24hourcampfire.com
24hourcampfire.com
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 2 of 3 1 2 3
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 17,491
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 17,491
We keep a 45 Colt M94 Trapper at our remote camp, handy bear gun....mostly just to scare them off, but one needed a couple finishers after a 12 gauge Brenneke broke him down. The 12 slug was stopped; the Colt 300s weren't. One winter a caribou was a meat opportunity along the trail so I zipped back for the carbine. The shot, around 200 yards (with some good elevation), struck a shovel, drilled the shoulder and exited in front of the hip opposite. That bull was pushing 400 pounds. They're adequate tools.


Sometimes, the air you 'let in'matters less than the air you 'let out'.
BP-B2

Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 3,721
R
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
R
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 3,721
Neighbor uses a Winchester 45 lever
for his deer and hogs with no problems.
I've had 44 mags so I can't really comment
on personal 45 use

Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 1,313
W
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
W
Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 1,313
A bunch of years ago I have a Win 94 in 45 LC. If you are looking for a hunting carbine, go with a 44 mag. I know guys here hunt with .357 and .45 LC but the 44 mag gives you that extra ballistic edge.

Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,709
Campfire Outfitter
Online Content
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,709
Is the ballistic edge u speak of for factory ammo or reloaders as well?

Or are 44 mags stronger?

Thanks


"Shoot low sheriff, I think he's riding a shetland!" B. Wills












Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 9,189
H
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
H
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 9,189
Originally Posted by Angus1895
Is the ballistic edge u speak of for factory ammo or reloaders as well?

Or are 44 mags stronger?

Thanks
In the same platform, like an 1894 Marlin, the 357 is by far the strongest, with the 44 Mag being stronger than the 45 Colt, just due to differences in steel in the chamber and differences in bolt thrust. But if we're looking at safety margins, I don't think it matters, as long as 44 Mag pressures aren't exceeded in a 45 Colt rifle.


I belong on eroding granite, among the pines.
IC B2

Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,308
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,308
Just picked up my Rossi 45 Colt from my FFL. Real nasty weather here or I would have taken it out. It feeds cast bullet loads well. If it didn't I would not have liked it.


I prefer classic.
Semper Fi
I used to run with the hare. Now I'm envious of the tortoise and I do my own stunts but rarely intentionally
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 686
M
Campfire Regular
OP Offline
Campfire Regular
M
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 686
I appreciate all of the comments and insight on 357 and 44 mag. It’s good hearing first hand real world experience on those calibers. For me, personally, I’m looking for a companion rifle to my Ruger new model Blackhawk in 45 colt. But I would also love to add a couple more Lever guns down the road and 357 would be a nice addition to my other revolver.

Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 9,189
H
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
H
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 9,189
Originally Posted by MosesTucker
I appreciate all of the comments and insight on 357 and 44 mag. It’s good hearing first hand real world experience on those calibers. For me, personally, I’m looking for a companion rifle to my Ruger new model Blackhawk in 45 colt. But I would also love to add a couple more Lever guns down the road and 357 would be a nice addition to my other revolver.
Thr 357 in a rifle is a different animal than out of a revolver. You'll see impressive velocity increases, on the order of 35-40% with the slowest-burning powders. And for rifle-only, "+P" loads, the differences get drastic. It's easy to get 158's to 2000 fps out of a 20" bbl with Lil Gun, and 180's to 1750 fps. Easy. That's not a pop gun, and it shoots flatter than any 44 or 45 Colt lever gun load.


I belong on eroding granite, among the pines.
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 686
M
Campfire Regular
OP Offline
Campfire Regular
M
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 686
Originally Posted by HuntnShoot
Originally Posted by MosesTucker
I appreciate all of the comments and insight on 357 and 44 mag. It’s good hearing first hand real world experience on those calibers. For me, personally, I’m looking for a companion rifle to my Ruger new model Blackhawk in 45 colt. But I would also love to add a couple more Lever guns down the road and 357 would be a nice addition to my other revolver.
Thr 357 in a rifle is a different animal than out of a revolver. You'll see impressive velocity increases, on the order of 35-40% with the slowest-burning powders. And for rifle-only, "+P" loads, the differences get drastic. It's easy to get 158's to 2000 fps out of a 20" bbl with Lil Gun, and 180's to 1750 fps. Easy. That's not a pop gun, and it shoots flatter than any 44 or 45 Colt lever gun load.

