|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,069
Campfire Kahuna
|
OP
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,069 |
I was reading some facts and figures about Yellowstone Park. It was talking about elk and had this 'fact':
54. Dominant bull elk require a harem of females, ranging from 5 to 90 at a time.
I've seen a lot of elk harems and I think the biggest was 20 cows. 90? How could a bull breed 90 cows?
“In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” ― George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 10,936
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 10,936 |
How could a bull breed 90 cows? Don't know, but if I was a bull, I would want to know where to volunteer to find out.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 9,355
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 9,355 |
The old bulls walk down and f..k 'em all.
I know, it is an old joke.
mike r
Don't wish it were easier Wish you were better
Stab them in the taint, you can't put a tourniquet on that. Craig Douglas ECQC
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,145
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,145 |
I’ve had 90 bitches to keep track of before. It is a lot of work, being a dominate male but I deal with it.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,466
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,466 |
Based on other animals there is no way a bull can service that many cows,
But then they are haywire on the carrying capacity of the grass in the park when it comes to grazing critters.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,607
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,607 |
The National Park Service has a long history of ineptitude in reference to animal management. Pretty much anything they get involved with gets screwed up. From Canadian wolves, to Bison, to Elk. It is laughable if you think that that they actually have a clue about accurate numbers, in terms of breeding, or anything else. They can no more manage animals, than they can anything else. Sexual harassment, financial mismanagement nepotism, and outright fraud, th list goes on and on. The NPS is a total GoatFluck of stupidity.
THE CHAIR IS AGAINST THE WALL. The Tikka T3 in .308 Winchester is the Glock 19 of the rifle world. The website is up and running!www.lostriverammocompany.com
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 14,027
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 14,027 |
The National Park Service has a long history of ineptitude in reference to animal management. Pretty much anything they get involved with gets screwed up. From Canadian wolves, to Bison, to Elk. It is laughable if you think that that they actually have a clue about accurate numbers, in terms of breeding, or anything else. They can no more manage animals, than they can anything else. Sexual harassment, financial mismanagement nepotism, and outright fraud, th list goes on and on. The NPS is a total GoatFluck of stupidity. and thats the truth!
the consolidation of the states into one vast republic, sure to be aggressive abroad and despotic at home, will be the certain precursor of that ruin which has overwhelmed all those that have preceded. Robert E Lee ~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,145
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,145 |
The National Park Service has a long history of ineptitude in reference to animal management. Pretty much anything they get involved with gets screwed up. From Canadian wolves, to Bison, to Elk. It is laughable if you think that that they actually have a clue about accurate numbers, in terms of breeding, or anything else. They can no more manage animals, than they can anything else. Sexual harassment, financial mismanagement nepotism, and outright fraud, th list goes on and on. The NPS is a total GoatFluck of stupidity. I am no fan of the NPS, having worked directly with them a few times over the years, but they're no more inept than roughly the same percentage of workers in the public sector. The hiring process is ridiculously long but partly for a reason. Policy and regs necessitate the scrutinization and if there was any hint of nepotism, it'd be brought up ASAP. That sexual harassment thing that happened a while back resulted in a lot of disciplinary action and removals IIRC. As has some fraud that I have known about. My guess is that some public affairs person didn't get the input from a biologist before publishing that piece about 5-90 cows. I've seen worse slip ups, both in govt and the private sector.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 43,726
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 43,726 |
I’ve had 90 bitches to keep track of before. It is a lot of work, being a dominate male but I deal with it. This. Big, hairy and black. And they'll kick the chit outta you!
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,077
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,077 |
I’ve seen some big harems especially up in the “typical” elk type country where they rut in big parks. And it’s typically a nice herd bull running them and running satellites off. But, I think the biggest bulls will only keep small harems or go from herd to herd checking for hot cows and push them into hidey holes. It takes too much extra energy to keep up with the big harems and fighting satellites. Let the 5-6 year old bull gather them then like was said before, walk down and screw them all.
I’d believe that number pretty easy with sheep(aoudad, Barbary) huge herds up to 300 with 4-5 mature rams working it.
