Home Forums Birds & Dogs Waterfowl Steel duck loads, what size/type???

I need some help here boys.<p>I went out the other day, for the first time in 15 years. We did some pot-hole shooting, I got shots at 4 ducks. The first one seemed to be a clean miss.<p>On the 2nd one, I Arkansawed him. (that is when they come in to land and you let them land before you shoot). I got a good look at my pattern on the water (I was a good ways above the water, on the bank) and he was right in the middle of it. He took off, slow and I busted him again and broke his wing. By the time I got there he'd hiden under a bush, but was dead.<p>#2 It seemed as if he started flying slower after the 1st shot, and on the 2nd he started dropping, but still flapping the wings and got about 50 yards away. I never found him. The dog had no idea what I was trying to do, tromping around in the shoulder-high brush.<p>#3, I saw feathers fly off'n him after the lst shot and he went down w/a busted wing after #2. The dog finally got w/the program and chased down the duck, as it was paddling and flying, w/one wing down the creek. (making good time too) I coulda shot him again, but I figured it might be a good lession for the dog. The dog had the duck under a bush. But, the duck was very much alive and I don't think he would had cashed in his chips anytime soon.<p>So, I shot at 4 ducks and I believe that I hit 3 of em w/the lst shot, and definitly all 3 w/shot #2 and the results were not good. <p>I was using Remington #3, 1 oz, at about (box claimed) 1355fps. What size shot should I be using? <p>At the store, I noticed that they had 1 oz at about 1350-1400 fps loads or 1 1/4 oz at 1200-1250fps. Which is better, more steel, or more fps?

My reasearch indicates two things about steel. It flys differently, and patterns differently than lead. It kills just as well. Actually, it penetrates about 5% better IF you go to two sizes larger. Many waterfowl hunters like size 1 for both large ducks and geese. No. 3 seems to work well for all ducks, but no. 1 seemes to hit harder.
You usually need to go to a more open choke. a Modified, instead of a Full choke for pass shooting, and maybe an Improved Cylinder for decoys. What your looking for is a nice even pattern-all the way to the edges-at the ranges you will be shooting.
I like a 3 inch, 12 ga., 1 1/4 oz. load in either No. 1, or No. 3.
You need to remmember that it's faster than lead at most duck ranges. The patteren doesn't string out like lead does either. E

If you are going to use steel instead of the several better and legal choices, I would use 3s or 2s for decoying ducks and 1s, BBs, or BBBs for pass shooting geese or large ducks. All of the above in the heaviest shot charge that you can fit in your gun. Range is critical with steel, it is nearly worthless past 40 yards except for the very largest sizes. You will cripple more than you get, restrain yourself and wait for in range work. <p>BTW, a duck on the water, particularly from above, is notoriously difficult to kill. You would almost certainly have done better and been more sporting if you had shot him with his wings spread, just before landing. <p>Finally, even with a dog, but critical without one, carry a handful of cheap steel 6s. Great for the killing head shot on a crippled duck.

Why would a 3 inch, 1 1/4 oz load of # 1 be any better than the same load in a 2 3/4 inch shell? I am going duck and goose hunting soon. The local gun store has 2 3/4 inch shells with 1 1/4 oz of # 1 shot for $10.00 per box. their 3 inch shells loaded with 1 1/4 oz of # 1 shot are $ 19.00 per box. (same brand) Seams to me that 1 1/4 oz of shot at the same velocity don't care if it comes out of a 3 inch shell or a 2 3/4 inch shell. Am I missing something here? <p>BTW my turkey hunting buddy bought a 3 1/2 inch 12 ga. for hunting turkey. He says it's better than a 3 inch shell. I quess it gets him a half inch closer to the turkey?

PDshooter:<p>I am not going back and research all the data on steel loads, but it is highly unlikely that the 2 3/4 inch 1 1/4 ounce shot load are as fast as the 3 inchers in the same shot weight. And speed is a very critical factor in steel, lower velocities were one of the reasons that the initial factory steel loads were such poor performers.<p>Finally, I do not shoot anything by 1 3/8 3 inch steel when I am serious, although if I am real serious I use hevi-shot(highly recommmended) or some other legal non-steel shell, like Bismuth. Both Federal and Winchester make 1 3/8 oz. 3 inch steel, or did the last time I bought some. I really have had great luck with that load in BBs.<p>Duck hunting is kind of like big game shooting, with all the trouble and sometimes, expense, that you go to to get to a good duck spot, then it is kind of silly IMO to use less than the best shells unless you know that you are going to be wrapped up in ducks, such as in Saskatchewan on a good spot. After all, if you shoot 25 shells at $10 a box and get a limit, then if you used the most expensive current alternative, which is hevi-shot, you will likely use less shells but 25 would cost about $35 to $40, and there is night and day difference in performance. Not to mention about 30 yards or so. At any rate, you need to find another sporting good store at those prices for 3 inch 1 1/4 oz loads.

I don't get to hunt waterfowl very often, once every five or six years. When I have gone in the past I let my guide buy my shells for me. I am fairly competent with upland birds, turkey and skeet shooting. I know what I like in lead shot shells but I am not knowledgable when it comes to steel. I will be going on a duck and goose hunt soon. My host has a huntng club, we will be hunting over decoys from a blind. I expect closer shots than I usually get pass shooting or hunting the large rice fields.<p>I've been told that a lot of hunters like # 1 steel for large ducks and geese over the blocks. ??? I don't have enough experience to know what works best and what doesn't.<p>I have two shot guns I might take. A Remington 870 Express, 3 inch 12 gauge with choke tubes and a Ruger Red Label with 3 inch chamber, 26 inch barells choked Improved cyl. and Mod. I think I will take the 870. Last time I used the Ruger in the rice fields it beat my shoulder into hamburger. I shoot 2 oz. loads in the 870 for turkey and though I would not want to take that much recoil in a duck blind, the 870 is not as hard on me as the Ruger is with heavy loads.<p>What loads would you use in my situation? I saw the recomendation for 1 3/8 oz 3 inch loads. Is the # 1 shot the way to go here? What velocity do I want for these shells? 1200 fps, 1300? what seams to be the magic number? I don't know if I can stand 35 to 40 dollars per box of shells. What are those things loaded with, gold?

PD shooter:<p>You sound like a good shotgun shot who just needs a little tuning (spelled practice) to be great.<p>If the only shooting you are going to do is decoying ducks with your 870, I would load 3s for the first shot in your 870 and back it with 1s or BBs. If money is tight, the 1 1/4s are perfectly adequate for decoying ducks as long as you don't push the ranges. BTW the chokes in your Ruger are fine for steel and decoying ducks, and if you are wearing the usual colder weather gear, felt recoil will be minimal. I like O/Us for the instant choke selection, but you can't go wrong with an 870 either. I would pattern it with your choice of steel and see if mod or IC works best. For straight decoying ducks with steel I would probably use IC, although that is a close call. I am just not too fond of modified chokes, which is a personal preference. I like either more open or tighter. I usually shoot almost everything with IC and Improved Modified, unless there is some strong reason for choosing another choke set up.<p>If you are going to possibly have geese in the mix I would go with 1s and BBs. I know it is a pain to have 2 different shot sizes, easiest way to handle it is to buy 2 brands(different colors) so you can identify them at a glance. And keep them in different pockets.<p>If I was in your shoes, I might buy 1 1/4 3s for the first shot and 3 inch 1 3/8 oz 1s or BBs(depending on whether geese are in the mix)for the back ups.<p>Hevi-shot is undoubtedly expensive, roughly $15-18 for 10 shells but it can be reloaded for about the price of factory steel. It is a tungsten, nickel, iron, shot that is 11% heavier than LEAD, and patterns much tighter. There is still a steep learning curve going on with it, but it appears that you may be able to successfully use one size smaller shot than with lead and get superior results. Smaller shot obviously equals more pellets in the pattern. Thanks to my procrastination in reloading, normal for me, I only had about 25 shells in Canada this year, but the performance was impressive. A load of 4s absolutely crushed a couple of Greater Canadas at about 50 yards. And for 4s that is the best I have ever seen at that range. Ducks over decoys or on the edges looked like they were hammered. Of course, some of those reloads were faulty, they had some misses in them, too. But, it is the new paradigm, a much misused word, in shotgun shooting. Hopefully, with bigger sales volumes the price may come down a little. Check out their site www.hevishot.com Or for reloading it, or almost anything else in the shotgunning area, www.ballisticproducts.com

