Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Are We Seeing “Counterfeit” Bullets Hit Our Market?

Not long ago the word went out that there 6mm 95 grain NBT (factory seconds) bullets for sale from an online shooting sports supplier obviously at a discounted price. I purchased 500 of these bullets and all went as the supplier stated. No issue with them as far as business on the deal.
When I got the bullets, ALL of the bullets were packaged in bags of 50 each with BT 95 Gr. on the label. (No mention of “Nosler” anywhere that I saw.
All bullets purchased had a connelure rolled on the bullets. Roughly (guessing) 1/3 of them were much closer to the ogive than the others.
Now, I can not for the life of me ever remember Nosler ever having a connelure on ANY bullet that they have ever manufacatured. I could be wrong about this and will happily expect to be corrected on the matter. I personally don’t think that Nosler even owns a connelure roll die, but again, I could be wrong.
I do know that none of the Nosler Ballistic Tips or any other Nosler bullet that I have ever bought has had a connelure. Not on the 6mm 95 grainers or 90 grainers nor any other caliber or weight of bullets.
I have NOT shot any of these bullets and cannot say how well the shoot, BUT it has me wondering if we are starting to see “knock-off” bullets hit our market during this time of shortage of shooting supplies.
I know of an individual who recently purchases a pocket knife that was supposedly made by a reputable American manufacturer. The box, knife and literature was unbelievably identical to the American manufacturer but when he checked the OEM, their website clearly stated that this website and product was a counterfeit.
It does have me wondering.

I’d bet there’re Noslers. I’ve got piles of Partitions, Accubonds and Ballistic Tips with the crimp groove in them. Chances are they were made for an ammo manufacture, likely their own stuff and those that you have are 2nds or blems from that run.

I’ve got red and orange tipped Accubonds, Grey tipped Ballistic Tips and all kinds of stuff from over the years.

I wouldn’t be worried myself.

Sometimes SPS even spells out that the bullets have a cannelure.

The seller’s add clearly states they were factory “seconds”. Guess I forgot to mention that(?).
Never tried to insinuate otherwise.
But who on earth would they (Nosler) be making custom connelure bullets for? Have you ever seen these bullets made (with connelure) under another brand?????
Besides, they can sell everything they make right now to the general public at a much higher price.

Nosler makes plenty of bullets with cannelures (not "connalures") for various ammo companies, for use in factory ammo. Often they sell the these as "overruns." The placement of the cannelure might vary due to what cartridge the bullets were meant for.

Who was the "online retailer", Shooters Pro Shop? They are part of Nosler.

Yes, sometimes the 2nds or overruns have a cannelure because they were intended for loaded ammunition.

SPS has changed the labels to generic white labels with black lettering this past fall, instead of the gold, black, and white labels they used for the past decade or so.

Probably another victim of the supply chain shortage........

I have .243, 90 grain, purple tipped, bt's with the can.

I've got a couple thou 77gr .224 with cannelures that were made when Nosler was vying for the Mk262 contract. Contract spec'd cannelures, so Nosler and Sierra put cannelures on bullets that normally didn't come with them.

Exactly what I was thinking.
Worry not, go forth and shoot stuff.

I’m just relieved we averted a conspiracy theory. If Curdog had posted this up on the Boobs & Politics forum it would’ve went 20 pages of Soros, Clinton, Davos, and Q……..

No doubt

I’ve gotten bullets from SPS packed in boxes made for the .357 BTs they make for airguns.

I think I should probably post this as my small contribution to our cumulative effort to evade being seized by a conspiracy cold, as Alpine mentions.

My Howa 270's preferred Nosler BT load (the black and gold box BT) suddenly stopped being its preferred load late last year when I replaced them with Nosler blems of the same stripe and fur. I ran out of the old black and gold box yellow tips, so I ordered some seconds from SPS. They showed up with grey tips. Further more, it didn't take a pair of fine glasses to know that they were not the same shape. You could take an old black and gold pill (I had 3 left) and place it next to the new BT with the grey tip, and you could see the difference. Measuring revealed the ogive was not in the same place, and I don't mean by half a thou. I called Nosler and managed to get hold of an engineer? Man I can't remember his title, but at any rate...he called me after I left a message with Nosler actual human support. The short of it; Nosler makes their molds by hand, and over time...the shape changes a bit. And the grey tip? Those were originally intended for their combined technology bullets, but they didn't get the coating and ended up being sold as BT's.

While I had to fiddle with the load and jump to reach a state of behavior, I managed. All this as gentle warning for what others may find, and for further support the idea that bullets with the Nosler name...do in fact come from Nosler.

Thank you Sniggly and others.
FYI, the ogive (spell check by MD/JB please) on these blems that I was referring to are ALSO way out of wack!
AND as you stated, one does not need a pair of glasses to see it. Even found a couple with NO tip at all in the front, just a hollow point.
Will shoot away as one has suggested but am doubtful of the accuracy I will get.

I hope one of you can tell me some of the loaded ammo brands that Nosler sells bullets to that have a “CANNELURE”?
I still wonder how on earth a “CANNLEURE” got on to a BALLISTIC TIP………..
Was it a major screw up by employee?

If you are shooting at 100 yards or thereabouts, I doubt the absence of that nylon (if that's what it is) tip will make a bit of difference. It's just a hollow point...at that point, and many match bullets are hollow points. But here's the more important part, even if we never discover the reason for the existence of that cannelure, the rifle won't know they are there.

yep i got plenty Nosler bullets with cannelure on bullets work just fine

SoTexcurdog,

You still haven't stated where you bought the bullets.

Have toured several bullet factories, and talked considerably about bullet manufacturing with them.

I don't doubt that somebody at Nosler told you something about their bullets varying over time--but the forming dies for jacketed bullets are NOT "molds." Instead they are indeed dies, and like reloading dies do vary somewhat, due to both having to use new reamers, and the reamers wearing "over time."

Was told by another company well-known for making very accurate bullets that they usually replace their bullet-forming dies after around 40,000 bullets--but that this also depends on their continual testing of bullet quality-, which as with most major bullet factories not only includes checking bullet dimensions, but firing tests. With hunting bullets these not only include accuracy tests, using indoor ranges to eliminate wind-drift, but shooting them into various kinds of test media.

But it's rare for bullets made from one set of forming dies to EXACTLY match the bullets made from another set. Then there's the small differences in jacket material, or lead alloys for cores. Which is why many when many target shooters find a manufacturing lot of bullets that shoot really well, they try to buy some more from that lot.

Honestly MD it probably was dies instead of molds. Interestingly enough, I bought a brand new box of BT's (130's) the day after I had the discussion with the 'engineer' (wish I could remember if that was his actual title). I couldn't deny my own curiosity. They measured, for the most part, exactly like the blems with the grey tips.

If you are old enough you will remember when Partitions had a "cannelure" which was really a relief groove to alleviate pressures.
I believe that I heard this was caused by the jacket material used at the time.

Seen many that have a cannelure. Seconds that is.