"I used to be a tired hunting guide, now I'm just a re-tired hunting guide"
"No eternal reward will forgive us now, for wasting the dawn" JM
Jared
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 29,664
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 29,664 |
The harem bull will not do 90 cows. Likely the satellite guys are responsible for the majority. We see herds in the fall numbering 200-300 with a couple dandy bulls running the show. The satellite boys, however, are quite good at sneaking in and hustling a hot cow off to the side.
Many years back a couple of Oregon NE units were down to 4 or 5 bulls per hundred cows. One could find 50 cows a day across the season and never spot a bull. The final result was an extremely extended calving season with the predators also experiencing an extended season on calves. They cut tag numbers in those units and got the bull/cow ratio to around 25/100.
Some of the Starkey Oregon work also showed that a cadre of older bulls (5 yr) were much more efficient breeders than a herd dominated by spikes. Made for a shorter more condensed calving season too saturating the predators.
Last edited by 1minute; 05/22/22.
1Minute
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 10,626
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 10,626 |
You need to check out the Valles Caldera during the rut sometime…
The people wringing their hands over Trump's rhetoric don't know what time it is in America.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,125
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 21,125 |
Ya Roosevelt’s are quite a bit different, in habits, behaviors, patterns etc.
I’m just guessing, my “hunting skills are seriously lacking”, I just watch em and fuuck with em monthly. It’s weird, but I do it, and it’s fun. I can tell ya, due to feed, terrain and pressure, totally different critters.👊🏻
Ping pong balls for the win. Once you've wrestled everything else in life is easy. Dan Gable I keep my circle small, I’d rather have 4 quarters than 100 pennies.
Ain’t easy havin pals.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 19,029
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 19,029 |
After observing elk in Yellowstone and Rocky Mountain parks, foe quite few years while my wife was photographing them,my experience is as 1Minute's. Although herds of 100-150 are common with a big herd bull, there is always several satellite bulls around that sneak in a service some cows while the big bull is chasing of other bulls.
If God wanted you to walk and carry things on your back, He would not have invented stirrups and pack saddles
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 23,394
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 23,394 |
The National Park Service has a long history of ineptitude in reference to animal management. Pretty much anything they get involved with gets screwed up. From Canadian wolves, to Bison, to Elk. It is laughable if you think that that they actually have a clue about accurate numbers, in terms of breeding, or anything else. They can no more manage animals, than they can anything else. Sexual harassment, financial mismanagement nepotism, and outright fraud, th list goes on and on. The NPS is a total GoatFluck of stupidity. I am no fan of the NPS, having worked directly with them a few times over the years, but they're no more inept than roughly the same percentage of workers in the public sector. The hiring process is ridiculously long but partly for a reason. Policy and regs necessitate the scrutinization and if there was any hint of nepotism, it'd be brought up ASAP. That sexual harassment thing that happened a while back resulted in a lot of disciplinary action and removals IIRC. As has some fraud that I have known about. My guess is that some public affairs person didn't get the input from a biologist before publishing that piece about 5-90 cows. I've seen worse slip ups, both in govt and the private sector. Talk about ineptitude look no further than state government. It’s so bad I resigned from my state gig a week ago and going to school under the VA voc rehab program. When a state agency can make the U.S Army look like one of the best ran organizations in the world you know their is something wrong.
Then STFU. The rest of your statement is superflous bullshit with no real bearing on this discussion other than to massage your own ego. Suckin' on my titties like you wanted me.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 17,585
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 17,585 |
I’ve had 90 bitches to keep track of before. It is a lot of work, being a dominate male but I deal with it.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 10,639
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 10,639 |
Any time I've seen a herd over about 12 there's at least one satellite bull hanging around. And when there's a herd nearing 100, there are several. I think one bull would have a hard time keeping track of 90 cows........
A true sportsman counts his achievements in proportion to the effort involved and fairness of the sport. - S. Pope
|
|
|
153 members (338Rules, 32_20fan, 358WCF, 257_X_50, 1minute, 300_savage, 19 invisible),
1,976
guests, and
950
robots. |
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
Forums81
Topics1,187,726
Posts18,400,650
Members73,822
|
Most Online11,491 Jul 7th, 2023
|
|
|
|