again, people should not be putting on scope mounts and rings if they don not know how to PROPERLY do so. This stuff is definitely not rocket surgery. Especially scope mounting.

What is the consensus on the thumb screws left side or right side??

New 46 and 47 bases look great and work perfect.

I think it is personal preference anymore. It really only matters on guns that have something you need to actuate on this side or that, i.e. M98 Mauser , M1903 Springfield, 1917 Enfield conversions or commercials based on those designs. The bolt release levers generally cause you to want to put the thumb screws opposite. Some ejection ports may make you want to put them opposite as well. Neither of those are issues with Win 70's.

Ditto. I completely agree

I've seen in more than one place where people don't grasp that having two bases putting the scope rings at different heights is not the same thing as having an inclined one piece base.

Yeah, that is not good. Always use scope mount charts and then double check with your ring alignment tools. Don't just use the sharp points either! An out of alignment issue can be seen when you use the square ends. Like I said earlier, the chart does not list the #37. I still have not gone out in the shop to see if I have some. I probably do, if they make them. Weird why the chart does not list that one???