I had no idea. Have never given this any thought. But now I am super interested. I would LOVE to pick one up. Likely to be next on my list. Prefer Marlin/Winchester/Rossi… or something else? Henry a good option?

Thanks for sharing.

Last edited by MosesTucker; 12/13/22.
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 9,189
H
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
H
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 9,189
Originally Posted by MosesTucker
Originally Posted by HuntnShoot
Originally Posted by MosesTucker
I appreciate all of the comments and insight on 357 and 44 mag. It’s good hearing first hand real world experience on those calibers. For me, personally, I’m looking for a companion rifle to my Ruger new model Blackhawk in 45 colt. But I would also love to add a couple more Lever guns down the road and 357 would be a nice addition to my other revolver.
Thr 357 in a rifle is a different animal than out of a revolver. You'll see impressive velocity increases, on the order of 35-40% with the slowest-burning powders. And for rifle-only, "+P" loads, the differences get drastic. It's easy to get 158's to 2000 fps out of a 20" bbl with Lil Gun, and 180's to 1750 fps. Easy. That's not a pop gun, and it shoots flatter than any 44 or 45 Colt lever gun load.

I had no idea. Have never given this any thought. But now I am super interested. I would LOVE to pick one up. Likely to be next on my list. Prefer Marlin/Winchester/Rossi… or something else? Henry a good option?

Thanks for sharing.
I've only shot the Marlins, so I can't recommend a rifle maker. They have their drawbacks, but I've gotten repeatable 3-shot MOA groups with several bullets at the top end in the 44 Mag, and have gotten repeatable 5-shot MOA groups with several 158-180gr bullets in the 357. The Hornady 180 XTP with Lil Gun at 1750 is my favorite jacketed load. It is sub MOA for five repeatedly.

Should also add that modifying the feed ramp on the 44 Marlins to allow for OAL to 1.78" was easy, as the geometry of the case feed allows for it to function, even with short 44 Special stuff. Changing the feed ramp on the 357 is a lot more complicated. I haven't dared to do it. I suspect that changing the feed ramp on the 45 Colt would be doable, if desired.

Just food for thought, but I load a cast 285gr HP in the 44 Marlin with 22 gr 296 at 1.77" and get nearly 1700 fps. I modified the rifle for that bullet at that seating depth. It is MOA for 3, over and over. I've head-shot a cow elk, several deer, and this year, a big tom with that load. Not sure why I keep head-shooting critters with it, other than I have utter confidence in it out to 140 yards.


I belong on eroding granite, among the pines.
IC B3

Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,709
Campfire Outfitter
Online Content
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 7,709
I am ignorant about these issues.

Thanks

My 45 LC didn’t handle my factory made 45 P ammo. The lever stuck.

But with Mackey sagebrush loads it shoots way better than expected.

Will the 44 mag JM 1894 handle 44 mag P loads?


"Shoot low sheriff, I think he's riding a shetland!" B. Wills












Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,390
T
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
T
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,390
My JM 1894P has handled every hot load I've put through it, though at least in my rifle I could never get the 300 grainers to fly straight. In the process of having a 1:18 twist barrel put on it. It's my favorite levergun. Very light with that big hole in the barrel.

I like my 1894 in 357 as well but going from memory it wasn't all that much faster with factory-loaded 158's than the 44 was with factory loaded 240's. The 44 mag is also lighter.

They're both great.

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,822
D
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
D
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,822
My 45 Colt Marlin Cowboy with scope likes 300 gr. jacketed or cast over max dose of 4227. Tough on 'dillers and such.

I've not killed a WT, but it would do the job.

DF

Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 9,189
H
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
H
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 9,189
Originally Posted by Angus1895
I am ignorant about these issues.

Thanks

My 45 LC didn’t handle my factory made 45 P ammo. The lever stuck.

But with Mackey sagebrush loads it shoots way better than expected.

