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#17504370 08/11/22
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is the brass from Norma 223 match ammunition that same quality as brass sold for reloading

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It seems to be very consistent yes, but it's not the same production line of brass. I've both the 'reloading' brass and the match ammo with staked in primers. The ammo brass I have is heavier than the stuff sold for reloading. I'm guessing that it's mil-spec brass so it can't be used interchangeably. It does shoot though. Here's a sample from a gasser that I built and was sighting in at 100 yards:

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]


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Originally Posted by Ben_Lurkin
It seems to be very consistent yes, but it's not the same production line of brass. I've both the 'reloading' brass and the match ammo with staked in primers. The ammo brass I have is heavier than the stuff sold for reloading. I'm guessing that it's mil-spec brass so it can't be used interchangeably. It does shoot though. Here's a sample from a gasser that I built and was sighting in at 100 yards:

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]


when you say staked in do you mean it looked like they used a chisel to make 3 cuts in the primer pockets? this brass I have just looks like a standard military crimp, I got a 5 gallon bucket of this brass but if it's no better than Lake city then I'll just sell it

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Here’s what mine looks like:

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

Empties weigh 104 +/- 0.5 grain including spent primer. TAC 223 ammo.

Drop me a PM if you decide you want to sell that bucket.

Last edited by Ben_Lurkin; 08/11/22.

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the brass I have has a different head stamp. it has Norma 5.56x45. PM me your cell number I'll send you a picture. just got done removing the crimp on the primer pockets and they did have the same crimp as yours in the pucture. there crimp was like you would see on lake city brass

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Originally Posted by Ben_Lurkin
It seems to be very consistent yes, but it's not the same production line of brass. I've both the 'reloading' brass and the match ammo with staked in primers. The ammo brass I have is heavier than the stuff sold for reloading. I'm guessing that it's mil-spec brass so it can't be used interchangeably. It does shoot though. Here's a sample from a gasser that I built and was sighting in at 100 yards:

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

Why does everybody always miss the dime???


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Originally Posted by Seafire
Originally Posted by Ben_Lurkin
It seems to be very consistent yes, but it's not the same production line of brass. I've both the 'reloading' brass and the match ammo with staked in primers. The ammo brass I have is heavier than the stuff sold for reloading. I'm guessing that it's mil-spec brass so it can't be used interchangeably. It does shoot though. Here's a sample from a gasser that I built and was sighting in at 100 yards:

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

Why does everybody always miss the dime???


You know, the usual answer. "Well, I didn't want to hit exactly where I'm aiming because then my aiming point will disappear"...That sort of thing. I mean horse schidt..
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

What I'm wondering is why they stake the primers in like that...


Originally Posted by raybass
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style.
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole.

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Originally Posted by Seafire
Originally Posted by Ben_Lurkin
It seems to be very consistent yes, but it's not the same production line of brass. I've both the 'reloading' brass and the match ammo with staked in primers. The ammo brass I have is heavier than the stuff sold for reloading. I'm guessing that it's mil-spec brass so it can't be used interchangeably. It does shoot though. Here's a sample from a gasser that I built and was sighting in at 100 yards:

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

Why does everybody always miss the dime???
It's the glare from the dime that causes it.


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Originally Posted by bsa1917hunter
You know, the usual answer. "Well, I didn't want to hit exactly where I'm aiming because then my aiming point will disappear"...That sort of thing. I mean horse schidt.

Suppose I'm testing loads for a 30 cal rifle topped with a 16x scope with a fine reticle using a 1/4" dot target. Will the aiming point not degrade as 1/3" holes start falling on and around it?

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Originally Posted by mathman
Originally Posted by bsa1917hunter
You know, the usual answer. "Well, I didn't want to hit exactly where I'm aiming because then my aiming point will disappear"...That sort of thing. I mean horse schidt.

Suppose I'm testing loads for a 30 cal rifle topped with a 16x scope with a fine reticle using a 1/4" dot target. Will the aiming point not degrade as 1/3" holes start falling on and around it?

Yes mathman. The aiming point will degrade. It does make sense, but usually when guys give this excuse they are 6" to the left and 3" high sort of thing. It is nice to keep your aiming point in tact, for sure... I've screwed myself before and the group has opened up because of this degradation....
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

I like aiming for the small 1/4" diamond on the orange, not just the orang dot. Now, I screwed up the other day when I dialed in my scope with a new barrel on one of my AR's. I shot a nice 10 shot group to the left edge of the orange dot to maintain the aiming point, then when shooting at 400, I was off 1/2 moa. Just something to be aware of:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]


Now where's that shot going to be if you are 6" to the left and 3" high at 100 yards?


Originally Posted by raybass
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style.
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole.

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Yeah, I don't test them "way over there" either.

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Geez the dime is there to cover the flyers.


[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]



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Originally Posted by bsa1917hunter
Originally Posted by mathman
Originally Posted by bsa1917hunter
You know, the usual answer. "Well, I didn't want to hit exactly where I'm aiming because then my aiming point will disappear"...That sort of thing. I mean horse schidt.

Suppose I'm testing loads for a 30 cal rifle topped with a 16x scope with a fine reticle using a 1/4" dot target. Will the aiming point not degrade as 1/3" holes start falling on and around it?

Yes mathman. The aiming point will degrade. It does make sense, but usually when guys give this excuse they are 6" to the left and 3" high sort of thing. It is nice to keep your aiming point in tact, for sure... I've screwed myself before and the group has opened up because of this degradation....
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

I like aiming for the small 1/4" diamond on the orange, not just the orang dot. Now, I screwed up the other day when I dialed in my scope with a new barrel on one of my AR's. I shot a nice 10 shot group to the left edge of the orange dot to maintain the aiming point, then when shooting at 400, I was off 1/2 moa. Just something to be aware of:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]


Now where's that shot going to be if you are 6" to the left and 3" high at 100 yards?

Idaho....and in the dirt....


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Originally Posted by rickt300
Geez the dime is there to cover the flyers.

LOL. Vadered


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I like the “Official” benchrest targets with the open squares and also an open bullseye with rings. Since my hunting rifles are generally sighted a bit high, the aiming point stays pristine. I find the squares work best for my eyes, easy to center on.

Last edited by Pappy348; 08/14/22.

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When experimenting during the search for "best load", I don't give a rat's patoot where the groups fall. After final selection of the best load recipe then I'll finagle the sights/scope to the POI I want.


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Regarding Norma cartridges with staked primers, was/is that stuff made for military contracts or simply as a sop to AR-15 usage? Has Norma ever supplied domestic or NATO military needs? Dunno, never thought about it.


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Originally Posted by gnoahhh
Regarding Norma cartridges with staked primers, was/is that stuff made for military contracts or simply as a sop to AR-15 usage? Has Norma ever supplied domestic or NATO military needs? Dunno, never thought about it.


They are kind of weird. I was wondering the same thing. I'm also wondering if the staked in primers are hard to pop out of the case? The staking looks like it would be easier to deal with than a full crimp. Interesting approach by Norma.


Originally Posted by raybass
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style.
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole.

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Nothing unusual about those crimps, although I think point-crimping like that tends to be more Euro than American practice. But they should deprime just peachy and chamfer out nice. Whoever ends up with those cases will almost certainly enjoy them a long time.


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All Norma cases are terrible junk. Save you life and send them to me so I can add them to the 1000s I have to keep them out of the hands of the innocent.


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