Steel 3" #2's will work if you have patterned your gun and know which load choke combination works best for your hunting conditions.<p>The advice about Heavi-shot or Federal Tungsten Matrix or Bismuth is good advice. My daughter shoots a 20 ga. with 1 1/4 ounce #4 Heavi-shot on decoyed ducks. The 20 ga., with this load, is on par with 3" 1 1/4 oz #2 Steel. One cripple, ~45 yards out was cleanly dispatched with one Hevi-shot round.

Guys, thanks for the input. I left out a critical fact, I'm handicaped by a 2 3/4" chamber.<p>Here's the end result. I was at Sportmans Warehouse, and they have stacks of shells on the flore (Can You say GOOD SELECTION). And the salesman saw me. I was carrying a box of shells, comparing price, load (OZ's) and fps. and etc. He comes up and talks me into Kent Faststeel, 1 1/16 OZ of #2's at 1550 fps. I noticed a definite dif in kick between my old un's when I patterned them. I also patterned my old 1375fps Remington #3's and I thought that the pattern was better. <p>The salesman claims that they are what his son uses and is able to take Geese w/em. Prior to that, I was leaning towards 1 1/4OZ of #2.<p>Since then, I've only had 3 possibilities for shots and I got 2 birds and I feel that the 1st one that I was the culpret/blame. And each time they fell what I call "Lights out" Just as if somebody flicked the light switch and the power instantly goes off. So, so far so good. Also, I noticed a big dif. in pellet penetration/perfomrance when it came to clean the birds.

The answer is: 2 3/4" 12 ga. #4 Heavi Shot, or #6's if prefer a bit more pattern density.

Tried some Kent Faststeel 3" number 3 shot the last day of season here in Maine. Both my son and I had some great shooting with this load. Ducks came down dead.
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<br>I'll be ordering another case from ballisticproducts before next season. With shipping works out to about 13 bucks a box. Best steel loads I've tried.

Here's my combo. 2 & 3/4", 1-1/8 oz. steel, 1450 fps, #4 for ducks, #2 for geese, both over decoys, range 10-25 yds typically. I have used these shells with best success in a Light A-5 with open cylinder barrel (my skeet gun). The birds just crumple when hit. I'll get half a dozen or so hits through the body, and I mean completely through the body. Rarely do I find pellets. I've even cleanly taken Canadas with #4 when they've surprised me and come in. Granted, these are optimum conditions, but they may apply to you. If that's the case, you don't need 3 & 1/2" of BBB to take a duck.
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<br>Good luck.
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<br>grouseman
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I know this much and you can through away all the BS talk about steel shot, as I am concerned. We have used it in 4 guns with various loadings of shot size and patterned them at various yardages. I have bought several cases of KENT STEEL SHOT in the past several seasons. If you want to do some serious duck hunting on a trip that is costing you dollars with a guide, I would invest in the Heavi Shot for your ducks. It penetrates at least 50% further into ducks. Now that is using the same size shot and velocity of course. It may cost more but I don't lose ducks from lack of killing penetration. It also increases my distance of kill zone yardage wise.