Will the 44 mag JM 1894 handle 44 mag P loads?
I am drawing a blank as to what P loads are. The Marlin in 44 cycled everything I ran through it without a hitch before I modified the feed ramp. It still cycles everything now, including longer-than-standard loads. I spent a lot of time figuring out the angle of feed before I modified, and there are no issues with long-nosed SWC, either, even in 44 Special brass, though the shorter cases cut a close corner.


I belong on eroding granite, among the pines.
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,964
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,964
I had a Marlin 1894 loaded with the 250 grain Speer Deep Curl. Was using Lil Gun and getting 1,800 fps. The recoil was a bit tough. I finally settled on the 240 gr Hornady at 1,700 fps. These are rifle loads, so I wouldn't use the full power loads out of a older single action handgun.

This evening I took a large doe at 100 yards with a Henry All Weather in .45 Colt. I'm using the 225 gr Barnes XPB at 1,620 fps.

Was hoping to drill the shoulders, but she was at a slight angle and double lunged her. Missed the shoulder, she dashed for 45-50 yards into a swamp. Good blood trail with a 1 1/2" hole through both sides of the rib cage. No blood shot meat at all.



Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,198
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 8,198
I'm a big fan of the .357 in a rifle. I've got a 1894 and Ruger 77 SS that are my favorite rifles to carry (beside my Montana 7-08).

Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 686
M
Campfire Regular
OP Offline
Campfire Regular
M
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 686
Originally Posted by Teeder
I'm a big fan of the .357 in a rifle. I've got a 1894 and Ruger 77 SS that are my favorite rifles to carry (beside my Montana 7-08).

That stainless M77 is a favorite. I don’t have one but handled one in the LGS a couple years back. I’d love to get my hands on one. Seems a good option for gun hunting in Ohio as a whitetail setup. I do a trio up there every year during archery but I’ve always wanted to get up there for rifle. But a straight wall cartridge is what I’d need. A 357 might be ideal.

Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 9,189
H
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
H
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 9,189
The lever gun I'd love to have would be a 357 Maximum on an 1895 Marlin, throated long to allow long seating of heavies, with the action appropriately lightened without giving up necessary strength. I've an NOE mold which casts a 35 cal LFN at 230-235 grains. Would love to carry a lever gun which could push those to 2k.


I belong on eroding granite, among the pines.
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,334
D
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
D
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,334
Originally Posted by HuntnShoot
The lever gun I'd love to have would be a 357 Maximum on an 1895 Marlin, throated long to allow long seating of heavies, with the action appropriately lightened without giving up necessary strength. I've an NOE mold which casts a 35 cal LFN at 230-235 grains. Would love to carry a lever gun which could push those to 2k.

I think it would be less work on a 336 than a 1895. I have an old, deceased, friend who started with a 336 in 30-30. He replaced the barrel with a 1894 357 Magnum barrel that was rechambered to 357 Max. He was in the middle of tweaking the internal parts when he passed away. Years ago I shot it as a single shot and it was fun! I recall him saying that if he would have had the throat lengthened then he have loaded heavier (longer) cast bullet and the cartridge would have balanced better on the carrier.


Medics bury their mistakes..
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,334
D
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
D
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,334
I shoot a Henry X rifle and a Ruger Blackhawk both in 45 Colt. They both really like the 250gr Hornady XTP pushed fast with H110. I still haven't killed a deer with either one but I'm confident they will work just fine.


Medics bury their mistakes..
Page 2 of 3 1 2 3

Moderated by  RickBin 

Link Copied to Clipboard
YB23

Who's Online Now
641 members (1234, 257 roberts, 1lessdog, 2500HD, 257Bob, 74 invisible), 2,759 guests, and 1,300 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums81
Topics1,187,648
Posts18,399,130
Members73,817
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023


 







Fish & Game Departments | Solunar Tables | Mission Statement | Privacy Policy | Contact Us | DMCA
Hunting | Fishing | Camping | Backpacking | Reloading | Campfire Forums | Gear Shop
Copyright © 2000-2024 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.3.33 Page Time: 0.077s Queries: 15 (0.005s) Memory: 0.9030 MB (Peak: 1.0591 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2024-03-28 18:19:28 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS